Absolutely Anything Else

A few weeks back just for an experiment, I filled out a quizz  from a co, called, Hungarain Helpers. I guess if you are willing to pay enough they can make anyone a HU citizen.
Cost for HU citizenship with all requirements, just for them to file the forms for you is, 1,000 Euro! On their little quizz they ask if you speak Hungarian, if not for something like another 300 Euros they will give you 25 hours worth of Hu lessons, like that knowledge of the language is going to take you far.
1,000 Euros, what a scam!
I know one used to be able to "invest" 300,000 Euros in Hungary for 5 years with interest paid and become a HU citizen, no family required.
Makes me ill, everything is about the bottom line.

SimCityAT wrote:

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

...
There is another Hungarian film on Netflix now. It is in Hungarian with subtitles, Called,"Tall Tales".

There are lots....

If it's on Netflix, it's worth seeing the HU movie "Kontroll" about mysterious goings-on on the Budapest metro system.   

The director went on to bigger things in Hollywood.

Thank God English is a mongrel language, composed of bits & pieces from everywhere (even Hungarian) - there's no official body such as the Academie Francais in France, to preserve the 'purity' of the language - English will happily take on 'foreign' words and make them its own, that's why it has by far the largest vocabulary - most of them have been nicked from other languages - but by far the best thing about English is that it doesn't use umlauts or those other dots or squiggles over letters - how is it that English can get along perfectly well without these annoying (if you've ever had to use a non-english keyboard) additions ? ......

rakfaray wrote:

Thank God English is a mongrel language, composed of bits & pieces from everywhere (even Hungarian) - there's no official body such as the Academie Francais in France, to preserve the 'purity' of the language - English will happily take on 'foreign' words and make them its own, that's why it has by far the largest vocabulary - most of them have been nicked from other languages - but by far the best thing about English is that it doesn't use umlauts or those other dots or squiggles over letters - how is it that English can get along perfectly well without these annoying (if you've ever had to use a non-english keyboard) additions ? ......

That's not entirely true - I am thinking of two words - naïve and the name Zoë - both of which have double dots.  People leave them off as they are difficult to type and people know the pronunciation. I think it works.

I've been hanging around Europe more than half my life so I've had plenty of exposure to weirdness in languages in and in discussions with various work colleagues over language weirdness. 

Most non-native English speakers think it is really strange language because   the pronunciation is often nothing like the spelling.  Just think of tough and bough.  How are non-native speakers to know that kind of thing?  I believe Spanish is about the same with big differences with spoken and written versions.

In German,  it's pretty much how it's written and the umlauts etc all work perfectly once you know how to pronounce them. Same in Hungarian.  The thing that messes up us English speakers is Der, Die and Das.  How are we supposed to know?   Of course, native German speakers just know as they've been brought up with it.  There are some rules of thumb but I won't bother writing them here.

I always drag up at this point the discussion I had with a German person who was highly amused by my struggles with the concept that an airbag (as in a car) was Der Airbag.  Now why is it DER Airbag?   Airbag is a foreign word.  Their instinct was it was Der.  Made no sense to me so have to just go along with it.   One good thing is that it's very logical - you can break down words easily into their components.

Of course the same goes in French.  Why is it Le Car Parking?  Who knows!

Hungarian at least doesn't have genders on objects.  It's a good thing.  But in Dutch, it's important.  There's a difference between het bal (the ball, as in dance) and de bal (as in round object).

Around here, like the French they insist on having Hungarian words for objects which everyone knows anyway,  I don't know why they bother as it's like King Canute trying to hold back the sea.  Example: Számítógép when computer or PC or Laptop is known almost by everyone. 

It gets really diabolical when trying to research car parts.   The online car dictionary seems to never get updated which is a shame.

fluffy2560 wrote:

SimCityAT wrote:

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

...
There is another Hungarian film on Netflix now. It is in Hungarian with subtitles, Called,"Tall Tales".

There are lots....

If it's on Netflix, it's worth seeing the HU movie "Kontroll" about mysterious goings-on on the Budapest metro system.   

The director went on to bigger things in Hollywood.

I think we saw this one. Dark and depressing film too real.
I think the 2 witches we ran into on the bus who were screaming in my face over a ticket should of stared in this one!
4 summers ago my then 68 year old first cousin, he is not a cheapskate at all, is refined and has a PHD in education and has traveled the world, ex US Marine, Vietnam Vet and all round good guy was hassled by ne f the Budapest underground agents.
My husband rode for free, I had a ticket but my cuz insisted on buying tickets for himself and his wife .
The ticket machine was acting up. Finally his wife got a ticket then he put in more cins and a paper came out, no time to read the ticket as the car just pulled into the statin. We got on and headed t the city  park. All was fine.
Before we got off the agent came around to see the tickets, he said my cousins ticket was no good, told him to not move because he was about to check other tourists in our car. They all used the same broken down ticket machine and everyone was  about to be held up and fined on the spot.
Took me all of 30 seconds to realize what was up, I tried to give the agent one of my extra tickets but no way, they wanted their cut of the fine. I know they must get a commission n fines because of the way they are so pushy.
Well the guy wouldn't take my extra ticket and was a real POS being rude to everyone.
I told my cuz to make a run for it, then I ran out even though I had a good ticket and his wife follwed, my husband stayed behind to distract the agent and to tell him the machine was bad and that it was BKK's own fault.
Well the rude agent actually put his hands on my husband's neck and said to get out of his way or he would punch my husband in the face!
We made a clean get away, hid like little kids and waited on my husband to come up from underground. Took so long my poor cousin started to go back and rescue him. I had to hold his arm to keep him put. His wife said he had PTSD from Vietnam and
couldn't leave a man behind.
Thanks a ton BKK for being so effective and rude.
The machine did take my cousin's money after all.
After that we took taxi's and bought my cousin a book of tickets in case he and his wife wanted to explore a bit of Budapest on their own.We felt like terrible hosts after that subway ride.
I know they love to target tourists which is a bit messed up considering  some spend a ton of money coming to HU and staying in hotels and eating out. Dang my cousin's bar bill was at least $200. a day!

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

....
Before we got off the agent came around to see the tickets, he said my cousins ticket was no good, told him to not move because he was about to check other tourists in our car. They all used the same broken down ticket machine and everyone was  about to be held up and fined on the spot.
Took me all of 30 seconds to realize what was up, I tried to give the agent one of my extra tickets but no way, they wanted their cut of the fine. I know they must get a commission n fines because of the way they are so pushy.
...

That happened to our eldest Fluffyette.  Aged about 13 then, went to Mammut at Moscow Ter with a friend and on the way back somehow there was something wrong with the tickets - I don't know what as I couldn't get to the bottom of it.  The on the spot fine was HUF 8000 which for a little kid is astronomical.   I was incensed they could hassle an underage kid like that and the fine was disproportionate.  I never truly understood what went on but it was total extortion, even abusive.  I wanted to seriously complain about hassling a kid on the bus like that.

