Upon the passing of an expat's VN spouse...?

What rights or options exist, if any, which would permit the continued residence of the foreigner in Vietnam upon the death of his or her lawfully wed Vietnamese spouse?
Under our sticky thread Vietnamese Family Law Act, we have ...

Section 2. MARRIAGE TERMINATED AS A SPOUSE IS DEAD OR DECLARED TO BE DEAD BY COURT
Article 65. Time of termination of marriage
A marriage is terminated from the time of death of a spouse.
In case a court declares a spouse to be dead, the time of termination of the marriage is the date of death stated in the court’s judgment or decision.
-@Aidan in HCMC

Probably helps at that point to consider the term "sponsor", and ask, what happens when your (VEC/TRC) sponsor dies?

I'm guessing that immigration has rule(s) about that.

One might think the rules would be different from having a living spouse cancel the sponsorship.

Is it true that, after spending 10 or 15 years (or more) married to a VN, and after investing in property and other necessities of life, that upon the death of your VN spouse you find yourself in the same position as any other foreigner wishing to be granted permission to reside in/enter VN?

Is it known whether there is consideration afforded to foreigners who may find themselves in this unfortunate situation? If not, then not only must you deal with the grief of losing your spouse, you must also now negotiate the continuance of your long-term stay here.

That would be rough.

Agree with the Family Law.

When your sponsor divorced/passed away, the VEC/TRC may use until it expires (hope nobody is going to cancel like WP/TRC).

If you have kids in that wedlock and if they are majors, one of them can be your 'sponsor'. In that way an expatriate who married to a local can live here.

When a local spouse die, family property (if any) will be with you and other successors, but law is not mentioning about your legal stay or allowing a VEC/TRC in such case if you have no major kids in that wedlock!

Prevention is better than cure in these circumstances - just don't invest all your money in a foreign country which doesn't offer a permanent residence status or citizenship for investors!

The question from the OP is something I have been asking myself too in respect to make an investment. It would improve my living circumstances massively. We called a lawyer in Nha Trang (we are on holiday here) but was told to contact another one up North where we normally reside. So we did, but after one month, we still wait for an answer. I also read up laws and amendments but nowhere did I see this discussed. What OceanBeach92107 said, is what I was thinking as well.

Before our holiday, my Vietnamese wife went to an office in Hanoi (internal affairs if I am correct) for a stamp where she asked the officer on duty. He said that her daughter could sponsor me under the aforementioned circumstances. I am not certain if the officer understood or knew from data that I not fathered the child. As it happens she was 20 years when we married last September and became major a month later. My question is: as a stepdaughter does she qualify to sponsor me so I can live out the rest of my days here if my wife passes away before me?

The question from the OP is something I have been asking myself too in respect to make an investment. It would improve my living circumstances massively. We called a lawyer in Nha Trang (we are on holiday here) but was told to contact another one up North where we normally reside. So we did, but after one month, we still wait for an answer. I also read up laws and amendments but nowhere did I see this discussed. What OceanBeach92107 said, is what I was thinking as well.
Before our holiday, my Vietnamese wife went to an office in Hanoi (internal affairs if I am correct) for a stamp where she asked the officer on duty. He said that her daughter could sponsor me under the aforementioned circumstances. I am not certain if the officer understood or knew from data that I not fathered the child. As it happens she was 20 years when we married last September and became major a month later. My question is: as a stepdaughter does she qualify to sponsor me so I can live out the rest of my days here if my wife passes away before me?
-@Kiteflyer

Hello Kiteflyer, and welcome to expat.com! Thank you for your first post.

From the gov't of VN's "Sponsor-Inviting" page, select the first tile, titled

"Thân nhân trong nước bảo lãnh"(translate)Guaranteed by relatives in the country(Both links are to gov't VN webpages)

Google translate;(Link)

• Vietnamese citizens permanently residing in the country may sponsor their grandfather, grandmother, father, mother of husband or wife; wife, husband, children, brothers and sisters are foreigners who come to Vietnam to visit.

No mention of "step" status relationships, though as a step-father the culture/authorities would probably consider this to be par with being the biological father. Was your step-daughter officially adopted, then registered/recognized by VN authorities? If not, my thought on this is that no, your adult step-daughter would not qualify as a sponsor (I hope I'm wrong). If she were a minor, entirely dependent upon you for the necessities of life, then I've read that consideration would be given in such a situation.

I'd love to hear more on this subject from you or other members as your investigations proceed. It is a scenario, sadly, which must be considered.

My question is: as a stepdaughter does she qualify to sponsor me so I can live out the rest of my days here if my wife passes away before me?
-@Kiteflyer

That's a BIG NO!!

