Citizenship by marriage to Hungarian citizenship

When can you apply for citizenship?
You can normally make an application for Hungarian citizenship once you have completed 8 years of continuous residence in Hungary.

There are exceptions to this minimum limit in the following circumstances:

If you were born in Hungary, you can apply for citizenship after 5 years of continuous residence.

If you are married to a Hungarian citizen and/or are the parent of child who is Hungarian and is a minor and/or hold refugee status, you can make a Citizenship application after 3 years of continuous residence in the country.

If you profess yourself to be Hungarian and can verify your ancestors were Hungarian citizens. In this case you can apply for Hungarian citizenship right after you received the Immigration Card.

The President of Hungary approves a certificate of naturalization or a certificate of repatriation. This deed acts as a legal document for the acquisition of Hungarian citizenship. At the end of the naturalization process the applicant swears a citizenship-oath and becomes a Hungarian citizen.

william409 wrote:

....
I would like to know if someone else has acquired Hungarian citizenship via marriage or registered partnerships (in the case of same-sex couples) and how difficult was it? And the time required, bureaucracy faced, etc.

Hungary does not recognise same sex marriage by virtue of a constitutional ban. See here: LGBT in Hungary. 

Of particular interest is the case of same sex marriages made elsewhere in the EU.  A very recent ruling (June 2018) forces Hungary to recognise them and give say residence rights to the spouse.  Hungary is way out of step with most EU countries on this.  You can read about it here: ECJ Ruling on Same Sex Marriage Recognition.

Would be interesting to see if someone manages to get their residence rights here based on a sex-same marriage made elsewhere in the EU.  And moreover, an interesting test would be where a same sex third country national marries a HU citizen in another EU country and then applies for full residency rights for their spouse.

Moving on....there's a bit of a relaxtion on obtaining citizenship - if the third country national is the parent of a child HU citizen.  Then the time is 3 years. However, apart from that, one still has to pass the HU language test. 

But should be easier to do on the medicine course.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Would be interesting to see if someone manages to get their residence rights here based on a sex-same marriage made elsewhere in the EU.  And moreover, an interesting test would be where a same sex third country national marries a HU citizen in another EU country and then applies for full residency rights for their spouse.

Good point that..... things are slowly changing though a little off topic.

Registered partnerships (German: Eingetragene Partnerschaft) have been legal in Austria since 1 January 2010. Following a decision of the Constitutional Court in December 2017, same-sex marriage will become automatically legal from 1 January 2019, unless the Austrian Parliament amends the marriage laws before then.

SimCityAT wrote:

fluffy2560 wrote:

Would be interesting to see if someone manages to get their residence rights here based on a sex-same marriage made elsewhere in the EU.  And moreover, an interesting test would be where a same sex third country national marries a HU citizen in another EU country and then applies for full residency rights for their spouse.

Good point that..... things are slowly changing though a little off topic.

Registered partnerships (German: Eingetragene Partnerschaft) have been legal in Austria since 1 January 2010. Following a decision of the Constitutional Court in December 2017, same-sex marriage will become automatically legal from 1 January 2019, unless the Austrian Parliament amends the marriage laws before then.

Interesting slow change policy in Austria.  The stupid thing is that all those that are against it and said the world would come to an end will get used to it and moreover, in 20 years or less, no-one will think anything about it.   Not the end of the world. 

I only mentioned it as the OP had it in brackets so yes, only a touch bit off topic.  Might be an avenue to explore for the OP depending on the circumstances.

I would like to thank each and everyone of you for replying to my query. However, it is still a bit unanswered so I will give in a bit more details.

Now, the next thing I am about to say would obviously make a few eyeballs roll in disgust but please bear with me. I beg you to please refrain from judging or taking the moral high ground and go around policing. I am not a bad person or a criminal or any of that sorts, however my current passport, while not bad; it is pretty shit.

Now the burning question for me;

What is the best way to achieve a Hungarian citizenship (as I have two options);

Option 1 A marriage of convenience in which both parties are aware? (illegal with drastic consequences if caught)

Option 2 "A non-Hungarian citizen may be naturalized on preferential terms if he or she has been residing in Hungary for at least five consecutive years prior to the date of submission of theapplication and if the conditions set out in points b) to e) of paragraph (1) are met provided that:
a) he or she was born in the territory of Hungary;
b) he or she established residence in Hungary before reaching the legal age;
c) he or she is stateless. "
Source: the government of Hungary's website.