I have in the past given the odd ticket to other passengers who have been hassled by the Kontroll Nazis.   Usually they've given in and not fined the person.  I think with adults they would let it slide but with kids, it's clearly intimidation.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

....
Before we got off the agent came around to see the tickets, he said my cousins ticket was no good, told him to not move because he was about to check other tourists in our car. They all used the same broken down ticket machine and everyone was  about to be held up and fined on the spot.
Took me all of 30 seconds to realize what was up, I tried to give the agent one of my extra tickets but no way, they wanted their cut of the fine. I know they must get a commission n fines because of the way they are so pushy.
...

That happened to our eldest Fluffyette.  Aged about 13 then, went to Mammut at Moscow Ter with a friend and on the way back somehow there was something wrong with the tickets - I don't know what as I couldn't get to the bottom of it.  The on the spot fine was HUF 8000 which for a little kid is astronomical.   I was incensed they could hassle an underage kid like that and the fine was disproportionate.  I never truly understood what went on but it was total extortion, even abusive.  I wanted to seriously complain about hassling a kid on the bus like that.

I have in the past given the odd ticket to other passengers who have been hassled by the Kontroll Nazis.   Usually they've given in and not fined the person.  I think with adults they would let it slide but with kids, it's clearly intimidation.

That is bad to shake down a child who has some sort of ticket in hand.
10 or so years back we each bought a monthly pass. Headed to Aushan.
The bus we rode didn't have any special markings or sign saying they were going to leave the city limits.
No PA announcement either.
We rode the bus just one stop over the city limits without knowing it.
Before we could get off at the Aushan stop 2 , not kidding
toothless hags got on and zeroed in on me.
The bus was packed so my husband was sitting a few rows away.
I innocently showed them my pass and they both started screaming loud in my ear. Police, pay no good, all sorts of shouting.
My husband came over to see what was up.
He argued with them because the bus should of been marked as a out of range transportation
No one would know unless they traveled all the time on this line that you needed another ticket for the one short stop.
He finally just paid for the 2 of us as it turned out, 12,000 forints.
He didn't want to get a heart attack over a few bucks but it was stressful for sure.
We later went to consumer affairs to file a report on the bus c. and their tricky practices.
They agreoed it was messed up and helped us with forms t send to BKV( Now BKK) a letter came back from the director stating maybe they should of just sold us a ticket on the spot but since we paid we admitted guilt.
I walked everywhere after that, never bought another pass and my husband didn't buy one either.
They lost alot on us paying a pass for 10 years. Just bought a few tickets here and there when really needed to get somewhere faster then walking.
Putting their hands on my husband though and saying they would punch him in the face is a new level of low.
What got me even more mad was after we shelled out the 12,000 to those witches, a women came over to us and said the policy really was for them to offer to sell us a single ticket.Why didn't one of these other passengers speak up sooner?We were new to HU and didn't know how bad some thngs can be here.
Hope they go bankrupt now without being able to scam tourists.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

......
He finally just paid for the 2 of us as it turned out, 12,000 forints.
He didn't want to get a heart attack over a few bucks but it was stressful for sure.
We later went to consumer affairs to file a report on the bus c. and their tricky practices.
They agreed it was messed up and helped us with forms t send to BKV( Now BKK) a letter came back from the director stating maybe they should of just sold us a ticket on the spot but since we paid we admitted guilt.
I walked everywhere after that, never bought another pass and my husband didn't buy one either.
They lost alot on us paying a pass for 10 years. Just bought a few tickets here and there when really needed to get somewhere faster then walking.
Putting their hands on my husband though and saying they would punch him in the face is a new level of low.
What got me even more mad was after we shelled out the 12,000 to those witches, a women came over to us and said the policy really was for them to offer to sell us a single ticket.Why didn't one of these other passengers speak up sooner?We were new to HU and didn't know how bad some thngs can be here.
Hope they go bankrupt now without being able to scam tourists.

I think they shouldn't be able to demand cash payments from people and certainly not on a reward basis. Obviously if they are getting a cut then they have a real incentive to hassle tourists or vulnerable types.   

They should be able to just issue them with a ticket and then they can argue about it through an online complaints process. 

Your 12K HUF fine is ridiculous.  It's totally disproportionate to the  loss of revenue.   There will always be freeloaders but the majority are probably just mistakes.  It's taken them a few years to start putting signs up in English and German.

We live just a couple of stops outside of Budapest city limits and we have to buy a local ticket on top of the single ride ticket or we just get off and walk maybe 500m home.  Fluffyette1 now has monthly passes - one for inside Budapest and another one for the couple of stops outside the city limits.  I think that might have changed as well.

BKV I think has come really close to going bust.  There's also BKK and I have no idea what the difference is between BKV and BKK but I hardly go down to the city these days unless it's for something specific.

Cynic wrote:

LOL - we had a diary of train "events".  I'll leave it to your imagination as to the kind of things that ended up in there. 

There were no restrictions on who or what we transported; we brought an elephant for one of the Berlin Tattoo's (kind of like the Edinburgh Tattoo, but with much nicer beer).  The most outrageous events tended to be the wives clubs going on their day trips to Braunschweig for some erm "shopping".

I should mention for completeness that we also ran freight trains at night.

The dining car is basically 2 compartments split 1/3 2/3; the 1 3rd being the kitchen; the main part being fixed dining tables and bench seats.  It differed by having a large water tank in the roof and fitted for LPG tanks to run the cooking equipment.  You wouldn't need that size kitchen for a family of 4, so perhaps just gut the entire thing inside and start all over.  I've done similar things to stacaravans in Holland (gutted the interior), not a great deal of difference, there's not a lot of steel above the bed of the wagon.

Just an update - the auction was held a couple of days ago; the dining car sold for £9k; the old ex-RAF Beverley was also sold.

Cynic wrote:

....
Just an update - the auction was held a couple of days ago; the dining car sold for £9k; the old ex-RAF Beverley was also sold.

£9K wasn't a bad price for the carriage/dining car but I guess it's another £10-15K to move it somewhere else.  The Beverley went for £21K which was quite impressive.  I hope someone is going to look at restoring it.

I've been looking at old carriages here and it would be relatively quite easy to buy one hereabouts but it would be really difficult to move it safely.  One would have to ask if it would be worth it.  Containers would be a lot easier but certainly not as much "fun" or unique. 

BTW, I don't think there are trainspotters here although I have seen people wearing anoraks.

Fluffy

Bet you're are glad you visited the UK when you did.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Cynic wrote:

....
Just an update - the auction was held a couple of days ago; the dining car sold for £9k; the old ex-RAF Beverley was also sold.

£9K wasn't a bad price for the carriage/dining car but I guess it's another £10-15K to move it somewhere else.  The Beverley went for £21K which was quite impressive.  I hope someone is going to look at restoring it.

I've been looking at old carriages here and it would be relatively quite easy to buy one hereabouts but it would be really difficult to move it safely.  One would have to ask if it would be worth it.  Containers would be a lot easier but certainly not as much "fun" or unique. 

BTW, I don't think there are trainspotters here although I have seen people wearing anoraks.