If you are married legally, wife/husband or children from that wedlock only can be a sponsor!

And the sponsor child must attain the majority of age!

That's a BIG NO!!

Would it still be a "...BIG NO!!" if the child was legally adopted? We've yet to hear back from Kiteflyer on that.

If you are married legally, wife/husband or children from that wedlock only can be a sponsor!

Not so. See my post, above.

Vietnamese citizens permanently residing in the country may sponsor their grandfather, grandmother, father, mother of husband or wife; wife, husband, children, brothers and sisters are foreigners who come to Vietnam to visit.

And the sponsor child must attain the majority of age!
-@charmavietnam

The step-daughter is over 20 years old, as stated by Kiteflyer.

You seem quite adamant about this (having ended each of your three sentences with exclamation marks).

Are you able to provide links for these assertions, please? This is a subject deserving of further research.

@Aidan in HCMC:  When we married I did not think this could be a scenario to be considered with so did not seek official guardianship for my "stepdaughter".  In my ignorance I assumed I would more or less get it automatically. She has been calling me dad since she was 8 years old. Now that she is an adult, she still calls me that.

After we got the marriage certificate we were actually too busy getting my 30 day tourist visa transferred to a 1 year TT visa. That alone kept us busy day and night because we were first told that it was not possible. We got it 2 days before the end date of the visa.

When we had to go to the immigration department in Hanoi I sat next to a gentleman who showed me a picture of his wife taken a week earlier. She was lying on the road covered with a bamboo mat, her serene face visible. It haunts me till this day. Unfortunately he had overstayed his visa and now had to get permission to leave the country which he wanted anyway.

From what I now understand the term stepchild is not commonly used in Vietnam. Either one adopts a child or there is no legal connection with the new partner of the parent and sponsorship is out of the question. Thanks @charmainvietnam for clarifying this. However, I am still seeking help to learn everything there is to know about the subject.

This could come in the form of the son of a close relative's business partner. He has a high position at the judicial department of the government in Hanoi and already his mother has discussed our case with him on the phone. Apparently he said there are options to stay in the country after one's spouse passes away. However, due to the complexity of the matter he would like to speak to us in person.

We will head up North again at the end of month and hopefully learn more. I'll keep you posted. Thanks for your patience.

@Kiteflyer

Thank you, Kiteflyer, for writing back.

Any information you become aware of and choose to share with us related to this subject is greatly appreciated. I very much look forward to hearing more on your progress.

It is so very easy to push a subject like this to the side, distracted as we are with life's daily joys and burdens.

I've mentioned before that it would do us all well to keep in mind, memento mori

Finally, we got hold of the person working at the government office in Hanoi where all visa and residence applications from other localities are processed. I haven't spoken to him personally since he is not familiar with English language, but my wife has talked to him on the phone a few times.

A TRC will indeed expire, when a Vietnamese spouse passes away before the foreign husband (and vice versa of course). Stepchildren who are no minors, cannot sponsor their step-parent.

Our contact said that a Permanent Residence Card is the way to go. Because I told me wife beforehand, she asked why not many foreigners are in the possession of this document. He said that local authorities are often reluctant to accept the application because they are not always familiar with the implementation of this particular section of the law.

From what I understood, the process is straight forward for people who are married to a Vietnamese person residing in the country. I just had a brief look at the documentation and I don't see any major hurdles.

A condition which could prove difficult (depending on your nationality), is a letter from the embassy or consulate of your country requesting the state of Vietnam for permanent residence for the applicant.

Presently I am in Europe and are returning at the end of the year. Hopefully, the Vietnamese embassy here will issue me a TRC (during my last visit there they said they can provide this document). Once back in Vietnam I will start the PRC application. It will take 4 months at most.

Finally, we got hold of the person working at the government office in Hanoi where all visa and residence applications from other localities are processed. I haven't spoken to him personally since he is not familiar with English language, but my wife has talked to him on the phone a few times.
A TRC will indeed expire, when a Vietnamese spouse passes away before the foreign husband (and vice versa of course). Stepchildren who are no minors, cannot sponsor their step-parent.

Our contact said that a Permanent Residence Card is the way to go. Because I told me wife beforehand, she asked why not many foreigners are in the possession of this document. He said that local authorities are often reluctant to accept the application because they are not always familiar with the implementation of this particular section of the law.

From what I understood, the process is straight forward for people who are married to a Vietnamese person residing in the country. I just had a brief look at the documentation and I don't see any major hurdles.
A condition which could prove difficult (depending on your nationality), is a letter from the embassy or consulate of your country requesting the state of Vietnam for permanent residence for the applicant.