Now, I feel the option 1 is way too risky and has the potential to ruin my career. Also, I am not straight so it would be more difficult to  find anyone who can cooperate. I can't opt for registered partnership option as I am not out about my sexual orientation and being gay is still seen a bit negatively here.

I feel more comfortable with option 2 as I fall in subsection (b) as I received my residence card (hence established residence) 2 months prior to my 18th birthday (when I became of the legal age. But I do not know if this will ever count?

The REASON I am not so inclined towards the 8 year option is that it will demand for me to stay a minimum of 3 more years ( 2 years after graduation to work here; very bad wages for doctors, and one or more years for the application and bureaucracy to go through)

I really appreciate each and everyone who can give some insight. I will be truly thankful.

Best Regards,
William

william409 wrote:

I wanted to ask if it possible to marry a Hungarian national for citizenship?

No. You can not marry a Hungarian for citizenship.

Marriage only shortens the length of time you have to reside in Hungary to apply for citizenship. And I am pretty sure that application process is the same, if you are married, or just lived here 8 years by yourself. But, to know the current law, this is the office to contact with your question:

http://www.bmbah.hu/index.php?option=co … mp;lang=en

william409 wrote:

The REASON I am not so inclined towards the 8 year option is that it will demand for me to stay a minimum of 3 more years ( 2 years after graduation to work here; very bad wages for doctors, and one or more years for the application and bureaucracy to go through)

So basically, it seems, you want to get Hungarian citizenship to stay in the EU. Okay. No judgment on that. Option 2 is possible. Go as the office at the link I provided above to see if you would qualify in the future. That seems to me the most reasonable fact based step to start with.

But......

Why do you think you need citizenship? Plenty of third country doctors in all EU Countries, without citizenship in those countries. Just apply for jobs abroad after graduation. Or even consider other places. Such as Canada. There are plenty of years before you graduate. Anything could happen. Putting all your eggs, so to speak, in Hungary is possibly a mistake. What, for example -- taking a wild example -- , what would happen if Hungary left the EU? Then your HU passport may be a liability.

Quite frankly.... There are many possible options for you in the future. Be careful painting yourself into corner.

Worth taking note, from my understanding, there is a shortage of doctors and nurses across Europe, Austria, Germany, UK just to name a few.

Hello Klsallee!
Thanks for taking out time to reply to my query. I shall clear out the doubts by answering the questions and assumptions in your reply.

1) I do not want to explicitly stay in the E.U. because I would be going to the U.S.A. for my residency training. However, having a E.U. passport really cuts the amount of bureaucracy needed to go from one EU country to the other. The increased mobility is a big motivation for me. I would like to travel Visa free not only within the EU but also to other countries if my job demands of me. My current passport is really and I mean really not good in the matter, Klsallee.

I need citizenship because of the following reasons;
i) International Mobility. Having more than one passport affords you greater freedom to travel if a country has entry or length-of- stay restrictions.  Most countries have established such entry requirements.
ii) Employment Mobility. Simply put, an EU passport enables the holder to seek employment without immigration restriction.
iii) Residential Mobility. As in, live in any EU member country you desire.
iv) Benefits available only to citizens. As a citizen of the European Union, you are able to avail yourself of all of the rights and privileges offered by the country in which you reside, no matter which member country that might be.  Health, education, unemployment programs, pensions and the like are all benefits to which you would be entitled with EU citizenship.

You see Klsallee, there are numerous benefits of having an EU passport, I have listed just some of them.

"Plenty of third country doctors in all EU Countries, without citizenship in those countries. Just apply for jobs abroad after graduation. Or even consider other places. Such as Canada. There are plenty of years before you graduate. Anything could happen. Putting all your eggs, so to speak, in Hungary is possibly a mistake. What, for example -- taking a wild example -- , what would happen if Hungary left the EU? Then your HU passport may be a liability.
Quite frankly.... There are many possible options for you in the future. Be careful painting yourself into corner."