We don't know who bought the dining car; but he/she will probably surface when they need some background about it.  You have a couple of transport options if you buy one, if you do buy one, I know who did it back in the day; no point in reinventing the wheel.

SimCityAT wrote:

Fluffy

Bet you're are glad you visited the UK when you did.

Absolutely!   

However, I've looked at what the new rules are as reported in the media and I cannot see any real difference to what went before as far as me flying in. I don't go to the pub and there's only a small chance 6 people would be together with me.   

There's Hungary-UK quarantine for 14 days but I think the enforcement is going to be non-existent.  People are just going to ignore it.

Here in HU, I believe they've reduced the quarantine to 10 days.   I've read other countries have only 7 days quarantine which is easily do-able if you can go in the garden and there's help around etc.  The 14 days was tedious here and it's enforced.

My gut feeling is that the COVID19 cat is so far out the bag, there's no point now in trying to stop it, it's all focused on slowing it down to avoid the health services being overwhelmed.

In other news, one of the relatives-in-law has it  (tested and confirmed) and has a bad cough and cannot go out but has NOT been taken to hospital.  It's caused a kerfuffle as everyone else in the apartment building will need locking down. 

I cannot believe was a total FUBAR situation this year has been - Brexit, COVID19, Boris, Trump, RBG etc.  Only good thing is the weather has been excellent and my DIY projects have been going really well.

Cynic wrote:

fluffy2560 wrote:

Cynic wrote:

....
Just an update - the auction was held a couple of days ago; the dining car sold for £9k; the old ex-RAF Beverley was also sold.

£9K wasn't a bad price for the carriage/dining car but I guess it's another £10-15K to move it somewhere else.  The Beverley went for £21K which was quite impressive.  I hope someone is going to look at restoring it.

I've been looking at old carriages here and it would be relatively quite easy to buy one hereabouts but it would be really difficult to move it safely.  One would have to ask if it would be worth it.  Containers would be a lot easier but certainly not as much "fun" or unique. 

BTW, I don't think there are trainspotters here although I have seen people wearing anoraks.

We don't know who bought the dining car; but he/she will probably surface when they need some background about it.  You have a couple of transport options if you buy one, if you do buy one, I know who did it back in the day; no point in reinventing the wheel.

Maybe you could hire yourself out as a consultant.

When I was searching for railway carriages in Hungary, I came across these pictures of the Istvantelek train yard with lots of interesting rusting relics. 

Click here: Istvantelek Train Yard

Some beauty in the corrosion and reestablishment of nature once again.     

For a Balaton house conversion, I think something a little less decrepit.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Maybe you could hire yourself out as a consultant.

When I was searching for railway carriages in Hungary, I came across these pictures of the Istvantelek train yard with lots of interesting rusting relics. 

Click here: Istvantelek Train Yard

Some beauty in the corrosion and reestablishment of nature once again.     

For a Balaton house conversion, I think something a little less decrepit.

Consultant - I just did some to help a guy stay out of jail - nice little earner, but now my last pension has begun to pay out, I honestly don't need the hassle.

I like those old Russian locomotives.  When I used to work on the Berlin train, we'd spend a couple of hours in Braunschweig while they turned the train around and did whatever maintenance DB wanted to do; we used to see this beauty parked outside the Bahnhof:



I don't think I could even contemplate restoring some of that stuff, I ache in too many places and my knees sound like broken bubble wrap whenever I stand up.

Off to Holland for a week tomorrow.

Cynic wrote:

fluffy2560 wrote:

Maybe you could hire yourself out as a consultant.

When I was searching for railway carriages in Hungary, I came across these pictures of the Istvantelek train yard with lots of interesting rusting relics. 

Click here: Istvantelek Train Yard

Some beauty in the corrosion and reestablishment of nature once again.     

For a Balaton house conversion, I think something a little less decrepit.

Consultant - I just did some to help a guy stay out of jail - nice little earner, but now my last pension has begun to pay out, I honestly don't need the hassle.

I like those old Russian locomotives.  When I used to work on the Berlin train, we'd spend a couple of hours in Braunschweig while they turned the train around and did whatever maintenance DB wanted to do; we used to see this beauty parked outside the Bahnhof:

https://i2.wp.com/operasandcycling.com/ … &ssl=1

I don't think I could even contemplate restoring some of that stuff, I ache in too many places and my knees sound like broken bubble wrap whenever I stand up.

Off to Holland for a week tomorrow.

Being a consultant could be a hobby rather than a job perhaps?  Bit of icing on the pension cake?

That old Russian loco reminds me of the locos that once graced Southern Africa - Zambia in fact. 

Mrs Fluffy and I were down in Livingstone (near the Falls) about 15 years ago and came across  the museum purely by accident.   Well worth a look if one is into stuff like that.

My own knees sound like trees creaking/squeaking in the wind sometimes.   It's getting quite bad in the mornings until the lubricant (probably tea) is circulating. Once that's all pumped through the joints, then I'm good to go really the whole day.  Then it's all back to square one next day in the morning.

We rode an old train in 1978 from Vienna to Budapest.
No way, give me a comfy modern seat.
Had yet another odd experience here yesterday.
Rather dumb really.
We went to a $$ exchange place on the blvd.
There are two cages for clerks but only one was operating.
We of course put on our masks to enter .
Some old lady ( probably around my age but acted like an old hag) was doing her business with the clerk.
I sat on a  chair about 15 feet away from her and my husband got in line behind her, a good 7 to 8 feet back.
Minding our business waiting our turn to make change.
The women kept whipping her head around , acted all over excited and nervous, just staring at me then my husband .
Did it several times. I had to say in English, "What? We're not robbing the place". She was so jittery.
Then the clerk in Hungarian told my husband and I to wait outside.
My husband said in English, "you lost a customer" and we left.
I asked my husband WTH was that about?
We looked at the door which had so many distracting messages posted on it. There was a sign that said only one person per clerk allowed inside.
Well that's just great, why didn't they just post in in Martian?
Love to know the percentage of none Hungarian speakers and readers who actually change money. Why not post in different languages if it was such a big deal/
The women had told the clerk to ask us to leave! Old Karen that she was.
Just made me angry how stupid the women and the shop were.
If is probably one of those rules that is never enforced unless there is a nervous Nelly inside.
I told my husband to walk back in and tell them to post in English or other languages if they wanted to do business with anyone but Hungarians.
He didn't go back in, I almost did to tell them off.How can you follow the rules when they are not clear? Logic is missing.
My husband can read Hungarian but they had at least 7 different signs on the door, who actually is going to read all that before entering?
I wonder when that women is going to run into someone who lets her know how unreasonable she is... I'd like to watch the fireworks.She and the clerk obviously only spoke Hungarian.
Sorry for the rant, these are the things I dislike about Hungary, so smart yet so dumb.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