Presently I am in Europe and are returning at the end of the year. Hopefully, the Vietnamese embassy here will issue me a TRC (during my last visit there they said they can provide this document). Once back in Vietnam I will start the PRC application. It will take 4 months at most.
-@Kiteflyer

Thank you for your report, Kiteflyer. Very much appreciated.

Does this VN gov't page, PROCEDURES FOR PERMANENT RESIDENCE CARDS TO FOREIGNERS IN VIETNAM , align with the conditions which you were told?

I commend you on your being proactive in this matter. If one's spouse is the intended sponsor, then this is something which must be addressed/pursued while the VN spouse is alive.

Good luck with this, and hope to hear more on your progress.

Does this VN gov't page, PROCEDURES FOR PERMANENT RESIDENCE CARDS TO FOREIGNERS IN VIETNAM , align with the conditions which you were told?

Yes, it does. I was given a copy of law no. 47/2014/QH13 and it stipulates the same conditions/instructions.I noticed there have been a few amendments. Presumably, they do not concern the PRC procedure. I assume he would have given those as well if there had been any changes.

Thank you for the confirmation.

Regarding your comment ...

...Our contact said that a Permanent Residence Card is the way to go. Because I told me wife beforehand, she asked why not many foreigners are in the possession of this document. He said that local authorities are often reluctant to accept the application because they are not always familiar with the implementation of this particular section of the law...
-@Kiteflyer

This is admittedly off-topic, but might the reason that not many foreigners possess a PRC be that the "Permanent Residency Card" is possibly irrevocable? I know, personally, of two foreigner-VN marriages where the foreigners have been threatened by their spouse with the revocation of their TRC if they don't "toe the line" as it were. Oh dear.

I know, personally, of two foreigner-VN marriages where the foreigners have been threatened by their spouse with the revocation of their TRC if they don't "toe the line" as it were. Oh dear.

Haha, some spouses might be content with a TRC indeed!

I know, personally, of two foreigner-VN marriages where the foreigners have been threatened by their spouse with the revocation of their TRC if they don't "toe the line" as it were. Oh dear.


Haha, some spouses might be content with a TRC indeed!
-@Kiteflyer

LOL! I can see the line forming as of Monday morning with applicants for PRCs.

"THEY'RE AT THE GATE...

ding-a-ling-a-ling-a-ling...

Aaaaand... they're off!"

...Presently I am in Europe and are returning at the end of the year. Hopefully, the Vietnamese embassy here will issue me a TRC (during my last visit there they said they can provide this document). Once back in Vietnam I will start the PRC application. It will take 4 months at most.
       -@Kiteflyer

Any progress to report, Kiteflyer?

There's more than a few members rootin' for 'ya!

    ...Presently I am in Europe and are returning at the end of the year. Hopefully, the Vietnamese embassy here will issue me a TRC (during my last visit there they said they can provide this document). Once back in Vietnam I will start the PRC application. It will take 4 months at most.       -@Kiteflyer

Any progress to report, Kiteflyer?
There's more than a few members rootin' for 'ya!
-@Aidan in HCMC

.....Well, I just got more info last week but have been too busy to share with you all. The required documentation of staying three years in the country prior to the application for a PRC was giving me headaches.

I have been in VN on and off in the last fourteen years. However, never was I in the possession of a TRC. As most of you know, without having a job here, a 'business' visa offered by creative agents was the way to go before the pandemic. Especially the ones produced in Phnom Penh. In the end though, it backfired on me. I was deported but thankfully by intervention of connections of my then GF, not blacklisted.

When a 'solution' for documented proof of stay (for the TRC) was suggested, I decided not to continue with the application. For my peace of mind, I now find it better to play by the rules (law). So first, I'll get a TRC and then apply for the PRC. Three years isn't the end of the world.

I would like to ask if "PRC" is really "permanent" while is linked to you passport. Also I have read that book (PRC is similar design as Working Permit) must be replaced every 3 years.

If you renew the passport does it means to put the signature of your sponsor in the new request?

    I would like to ask if "PRC" is really "permanent" while is linked to you passport.

My understanding is that it is a certificate, issued to an individual (not to a passport) in the form of a laminated identification card.

Also I have read that book (PRC is similar design as Working Permit) must be replaced every 3 years.

Again, just my understanding, but I believe it is valid for 10 years, renewable at one's local immigration depot.

If you renew the passport does it means to put the signature of your sponsor in the new request? -@ajairon

It is not an in-passport visa. Also, once issued, I do believe that renewal is not sponsor dependant.

Would be great to hear from someone who has actually attained a PRC.