Yes, but as I said, I want it for the reasons listed above and not only for work. If Hungary leaves the EU and I do get a citizenship before that; and if I find that the cons vs pros ratio is a disaster, then I can simply renounce my Hungarian citizenship, theoretically speaking.
Within the next 5-6 years, Hungary is my safest best, I think so. But please, if you have any other suggestion, I am all ears

Thanks once again for your reply.

klsallee wrote:

william409 wrote:

The REASON I am not so inclined towards the 8 year option is that it will demand for me to stay a minimum of 3 more years ( 2 years after graduation to work here; very bad wages for doctors, and one or more years for the application and bureaucracy to go through)

So basically, it seems, you want to get Hungarian citizenship to stay in the EU. Okay. No judgment on that. Option 2 is possible. Go as the office at the link I provided above to see if you would qualify in the future. That seems to me the most reasonable fact based step to start with.

But......

Why do you think you need citizenship? Plenty of third country doctors in all EU Countries, without citizenship in those countries. Just apply for jobs abroad after graduation. Or even consider other places. Such as Canada. There are plenty of years before you graduate. Anything could happen. Putting all your eggs, so to speak, in Hungary is possibly a mistake. What, for example -- taking a wild example -- , what would happen if Hungary left the EU? Then your HU passport may be a liability.

Quite frankly.... There are many possible options for you in the future. Be careful painting yourself into corner.

I'll chip back in here and echo what has been said. 

BTW, no-one here in these forums cares if you are gay even if a lot of Hungarians (statistically) are utterly ignorant and anti-gay - all stirred up by right wing factions.  And, if they did care, they should leave  this forum and go somewhere else. 

What you want are the facts and a plan but that's based upon the here and now.  The problem is trying to work out what will happen here in 8 years time.  No-one knows of course. 

Anyway, this is a tough one but not as bad as some.  Forgive me if I get this wrong.  You do your 5-6 years medical studies and then do 2 years residency in the hospital hence 8 years.  Then you either go and do something else or become a GP or get on the Consultant track.    So clearly you are OK insofar for the next 7 years if needed (1 year down).  You need to do that time anyway.

After 5-6 years, you'll be in more demand.  And a lot of medics leave here and go West where attitudes are more liberal, pay higher and there's more interesting, well resourced work.  A British or Canadian passport is probably more useful than a Hungarian one.  Maybe you could do your residency in another country?  Like the UK?  If you go there, you'd be paid the same as other junior doctors.

BTW, you are not alone here - Mrs Fluffy's baby doctor originally came from Iran - went through the university of Debrecen.  He was good at his job and spoke reasonable Hungarian. His specialty was OBGYN which he is banned from doing in Iran.  He's doing his own private practice as well so I think he has money.

Unless there's something pressing, why don't you just put these concerns on hold for a couple of years and see what the situation is then?

Not exactly sure how to give you any advice without sounding a bit judgemental.
Not my intention to do that.
One thing, you are a legal resident right now of HUngary and I suppose are going to medical school with some sort of grant or aid?
If so, what's so wrong about giving back 3 years of working as a doctor in Hungary after you finish school.
I know that you will need a few lab rats to work on to proffect your doctoring skills.
You will not be an expert even after 6 years of school.
I know, not the same thing but after spending 1,600 hours in cosmetology  school, I still had to sweep floors and wash hair before I was allowed to touch an actual paying client, took a good 6 months before you could even work the floor in a good salon.
Same thing I'd guess with being a doctor, no one wants to be your first client.
Get some practice under your belt before wanting to make a killing at playing God.
We were only, "Hair Gods," and not too  many people die of a bad haircut, although to hear them scream you'd think so.

As far as a "fake" marriage. Don't do it.
If found out it could seriously ruin your schooling, they may just kick you out of the country.
Right now your would be wife might agree with it but who can read the future?
She may decide to actually fall for someone and want to end your marriage early or you may find someone yourself.She may turn into a enemy and use this knowledge against you for ranson etc.
I know, I've lived long enough to see some dark stuff.