We rode an old train in 1978 from Vienna to Budapest.
No way, give me a comfy modern seat.
Had yet another odd experience here yesterday.
Rather dumb really.
We went to a $$ exchange place on the blvd.
There are two cages for clerks but only one was operating.
We of course put on our masks to enter .
Some old lady ( probably around my age but acted like an old hag) was doing her business with the clerk.
I sat on a  chair about 15 feet away from her and my husband got in line behind her, a good 7 to 8 feet back.
Minding our business waiting our turn to make change.
The women kept whipping her head around , acted all over excited and nervous, just staring at me then my husband .
Did it several times. I had to say in English, "What? We're not robbing the place". She was so jittery.
Then the clerk in Hungarian told my husband and I to wait outside.
My husband said in English, "you lost a customer" and we left.
I asked my husband WTH was that about?
We looked at the door which had so many distracting messages posted on it. There was a sign that said only one person per clerk allowed inside.
Well that's just great, why didn't they just post in in Martian?
Love to know the percentage of none Hungarian speakers and readers who actually change money. Why not post in different languages if it was such a big deal/
The women had told the clerk to ask us to leave! Old Karen that she was.
.....
I wonder when that women is going to run into someone who lets her know how unreasonable she is... I'd like to watch the fireworks.She and the clerk obviously only spoke Hungarian.
Sorry for the rant, these are the things I dislike about Hungary, so smart yet so dumb.

Some of those exchange bureaux are con jobs. 

There's one in Auchan in Torokbalint which charges you a whopping amount if your amounts are "too small" (like something dumb like less than USD 500).  We didn't read the sign and it cost us about HUF 8000 in charges.  Never go near that place again.  It's really worth reading the signs and watch out for the staff who are in on the con.  They do not tell you they are absolutely going to rip you off.   We just idly did it, chatted to each other and walked away. It was only a bit later that we realised we were down so much. 

The obvious thing to do is to use a debit or credit card  instead and reject the offered exchange rate on the display - if you reject it then you get the MC or Visa rate (supposedly higher) and not the card clearing/transacting bank.  Sometimes that works better - I've bought stuff in Ikea and noticed the difference of just a few 1000 HUF.

This Karen thing is a bit weird.  It's not that much of an unusual name so how it came to be associated with negativity no-one (perhaps) knows. In my country, there are no negative connotations - yet.  Eventually we'll get it as well.  Same with the  Bill Gates, Antifa and QAnon imports.

My thought is that it's a bit of a fashion or geographical though - who is called Enid or Ethel these days?   In the UK, Tracey and Sharon are  names associated with certain people types in the zeitgeist -  bit like Karens perhaps.   Here, Mrs Fluffy tells me it's Erzsébet.

Personally I quite like the name Sharon but I've worked with a couple of people who I liked called Sharon.   Apparently the male equivalent is Ken but that's not a common name now - at least in the UK.   Maybe the equivalent is now Shane or Wayne?  No idea. 

BTW, apparently numbers in shops is the same in the government tobacco shops - only one person is allowed in.  You can see them queuing up around here in a couple of places and where there's an ABC and people loitering with tins of beer.

Yes, some of these change spots are real rip off joints. Western Union exchange downtown for one.
We changed more then $500. and it cost about $2. in commission.
We usually shop around to different places to see the rates for the day before doing any change.
Want to "get rid" of some $$ we usually just use the ATM .
Have a dollar accunt with our HU bank but the balance in that account is a big zero, we trust our US bank more, at least for now.
My husband finally got a HU debit card after having his account for over a decade.
Not rolling in dough soo not a biggie either way.
Was checking out the old cond online on Maui where we lived 45 years ago. Still looks rather nice and clean.
Maybe after this C-19 stuff ?...
It would be too weird though to go back again.
I saw the old home in Conn, where I was born.
It was up for sale, not out of our price range either,, just thought I'd freak out if I went back, too many memories...
I know one thing for sure, you can never go home again.
Watched a current video about Maui. So many people lined up for food handout's right now. All those hotel jobs are gone.It's a bit scray really.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

....
Watched a current video about Maui. So many people lined up for food handout's right now. All those hotel jobs are gone.It's a bit scrary really.

I was discussing this with one of my siblings and the rumour was that COVID19 and the fallout could go on for quite some years.  It's going to change the way we live forever.  One of the in-laws is now in the isolation hospital with the virus.  No-one can visit the patient and no-one who was with the patient can visit anyone else either.   

I'm getting very slightly concerned about the potential for social unrest as a result of the economies of the world nose diving.  We seem to be in very turbulent waters recently with more turmoil being piled on randomly on top of existing controversy - just the past days we've had DT's tax return, the SCOTUS judge appointment, fighting in Armenia/Azerbaijan, Belarus again, more on Navalny poisoning, 1M deaths from coronavirus etc.   

Right now, I'd rather we we gently coasting along with no drama!

fluffy2560 wrote:

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

....
Watched a current video about Maui. So many people lined up for food handout's right now. All those hotel jobs are gone.It's a bit scrary really.

I was discussing this with one of my siblings and the rumour was that COVID19 and the fallout could go on for quite some years.  It's going to change the way we live forever.  One of the in-laws is now in the isolation hospital with the virus.  No-one can visit the patient and no-one who was with the patient can visit anyone else either.   

I'm getting very slightly concerned about the potential for social unrest as a result of the economies of the world nose diving.  We seem to be in very turbulent waters recently with more turmoil being piled on randomly on top of existing controversy - just the past days we've had DT's tax return, the SCOTUS judge appointment, fighting in Armenia/Azerbaijan, Belarus again, more on Navalny poisoning, 1M deaths from coronavirus etc.   

Right now, I'd rather we we gently coasting along with no drama!

I hope your family member comes home intact. Scary times indeed.
My biggest fear is getting an illness and not being allowed to have my hubby visit me.
That would do me in I'm afraid. or I may just climb over the wall and come home without permission...
I'd rather pass in my own bed at home listening to the Stones or some other music I enjoy then hearing some insane medical staff screaming in the background.
I personally think there is a bigger agenda then some virus.
Today we had a dentist appointment, went in, she was ill and didn't show up, no biggie, hope she recovers.She's a pretty decent and nice lady.
Her assistant asked us for our phone number, we don't like to give it out. Husband gave it to her without asking me first, hope we are not now on some lamo tracking app.
Well think we are good, been over 14 days since my husband went to the dentist and I never went in.
Paranoid? Maybe a bit.
Since the doc never showed up we had time to go to the farmers market, I started to cough my head off n the ride home, I'm fine and dandy but the chemicals they used to clean that car about did me in.
I'm sensitive to cheap  perfume and chemicals.
Can deal with BO better then some sweet overly flowerly body spray.
Wanted to get an eye exam but not sure about going in. Maybe it's better to go blind then get locked in a hospital room with no visitors?
Yes , think our savings might just go poof one of these days... Can't  count on anything any longer.
Not sure if we should invest in beans or bit coin?
All I can honestly say is for once I am glad I have no grandchildren to worry about cause things don't exactly look all that sunny right about now.I've never put much energy or thought into the system and sort of feel bad for those who did, what a let down.I've lived my life just waiting for the other shoe to drop.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

...
I hope your family member comes home intact. Scary times indeed.
My biggest fear is getting an illness and not being allowed to have my hubby visit me.
That would do me in I'm afraid. or I may just climb over the wall and come home without permission...
I'd rather pass in my own bed at home listening to the Stones or some other music I enjoy then hearing some insane medical staff screaming in the background.
I personally think there is a bigger agenda then some virus.
.....
Yes , think our savings might just go poof one of these days... Can't  count on anything any longer.
Not sure if we should invest in beans or bit coin?
All I can honestly say is for once I am glad I have no grandchildren to worry about cause things don't exactly look all that sunny right about now. I've never put much energy or thought into the system and sort of feel bad for those who did, what a let down. I've lived my life just waiting for the other shoe to drop.