My son was married to a HU women and sorry to say, I doubt they could of stayed together 6 years and they actually were in love at one time.
They also do keep an eye out for scam marriages.
My son is now married in the US to a Japanese lady and they had to have written letters in detail from people stating they were a real couple for his wife to get her resident permit to stay in the US. She will very soon get her US citizen ship but she did the time.
You're probably young and in a hurry, slow down and relax, enjoy your school years you still have just begun. Allot of things can happen in 6 years time.
If you are really good at being a medical worker then you shouldn't worry about making money, it will come in time, first learn your trade.

william409 wrote:

....You see Klsallee, there are numerous benefits of having an EU passport, I have listed just some of them. ...... If Hungary leaves the EU and I do get a citizenship before that; and if I find that the cons vs pros ratio is a disaster, then I can simply renounce my Hungarian citizenship, theoretically speaking.
Within the next 5-6 years, Hungary is my safest best, I think so. But please, if you have any other suggestion, I am all ears

Thanks once again for your reply.

Hungary doesn't care about dual nationality - my kids are dual nationals.  You wouldn't need to renounce it if you obtained another one.  I am assuming here, you are from a country that doesn't recognise dual citizenship like Iran.  Recognise and disallow are different things. 

BTW, you might consider alternatives for residency - if possible - like going to Grenada*.  That's time recognised/accredited in the EU and in the USA I believe.   Just a thought.

*My info might be old - I looked at it some years ago when my eldest thought about doing medicine.

You did said about EU passports, in fact, all countries are different.

The world's 25 most powerful passports
1. Germany, 176 countries can be visited without a visa

2. Sweden, 175

=3. Denmark, Finland, Italy, Spain, United States, 174

=8. Austria, Belgium, France, Luxembourg, Netherlands, Norway, Singapore, United Kingdom, 173

=16. Ireland, Japan, New Zealand, 172

=19. Canada, Greece, Portugal, Switzerland, 171

=23. Australia, South Korea, 170

25. Iceland, 169

HI Mr. Fluffy,

Thanks a lot for your valuable input.
I would like to clarify some things here;

"Anyway, this is a tough one but not as bad as some.  Forgive me if I get this wrong.  You do your 5-6 years medical studies and then do 2 years residency in the hospital hence 8 years.  Then you either go and do something else or become a GP or get on the Consultant track.    So clearly you are OK insofar for the next 7 years if needed (1 year down).  You need to do that time anyway. "

It does not work here like that hon because you have 2.1 years basic training + X number of years depending on the subject chosen. Plus I would have to pay here a fortune to get the residency training as I am third country national who is enrolled in the English language program and not the Hungarian one.  Also, I am pretty sure the training is almost always in Hungarian and I am not okay with that. Learning conversational Hungarian is one thing, however having your whole training in the said language is a completely different scenario. 
However, if the 5 year option does apply to me, I can be out of here after graduation and one year work most probably.

"A British or Canadian passport is probably more useful than a Hungarian one.  Maybe you could do your residency in another country?  Like the UK?  If you go there, you'd be paid the same as other junior doctors."
Both UK and Canada need the person applying for citizenship to stay for a given period of years (mostly 5 and above).  Please remember a US residency is recognized and valued (with a possibility of exemption from any country-specific licensing examination) in far more number of places when compared to a U.K. or Canadian medical residency. If I do not acquire the Hungarian citizenship during my number of years I will spend here, then it'll be a waste of time. No country beats USA in terms of freedom to practice internationally and financial compensation to doctors.

"Unless there's something pressing, why don't you just put these concerns on hold for a couple of years and see what the situation is then?"

Yes Mr. Fluffy, there is no pressing concern but I was curious and wanted to know the options I had earlier on. I didn't want to start thinking until it was too late.

Thanks for your reply. 

Hello Miss Marilyn,

Thank for taking out time to reply to my post. Here are a few things I would like to clarify;

"One thing, you are a legal resident right now of HUngary and I suppose are going to medical school with some sort of grant or aid?
If so, what's so wrong about giving back 3 years of working as a doctor in Hungary after you finish school."

I am self financing student (paid by parents) paying 18200 U.S. dollars a year in tuition fees and also have to pay approximately 7000 U.S. $ for my living expenses/ year plus the expenses of books and apps and appliances purchased to make med school a bit easier.  So I would prefer not losing my wages in a place which pays peanuts for salaries to doctors and expects long working hours. 

"As far as a "fake" marriage. Don't do it."

Yes, I agree with that. It would potentially jeopardize my whole life.

I hope things are going well for your son and daughter-in-law. Thanks Ms. Marilyn.

Hello SimCityAT,

You're right. All countries are different. Here is the Global passport index 2018 in which Hungary is at the 4th Global rank, sharing that place with some other countries as well.
Source: https://www.passportindex.org/byRank.php

All the countries you have mentioned would require me to live in their country for a continuous period of X year (mostly 5 and above). So it is less relevant to me currently as I am bound to stay here for another 5-6 years in Hungary.

Thanks for your reply.

william409 wrote:

Hello Miss Marilyn,

Thank for taking out time to reply to my post. Here are a few things I would like to clarify;

"One thing, you are a legal resident right now of HUngary and I suppose are going to medical school with some sort of grant or aid?
If so, what's so wrong about giving back 3 years of working as a doctor in Hungary after you finish school."

I am self financing student (parent) paying 18200 U.S. dollars a year in tuition fees and also have to pay approximately 7000 U.S. $ for my living expenses/ year plus the expenses of books and apps and appliances purchased to make med school a bit easier.  So I would prefer not losing my wages in a place which pays peanuts for salaries to doctors and expects long working hours. 

"As far as a "fake" marriage. Don't do it."

Yes, I agree with that. It would potentially jeopardize my whole life.

I hope things are going well for your son and daughter-in-law. Thanks Ms. Marilyn.

I see, even so that is a bit less then going to school say per year in the US unless one has a grant.
Right now even 9 months of beauty school in the US costs about $30,000. Insanely high considering hairdressers can make between $25,00 to well over $100,000 plus a year.
All depends on how hard you push yourself and how talented you are.
Students also must buy all their own beauty equipment, shears can cost hundreds or even thousands of dollars, I know hard to believe that.
Maybe you can move to another EU country later on to go forward with your medical education?
My cousin is Hungarian and she and her Hungarian husband went to medical school in Hungary but moved about 25 years ago to the UK. Their daughter was born in the UK and now is going to medical school in the UK.
My cousin and her husband had to put in some year here in Hungary but now they have a nice life in Kent. The do medical research.They even work together.
My old friend in Hawaii has a son that is still a resident doctor in Honolulu. No big bucks just yet but he is doing his time and learning on the job.
Wish you the best of luck, things do work out in life and if you stick on course it usually turns out great.

william409 wrote:

HI Mr. Fluffy,

.....It does not work here like that hon because you have 2.1 years basic training + X number of years depending on the subject chosen. Plus I would have to pay here a fortune to get the residency training as I am third country national who is enrolled in the English language program and not the Hungarian one.  Also, I am pretty sure the training is almost always in Hungarian and I am not okay with that. Learning conversational Hungarian is one thing, however having your whole training in the said language is a completely different scenario. 
However, if the 5 year option does apply to me, I can be out of here after graduation and one year work most probably.

"A British or Canadian passport is probably more useful than a Hungarian one.  Maybe you could do your residency in another country?  Like the UK?  If you go there, you'd be paid the same as other junior doctors."
Both UK and Canada need the person applying for citizenship to stay for a given period of years (mostly 5 and above).  Please remember a US residency is recognized and valued (with a possibility of exemption from any country-specific licensing examination) in far more number of places when compared to a U.K. or Canadian medical residency. If I do not acquire the Hungarian citizenship during my number of years I will spend here, then it'll be a waste of time. No country beats USA in terms of freedom to practice internationally and financial compensation to doctors.

Thanks for your reply. 

Ok you know.

I thought here, one had to learn sufficient Hungarian to deal with the patients, even on the English track.     

Years ago, my interpreter's husband was an oncologist.  They went to the US and even though he was a top consultant here, he had to do the residency there again. I believe he was pretty fast at it  getting through it (obviously) but he still had to do it and not in a great place - Detroit.  I understood it was to do with the licensing as you said, rather than recognition of the degrees themselves.  Ultimately I believe it came down to getting practice insurance.  That was all a long time ago.