I think the family member will get better.  Just needs the support of a hospital.  But it took a serious escalation of her COVID19 symptoms to get the attention she needed.  One needs to be almost unconscious and immobile to get them to help.   I visited another relative in hospital here plus of course Mrs Fluffy when our kids arrived and it didn't seem that bad in there but the food looked quite poor.   

I've stopped reading about the virus on different sites - I only listen to the official news from (hopefully) respected and balanced press outlets - BBC, Economist, NY Times etc.  There was a segment on the UK radio about how the conspiracy theories and nonsense around it was changing people's behaviour.  Some people are becoming mentally ill because of it.  If it's screwing one up, then stop looking!   I am quite sure that the likes of Facebook, Twitter and other social media will be broken up and also become heavily regulated if Biden wins. 

It's becoming so absurd with the amount of silliness, it's almost a cartoon'ish or some rubbish Hollywood version of reality.  The Biden vs Trump debate - watched the highlights - didn't help either.  Joe "safer hands" Biden vs Donaldo "cheap showman" Trump wasn't the bout I hoped for.  Hopefully stability will ensue.

I keep wondering how we got here.  One commentator I listened to said it came out of the 2008 economic crash.  That surprised me. I thought it was much later with the ascendancy of these Trump, Putin, Orban, Bolsanaro types but it seems it went wrong much earlier.   When I get some time, I'll do some more research.

Governments aren't actually very good at governing anything.  Very few of them really do a good job of anything.  It's like a sort of averaging out machine - they get somethings right and other things very wrong.  External observers would probably see a flat line around zero as everything good and bad things cancel out and we're all X years older.   But perhaps that's the best we can hope for - mainly just stability with the odd short glitch.

Hope your family member recovers soon.
My friend in Hawaii said her son is recovered but was a bit weak so slowly started his jogging workouts. He is a doctor in Honolulu so hard hard for him to avoid illness for long.
He is young though, under 30.
I had a flu once at age 17 and wouldn't of been surprised if it did me in.
Couldn't move for days world was spinning, no food and only sips of water available.
Was crazy back then, was a run away and got ill and ur room mate was out for that week with his new boyfriend. Didn't even know his 2 roommies were ill.. As soon as my friend felt a bit better she got some orange juice and bread. Had no phone back then because I probably would f called my mother to care for us. It was bad, never was that ill in my life.
Still standing, guess "fate" has more plans for me....
Had my knee surgery here in Budapest, I am not kidding the 4,"meals" i had during that 28 hours inside was this, exactly... Cold /lukwarm tea, very watery no sugar one slice of white stale bread. Next meal, more of the watery tea one slice f stale bread with one slice of some sort of lunch meat. Dinner, more lovely watery tea, one slice of stale white bread with super thin chcld cherry soup, not fresh cherries either. Breakfast the next morning, some tea one slice of stale white bread... How can anyone get well on such a diet?
What killed me was the smell of hot meals coming from the nurses station. My husband said they are probably eating the patient's food!
Of course you can go down to the snack bar and get a sandwich or some fast food if you wanted to. I was ok with not eating for a day but long term?
By contrast, my Vegas friend 's mom was in hospital in Switzerland, she even had a wine list and had a choice of meals. When I was in hospital for 3 days after my son was born( they kept me in for some reason) I was blown away by the ther Hawaiian moms sharing my room. Guess there was 6 f us in ne dorm. I had an ocean view, the meals was all these mom's could talk about. They were not first time mother's and had been in that hospital before. They were not kidding, wow, what huge fresh nice meals, everything you could ask for, fresh fruit, juices, rice, poi ,fresh fish dinners.Thought i was on a holiday instead if in hospital.
This insane agenda has been in motion since at least the 1933 when they removed the gold standard.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

Hope your family member recovers soon.
My friend in Hawaii said her son is recovered but was a bit weak so slowly started his jogging workouts. He is a doctor in Honolulu so hard hard for him to avoid illness for long.
He is young though, under 30.
I had a flu once at age 17 and wouldn't of been surprised if it did me in.
Couldn't move for days world was spinning, no food and only sips of water available.

Real flu is absolutely horrible.  I've had it twice and one can see how it would do in the vulnerable. 

I was getting my vaccinations up to date on Monday and the doctor told me the yearly influenza vaccine would probably be available at the end of the month but that it could be late.  I checked that out and there are some news reports that it's likely to be delayed by a few weeks.  Pile that up COVID vaccine demands and who knows what will happen this season.   

Our relative is being moved from the Pulmonary Institute here to another hospital.  We think it's because of being less sick although still positive with the virus.

Strange events afoot in the the USA though - I wondered if Trump's quarantine is an excuse not to get into a slanging match with Biden.  Considering last time's "debate", I wouldn't be surprising if he tried to play the sympathy card. 

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

Had my knee surgery here in Budapest, I am not kidding the 4,"meals" i had during that 28 hours inside was this, exactly... Cold /lukwarm tea, very watery no sugar one slice of white stale bread. Next meal, more of the watery tea one slice f stale bread with one slice of some sort of lunch meat. Dinner, more lovely watery tea, one slice of stale white bread with super thin chcld cherry soup, not fresh cherries either. Breakfast the next morning, some tea one slice of stale white bread... How can anyone get well on such a diet?
What killed me was the smell of hot meals coming from the nurses station. My husband said they are probably eating the patient's food!
Of course you can go down to the snack bar and get a sandwich or some fast food if you wanted to. I was ok with not eating for a day but long term?

Yup, it's appalling.  If your ailment doesn't get you, the food choices will.  I had to take Mrs Fluffy care packages each day.  She couldn't wait to get out of there.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

By contrast, my Vegas friend 's mom was in hospital in Switzerland, she even had a wine list and had a choice of meals. When I was in hospital for 3 days after my son was born (they kept me in for some reason) I was blown away by their Hawaiian moms sharing my room. Guess there was 6 of us in the dorm. I had an ocean view, the meals was all these Moms could talk about. They were not first time mothers' had been in that hospital before. They were not kidding, wow, what huge fresh nice meals, everything you could ask for, fresh fruit, juices, rice, poi ,fresh fish dinners.Thought i was on a holiday instead of in hospital.
This insane agenda has been in motion since at least the 1933 when they removed the gold standard.

Sounds more like a hotel than a hospital.  On the other hand, best not to eat anything if you're having surgery.  That's what they say anyway although never really knew why but having seen my two eldest being born, I'd tend to agree with that idea.  Maybe I should watch more episodes of Dr House or ER.