But I can see you want to be efficient with your time and try and parallel the two things - medical school and nationality.

But don't discount other places - maybe Malta, Ireland even.  A lot of doctors on residency in the UK are from other countries - even places like Korea and definitely from places like Nigeria - but they did their training in the UK but I cannot see that EU qualifications wouldn't be acceptable for residency even post-Brexit. 

There's a bit of a shortage of doctors in the UK as many of them, especially trauma specialists, end up going to Australia or NZ.  Then they get to fly about in and jump out of helicopters.

My cousin's husband didn't do that in his speciality, but went to the UAE. He went for the money (as he's closer to retirement), nicer weather and the golf.   

I looked at Canada once and the fastest track then to citizenship is about 3 years.  At least in Canada it's more liberal than some of the truly moronic sheep like thinking hereabouts.

william409 wrote:

i) International Mobility. Having more than one passport affords you greater freedom to travel if a country has entry or length-of- stay restrictions.  Most countries have established such entry requirements.

I have traveled a lot on business. The "worst" was Vietnam, where I had to mail in my passport to the Vietnamese embassy and get a travel visa. Quite frankly, most people can visit most any country in the world with most any passport (some countries are of course exceptions). It is just takes a little bit more planning and time for some than for others. You may be different, but I don't see a bit of a paperwork wait all that much a big deal to visit a country.

william409 wrote:

ii) Employment Mobility. Simply put, an EU passport enables the holder to seek employment without immigration restriction.

Quite a few medical professionals in my family. Including two MDs. For an MD, unless you work exclusively for a state health system or hospital (lowest pay), you mostly should find a place and take root there long term, to be successful if you want to build a private practice (highest pay), and that takes years. I would not put "work mobility" high on a list for a doctor. If you were a engineer, or similar highly mobile profession, that would be different.

william409 wrote:

iv) Benefits available only to citizens. As a citizen of the European Union, you are able to avail yourself of all of the rights and privileges offered by the country in which you reside, no matter which member country that might be.  Health, education, unemployment programs, pensions and the like are all benefits to which you would be entitled with EU citizenship.

You see this wrong, and that may be part of the problem.

I am not a Hungarian citizen. Not even an EU citizen. Just a permanent resident. But I have almost all the rights and privileges of a Hungarian citizen. If you live here long enough, and pay your taxes, you get those rights, including all social welfare systems. I only don't have certain citizen politically oriented rights, such as the right to vote in national elections.

klsallee wrote:

I only don't have certain citizen politically oriented rights, such as the right to vote in national elections.

Are you able to vote in local elections?

SimCityAT wrote:

klsallee wrote:

I only don't have certain citizen politically oriented rights, such as the right to vote in national elections.

Are you able to vote in local elections?

As a US citizen, I was told I could not by the local regional government office, and was shown the lack of US-EU-HU treaty to backed up this claim. But I know another US citizen, in another part of Hungary, who threatened to sue if he did not get to vote, so he was given it. Honestly, local governments are overall pretty clueless and often don't know the law well and what is correct and up to date or not. I have not bothered to pursue it further as that would probably require a competent attorney (something else not common here for me locally). Which is why I only mentioned national elections, because that is pretty clearly known.

klsallee wrote:

william409 wrote:

i) International Mobility. Having more than one passport affords you greater freedom to travel if a country has entry or length-of- stay restrictions.  Most countries have established such entry requirements.

I have traveled a lot on business. The "worst" was Vietnam, where I had to mail in my passport to the Vietnamese embassy and get a travel visa. Quite frankly, most people can visit most any country in the world with most any passport (some countries are of course exceptions). It is just takes a little bit more planning and time for some than for others. You may be different, but I don't see a bit of a paperwork wait all that much a big deal to visit a country.....

Bit off topic my reply...

I didn't have any problem with the Vietnamese here but you are in the sticks. 

They were very fast and cooperative but it did need two trips which was a nuisance.

Worst one was some years ago at the Nigerian Embassy where I first got refused as I wasn't Hungarian.  I reapplied in Vienna and I had no problem there. I reckon they were angling for some cash here. 

Mongolia was painful - they will only accept bank based Euro payments for the visa, so I had to go to a bank, get some HUF, swap it to EUR, then pay it in over the counter.  Took me best part of an afternoon as their embassy is relatively awkward to get to in District II.

For me was Russia, applying online with all the questions...... You only get a certain amount of time to fill it in. In the end, I got the Travel agent to do it for me.

Hello Klsallee,

"Quite frankly, most people can visit most any country in the world with most any passport (some countries are of course exceptions). It is just takes a little bit more planning and time for some than for others. You may be different, but I don't see a bit of a paperwork wait all that much a big deal to visit a country."

Well, I CAN visit the countries, however, I need to apply for visa or other documents in advance. Sometimes even months before. I think I should make my point more clear to you. A Hungarian passport allows Visa free travel/Visa on arrival for 163 countries where as mine allows only to 59. It is not only a question of time needed but also the bureaucracy and extra fees I must deal with EACH time. It is ridiculous. I remember the time I was first coming to Hungary after my admission. I had to fill a lengthy form, pay 70 Euros in application fees, give lots of other documents (like bank statement, health insurance, medical tests), which are perfectly reasonable in my opinion. But I needed quite some time to gather the documents and book an appointment with the embassy.
But, if I was a US passport holder, I could have come here without visa and stayed for up to 90 days. Do you see the difference?
If in future, I ever needed to visit any country, having a Hungarian passport gives me the luxury of not having to deal with most of this and just book a flight ticket and hotel.
Now, I don't want to divulge too much info but I'll give one more example. My father works in the middle east and my family lives there as well. However, because of the passport I hold, I have to apply for visit visa even to visit my family. I can't suddenly make plans to even visit them! Have to apply 1-2 weeks in advance.

"You see this wrong, and that may be part of the problem.

I am not a Hungarian citizen. Not even an EU citizen. Just a permanent resident. But I have almost all the rights and privileges of a Hungarian citizen. If you live here long enough, and pay your taxes, you get those rights, including all social welfare systems. I only don't have certain citizen politically oriented rights, such as the right to vote in national elections."


Well I am not a permanent resident and please also see the eligibility criteria because I didn't see one single point where it says a third country national is eligible for permanent residence after being engaged in gainful employment for X number of years.
Source:
http://www.bmbah.hu/index.php?option=co … mp;lang=en

They DON'T give these right to just anyone who seems to live there for a particular period of time and pay taxes.  Now the key term which you said is "long enough". First of all, What do you mean by that? There is no rule or law regarding if someone lives "long enough" , give them all the said benefits minus the voting rights. Second of all, I do not want to live here "long enough". The whole point of opening this thread was how to obtain citizenship in the least amount of time and most legal way possible.

Thanks for your reply

william409 wrote:

But, if I was a US passport holder, I could have come here without visa and stayed for up to 90 days. Do you see the difference?

Yes, I already said I see the difference. And as I already said, for me and in my opinion, not having visa free travel is just a hoop one must jump through, as I have indeed done. That is, annoying, but not the end of the world.

william409 wrote:

Well I am not a permanent resident

Even just long term residents also get those rights. The only "right" a permanent resident has is they can not be kicked out of the country so easily. Permanent residents have thus an added "security" in their residence. A long term resident can live here for decades and still have all the same rights as a permanent resident. You live here. You are subject to all the rules and laws of the country where you live. You may also be subject to the laws of your home country, like I am (I have to file taxes in the USA each an every year for example).

william409 wrote:

Now the key term which you said is "long enough". First of all, What do you mean by that? There is no rule or law regarding if someone lives "long enough"

Actually, there are laws defining the time for each issue. The current time to get retirement is to work in Hungary for 20 years. And so on.

I have lived here over a decade. So I do know, maybe just a few things about this (and maybe more than many others due to my wife's government, and other, work in Hungary).

william409 wrote:

Second of all, I do not want to live here "long enough". The whole point of opening this thread was how to obtain citizenship in the least amount of time and most legal way possible.

Any of these things take time. You are young and with youth there is impatience. Looking for a short cut. It is okay to try. I was young once, so I understand. But with age comes wisdom. Don't assume what I say is wrong or that, in the end, you can avoid taking the time needed. There are maybe no legal short cuts. Which is the basic answer to your thread.