I had an interesting discussion with a doctor once about having babies and care of the expectant mother.  He said to me "your wife is not sick, she's pregnant".   Really stuck with me that and so obviously true!

Made me chuckle

fluffy2560 wrote:

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

Hope your family member recovers soon.
My friend in Hawaii said her son is recovered but was a bit weak so slowly started his jogging workouts. He is a doctor in Honolulu so hard hard for him to avoid illness for long.
He is young though, under 30.
I had a flu once at age 17 and wouldn't of been surprised if it did me in.
Couldn't move for days world was spinning, no food and only sips of water available.

Real flu is absolutely horrible.  I've had it twice and one can see how it would do in the vulnerable. 

I was getting my vaccinations up to date on Monday and the doctor told me the yearly influenza vaccine would probably be available at the end of the month but that it could be late.  I checked that out and there are some news reports that it's likely to be delayed by a few weeks.  Pile that up COVID vaccine demands and who knows what will happen this season.   

Our relative is being moved from the Pulmonary Institute here to another hospital.  We think it's because of being less sick although still positive with the virus.

Strange events afoot in the the USA though - I wondered if Trump's quarantine is an excuse not to get into a slanging match with Biden.  Considering last time's "debate", I wouldn't be surprising if he tried to play the sympathy card. 

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

Had my knee surgery here in Budapest, I am not kidding the 4,"meals" i had during that 28 hours inside was this, exactly... Cold /lukwarm tea, very watery no sugar one slice of white stale bread. Next meal, more of the watery tea one slice f stale bread with one slice of some sort of lunch meat. Dinner, more lovely watery tea, one slice of stale white bread with super thin chcld cherry soup, not fresh cherries either. Breakfast the next morning, some tea one slice of stale white bread... How can anyone get well on such a diet?
What killed me was the smell of hot meals coming from the nurses station. My husband said they are probably eating the patient's food!
Of course you can go down to the snack bar and get a sandwich or some fast food if you wanted to. I was ok with not eating for a day but long term?

Yup, it's appalling.  If your ailment doesn't get you, the food choices will.  I had to take Mrs Fluffy care packages each day.  She couldn't wait to get out of there.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

By contrast, my Vegas friend 's mom was in hospital in Switzerland, she even had a wine list and had a choice of meals. When I was in hospital for 3 days after my son was born (they kept me in for some reason) I was blown away by their Hawaiian moms sharing my room. Guess there was 6 of us in the dorm. I had an ocean view, the meals was all these Moms could talk about. They were not first time mothers' had been in that hospital before. They were not kidding, wow, what huge fresh nice meals, everything you could ask for, fresh fruit, juices, rice, poi ,fresh fish dinners.Thought i was on a holiday instead of in hospital.
This insane agenda has been in motion since at least the 1933 when they removed the gold standard.

Sounds more like a hotel than a hospital.  On the other hand, best not to eat anything if you're having surgery.  That's what they say anyway although never really knew why but having seen my two eldest being born, I'd tend to agree with that idea.  Maybe I should watch more episodes of Dr House or ER.

I had an interesting discussion with a doctor once about having babies and care of the expectant mother.  He said to me "your wife is not sick, she's pregnant".   Really stuck with me that and so obviously true!

My son arrived 2 weeks earlier then what the doctor told me my due date was.
He might of been born under a different zodiac sign which might of been good.
I didn't like my doc at all, some stuffy mean old white dude on Maui.
I was 7 months along when I first saw him.
I had moved to Maui at about 6 1/2 months along by myself.
My husband had been there for about 2 months finding a flat and getting a job before I came over.
I was working full time as a car-hop in a restaurant running around for 8 hours a day on my feet lifting trays and serving meals to people in cars.
I was too busy to feel anything, got sick a few times around 4 months along otherwise all was great.
Guess when you are only 20 years old you are at your peak in health.
I didn't wear maternity clothing until 7 months, only bought a few items because once I got to Maui I bought some moo-moos to wear, ugly as heck but so comfy, while in Rome why not dress like a Roman, at least I had an excuse to wear a moo-moo...
I remember waking up all night long in labor, only I didn't know I was in labor. My tummy was clear of all food and then some.
I had a good friend living next door to us in another condo. She already had a 2 year old girl and her baby boy was born 2 weeks earlier then my son so she was like a big sister to me with advice etc.
We talked for a few hours, my pain got a bit worst and she said I think you had better go to the hospital.
I didn't want to go, I had 2 more weeks to go in my mind.
Came home took a shower and my husband drove me over to the hospital.
Less then 3 hours later my baby arrived.
It was rather easy for me, not much time to panic or worry.
Some women have a hard time, it was very easy for me but then again, I was swimming and walking and working all that time, best to be as physically strong as possible for such a big event.
Was back in my jeans in about 3 weeks, wearing a bikini again and taking my baby to the beach.
Wish I had a time machine, those were some fun days.

  Our upstairs neighbor have a red sticker on their door, pisses me off because my husband says we can't open our windows until they remove their sticker.
Think the guys niece was working for the airlines, he is some big deal officer in  the HU military so not sure what's up with them as far as being outside of Hungary recently.
Maybe it's nothing serious like Trump, I was waiting for him to say he had C-19. The timing couldn't be more perfect. Either he will recover and be a hero or he will retire to Epstien Island.
Sad when you can't trust any news or anyone in power.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

...
....
I was too busy to feel anything, got sick a few times around 4 months along otherwise all was great.
Guess when you are only 20 years old you are at your peak in health.
I didn't wear maternity clothing until 7 months, only bought a few items because once I got to Maui I bought some moo-moos to wear, ugly as heck but so comfy, while in Rome why not dress like a Roman, at least I had an excuse to wear a moo-moo...
......
  Our upstairs neighbor have a red sticker on their door, pisses me off because my husband says we can't open our windows until they remove their sticker.
Think the guys niece was working for the airlines, he is some big deal officer in  the HU military so not sure what's up with them as far as being outside of Hungary recently.
Maybe it's nothing serious like Trump, I was waiting for him to say he had C-19. The timing couldn't be more perfect. Either he will recover and be a hero or he will retire to Epstein Island.
Sad when you can't trust any news or anyone in power.

Red sign means they or someone has been out of the country.  Doesn't mean they will have COVID.

That mumuu thing reminds of King Sized Homer.  In these lockdown days I spend most of my day in T-shirts and shorts. I could really go for the mumuu but they might say something if I'm wearing a pair of curtains (US: drapes) on Zoom teleconferencing. 

20 years old is like being brand new.  Everything will be bounce back as it's all snap back rubbery. I could imagine some people have baby arrive in the morning and then be out playing tennis in the afternoon. I look at my youngest and how they bounce out of bed yet I can hear the crinkling of paper in my neck and the grind in my knees.  Once I get going, it's OK but it's minorly difficult to sometimes even get out of the chair!   I spent Friday evening at Cyberjump.  This morning I can certainly feel I was there.

I was listening to a conspiracy theory phone in this morning and the presenter couldn't believe DT would have lied that he had COVID to help his chances in the election.   I think there's a good chance he's lying and just doing it to avoid going on the campaign trail.    You'd think with his ratings swirling the plughole he'd need to be out on the job or perhaps he's bigly given up or outsourced it to the Proud Boys (whoever they are).   I don't know about Epstein Island but many would like to settle for him in a potter's field.

Potters field...funny.
Waiting to see if he will be hero or victim.
Just  a huge stage and I am not enjoying the show.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

Potters field...funny.
Waiting to see if he will be hero or victim.
Just  a huge stage and I am not enjoying the show.

I'm getting bored with him in the hospital and the inane media interest.   Who the hell cares what he had for breakfast!  He was pretty stupid taking a drive to see his supporters.  What about all of the people in the car with him?  Hopefully they were all PPE'd up.  He should get on with it quietly - either get better or die.   

I was surprised to hear that the committee that will grill Judge Barrett for SCOTUS is in trouble forming up as some members have COVID19  and are isolating which might practically dip the Senate majority balance away from Barrett.  Meh....

More importantly, there's news swirling around that HU is going to get hit very hard with COVID19.  Moreover, OV has doubled the doctors' salaries presumably to encourage them to stay and not to leave for better paid work overseas.     

Also the government has bought an Airbus cargo aircraft from Qatar Airways to be operated by Wizz Air - presumably to help with the distribution of supplies/vaccines when the time comes.  Surprising amount of forward planning there.

Having better health infra-structure is of course very good, but looking at all the salary hikes (nurses, doctors, teachers) worries me a bit, a good thing that I have my assets in EUR and not in HUF. Clearly everything will become more expensive, but also (on the positive side for me) real estate which will compensate a bit.
Other groups, bus drivers, hotel staff, but more in general all staff in Hungary I think can expect positive hikes (for them) within two years. My predicition would be 2 or 3 years of big inflation and switch to EURO.

Not per se all good, but if (young) doctors would stay in Hungary I do not complain,
Very worried about inflation though (limited income from Hungary though, but worried about local pensioners)

cdw057 wrote:

Having better health infra-structure is of course very good, but looking at all the salary hikes (nurses, doctors, teachers) worries me a bit, a good thing that I have my assets in EUR and not in HUF. Clearly everything will become more expensive, but also (on the positive side for me) real estate which will compensate a bit.
Other groups, bus drivers, hotel staff, but more in general all staff in Hungary I think can expect positive hikes (for them) within two years. My prediction would be 2 or 3 years of big inflation and switch to EURO.

Not per se all good, but if (young) doctors would stay in Hungary I do not complain,
Very worried about inflation though (limited income from Hungary though, but worried about local pensioners)

EUR is likely to be a better bet than HUF for sure.  HUF has been reducing in value quite fast recently.

I don't blame professional persons leaving.  Who would stay?  Money is not always the reason people move but they often do if other things are not satisfactory - environment, schools, housing, transport, opportunity and so on.  People will complain about money but other things - if they would good - might get people to stay.

We should not forget  the next election coming in 2022.  At the moment there's a by-election going on in Borsod with a combined opposition groups candidate (from reformed right wing Jobbik party).  This is a really important by-election.  If OV loses that seat, then he'll have lost his super majority and won't be able to change the constitution.  Maybe it'll bring about some cracks in the Fidesz castle walls.  Combined with COVID, I can see some severe economic issues in the coming two years but I could not see OV allowing the EU to have controls over the currency .   OV won't be able to engage in quantitative easing or printing money to pay higher salaries if it's in the EUR.

In the financial papers I've read, it seems that the target of the HUF is predicted to be about 400-450 to the Euro in 3 years. I think the effort for O1G now is to try to "bribe" enough Hungarians to vote for Fidesz or at least have examples of how O1G is supporting those very same things he let lapse over the past decade, in favor of building stadiums. I was thinking of buying another property in Hungary for investment, but when I think of how it will be devalued due to inflation by over a third, I just can't bring myself to commit to that.

Hungary doesn't qualify to join the Euro, and likely won't for quite some time. The government is highly critical of MORE control from Brussels, and will not submit to audits due to high levels of corruption, so I do not see this happening within the next 5 years at least.

Inflation in Hungary is good for me (I have my assets in EURO) and it dampens the annual salary (and price) increases a bit, nevertheless I believe that Hungary will go for the EURO (and succeed in doing so) in the coming 2 years. (The artificial inflation is just a step from a government perspective)

Vicces1 wrote:

In the financial papers I've read, it seems that the target of the HUF is predicted to be about 400-450 to the Euro in 3 years. I think the effort for O1G now is to try to "bribe" enough Hungarians to vote for Fidesz or at least have examples of how O1G is supporting those very same things he let lapse over the past decade, in favor of building stadiums. I was thinking of buying another property in Hungary for investment, but when I think of how it will be devalued due to inflation by over a third, I just can't bring myself to commit to that.

Hungary doesn't qualify to join the Euro, and likely won't for quite some time. The government is highly critical of MORE control from Brussels, and will not submit to audits due to high levels of corruption, so I do not see this happening within the next 5 years at least.

I agree, it's hard to see what the logic would be in buying more property here.   Mrs Fluffy has inherited property recently and it seems quite difficult to do anything with it - undervalued and no buyers except at giveaway prices.

The stadium thing is a mania which defies logic.   If O1G is out of power, all of those things like the Puskas Academy could fall into disrepair simply because it was his baby.  I cannot see substantial prestige businesses coming back here as the politics are so fickle.  CEU will be long gone to Vienna and all the newspapers will remain in O1G's hands.  It's a bit like Trump and the Trumpettes - only jail for corruption would send the right message. 

I agree with you on the Euro - the trend is up against the HUF and been anywhere between 345-365 HUF in the past 90 days.  No way O1G can control those external factors.

Hungary is already in the potential sanctions process of not confirming with EU values/norms since 2018.  No way they EUR is even under consideration.

The only thing which is going to fix it as far as I can see is that O1G and the conservative religious right are out of the picture politically and for at least 2-3 election cycles so a level of trust can be built up again. No doubt it would be all blamed on COVID19.

No-one will invest here unless they know they can survive in such a mercurial environment.

cdw057 wrote:

Inflation in Hungary is good for me (I have my assets in EURO) and it dampens the annual salary (and price) increases a bit, nevertheless I believe that Hungary will go for the EURO (and succeed in doing so) in the coming 2 years. (The artificial inflation is just a step from a government perspective)

That only works for goods produced locally.  Imports would still cost the same in real terms.  Rapidly increasing inflation is not a great thing for economic stability. 

There's always going to be a lag in price-salary adjustments so in this economy which is not self-sufficient, the majority people are going to suffer because everything will be more expensive. 

On the other hand, lowering HUF will make exports more attractive to external buyers so potentially the economy could enter a slower growth period (tempered by COVID19).   This is like a kind of export subsidy. 

I think the EU would eventually need to intervene to try and maintain stability.  Imagine the Slovenians and Slovaks and Austrians complaining about Hungary effectively attacking their economies by cheaper imports.

fluffy2560 wrote:

The stadium thing is a mania which defies logic.  If O1G is out of power, all of those things like the Puskas Academy could fall into disrepair simply because it was his baby.  I cannot see substantial prestige businesses coming back here as the politics are so fickle.  CEU will be long gone to Vienna and all the newspapers will remain in O1G's hands.  It's a bit like Trump and the Trumpettes - only jail for corruption would send the right message. 

Hungary is already in the potential sanctions process of not confirming with EU values/norms since 2018.  No way they EUR is even under consideration.

The only thing which is going to fix it as far as I can see is that O1G and the conservative religious right are out of the picture politically and for at least 2-3 election cycles so a level of trust can be built up again. No doubt it would be all blamed on COVID19.

No-one will invest here unless they know they can survive in such a mercurial environment.

It's a real shame but Hungary has become a poster boy for bad behavior. Could be Western Europe is tired of sending its taxes to countries so that corrupt politicians can steal the funds all the while complaining that Brussels is the problem and the Western nations are brainless... Unfortunately, O1G and friends will be happily spending their time and money elsewhere, having hidden their ill-gotten gains in many accounts internationally. Gotta have an exit plan if justice ever comes knocking!

I agree that COVID will be scapegoated by many countries. I can hear the politicians now (read it in a Scooby Doo just caught the man dressed as a ghost), "I would have gotten away with it too if it wasn't for this stupid virus!"

As much as support for Trump boggles my mind, I see the same non-thinking folks here in Hungary -- people who despite facts and experience still support this government. So much rationalization takes place that I have sworn off political discussions at all. It simply hurts my brain too much to try to debate any point. So I will enjoy it while it lasts here, but I am planning on some travel to pick my next residence a little more in the Southwestern direction -- Anyone know some great parts of Portugal or Spain?

pluses minuses for all countries, possible corruption everywhere, but as for taxes in Hungary I have nothing to complain, Portugal (notably Madeira) is excellent, but expensive for cost of living and taxes on pensions. Still I would agree Portugal is nice. I am more looking at Turkey or Georgia.
Hungary has of course minuses, but one thing (as for me ) is sure, low crime and corruption (day-to-day) is limited.

Still Hungary for me is getting too expensive but as I have my own property I have also benefited from the real estate hike (lets see where it all ends up).
So far Hungary has not been bad for me.

as for wasting money, many examples in The Netherlands, Luxembourg, Germany. If 10% GDP is going to waste in real democracies and only 1 or 2% in Hungary for "compensations"
, I would choose Hungary.

The Netherlands, Moroccans as refugees, claiming to be 17 when they are 30, no chance of refugee status is they were to be 30, but youngsters can not be expelled. They delay things, court has to prove that the are over 20, repatriation, pocket money, daily housing for years.  Refugees are fine, but people playing the system no.
Better to spend 30 mln on trips, housing, ... of local people (politicians or others) then 300 m;n on people with criminal intent (protected by courts and bureaucracy.)

All countries have pluses and minuses, I can get upset on many things, but bottom line I have lost my principles (and the will to fight) over the years a bit. I think about me and I will not be able to change things.
We have many choices and we should be happy to have these choices (eg not being stuck in a refugee camp without means)
Horrible things in this world and considering that Hungary is not too bad at all (even if they are justified reasons to leave)

Vicces1 wrote:

It's a real shame but Hungary has become a poster boy for bad behavior. Could be Western Europe is tired of sending its taxes to countries so that corrupt politicians can steal the funds all the while complaining that Brussels is the problem and the Western nations are brainless... Unfortunately, O1G and friends will be happily spending their time and money elsewhere, having hidden their ill-gotten gains in many accounts internationally. Gotta have an exit plan if justice ever comes knocking!

There's some good news from Brussels though...

EU court rules against Hungary's Viktor Orban over Soros university

It's an interesting one - the comment "justice delayed is justice denied" is apt.  Too little, too late.   What's O1G going to do about it? I expect nothing.  But one can hope CEU gets a whopping amount of compensation from the politicians personally.

If they have a place to go, they need to be somewhere away from the long arm of the law.  Look at Lukashenko. Where's he able to go except Russia?  If he does go there, Putin will step into Belarus and Lukashenko will find himself in a dacha in the grounds of a Siberian mental hospital.   Where O1G and cronies can go, who knows, certainly nowhere around here.  Maybe Venezuela?

Vicces1 wrote:

I agree that COVID will be scapegoated by many countries. I can hear the politicians now (read it in a Scooby Doo just caught the man dressed as a ghost), "I would have gotten away with it too if it wasn't for this stupid virus!"

Ah, the philosophy of Scooby Doo.  Almost as good as that of Forrest Gump.

Vicces1 wrote:

As much as support for Trump boggles my mind, I see the same non-thinking folks here in Hungary -- people who despite facts and experience still support this government. So much rationalization takes place that I have sworn off political discussions at all. It simply hurts my brain too much to try to debate any point. So I will enjoy it while it lasts here, but I am planning on some travel to pick my next residence a little more in the Southwestern direction -- Anyone know some great parts of Portugal or Spain?

It's Harris and Pence this evening. 

He's such a Trump Yes man, one has to wonder if he's got a mind of his own. Maybe he's being controlled by Bill Gates's nanites.   His religious views are verging on delusional. Harris is adversarial - in my mind not very erudite though - so Mikey should be on the ropes fairly quickly unless he's had a personality transplant.   

I see the gap reported is 9% in Biden's favour.  Biden should take on Trump again while he's weakened. It's politics and there's really no prisoners taken, winner takes all. If Trump stumbles then no-one should blame Biden for taking the opportunity to visibly weaken him further.   

One thing I am wondering is how Trump is rationalising in his mind that his showman policies may potentially killed some of his core staff at the WH. 

Perhaps the virus has Trump thinking of his own mortality - his legacy might only be Judge Barrett into SCOTUS.  He's prioritising that now there's less than a month to go.

Why not consider the Canary Islands?  Big islands and plenty of international things going on. One of my friends lived in Malta - too small for him so he now lives in the UK again.  Any island is going to be expensive as it's all imports.  Canaries are quite big though, especially Tenerife and Gran Canaria.

Sad to say there is no escape from this insanity.
Like my now as of Monday, 73 year old husband says, we are just watchers.
The big players are going to do what they want to no matter how much us little people suffer.
Makes me think of my much missed and much beloved sister who's messed up boyfriend's mother was BFF's with Leona Helmsley. Believe me, no idea how their worlds collided.
I mentioned in the past how my sis's BF got set up with great paying painting gigs in LA from his mom's connection with Ms. Helmsley.Like a friend used to say, it's all abut who you know or who you B***!
Totally off track but my advice is to stock up fr at least 6 months on food, keep your car gassed up, like we can drive anywhere far away enough and be ready for just about any freak show event they toss ur way.
Yes my hubby had a nice BD, had to prep all day  long for his Tuesday morning appointment for a colonoscopy, Great times!! He got the "all clear", what a BD gift I can come up with!