Brexit and its implications for British, HU and any other citizens

    I sent off one of my kid's UK passport for renewal about 2 weeks ago.   Under 16s only get 5  year passports.  I sent it off early as it expires in September 2024 but thought it would be best to do asap due to holiday seasons etc. Effectively a child's British post-Brexit passport is  only valid for 4.5 years. It has to be valid for 3 months after the longest period one could be in another country (i.e. 90 days) plus another 90 days, namely 180 days or 0.5 years.
It's taken Magyar Posta 13 days to get it to the UK from Hungary.   Previously it would have been there in 3 days, possibly 5 days.

Tracking shows it's now in Langley (near Slough/Heathrow)

I think, possibly, we'll get  it back sometime at the end of April.  So that could possibly be 2 months for a turnaround.

This must be a Brexit benefit - ultra slow mail. 
   

    -@fluffy2560

It's about 10 -14 days from Austria.

Got mine back in 4 days; I was astounded.

Brexit complications (maybe?).

Bit of a rant:

Still waiting for a  new passport back from the UK for one of our kids.  This is a passport renewal, it's not a new application for a child passport for a child who has not had a passport before.  Kids passports only last 5 years.

They are a right shower and very badly organised.  And stupid too. 

Process for a renewal is to do it all online and then send supporting documentation by post.  With dual nationality, they want a colour copy of EVERY page of the foreign passport.  Why? What's it got to do with them.  And of course, the old passport.  OK, we can live with all that, we did it before 5 years ago.

We get conflicting e-mails. 

The countersigner (for confirming identity) in our case is an Irish citizen.  We received an e-mail message that EU, Commonwealth or US citizens must send a colour copy of their passport details page. 

However, we received a message saying British and Irish citizens don't need to send this copy. However, we then get another e-mail saying they do.  So I got them on the "customer services" chat and it turns out the message about not sending a colour copy of the countersigner if Irish is erroneous. I asked for an explanation of why we were sent this e-mail - the responding agent had no idea.  Great.

They also want my kid's Hungarian birth certificate - they've had this before anyway but want it again. Why?  Apparently no documentation before is used in a passport application. It has to be sent again. WTF?  This makes no sense. If they approved an application before they've already seen it.

Anyway, this birth certificate is internationalised and is in Hungarian, French and English.  So no translation right?  There is one line in the notes that says (in Hungarian) "Father is a British citizen".   Let's see if they ask for that one line to be translated officially.  Luckily we know a few official translators to can do that.  But it'll take another 3 weeks for the post etc.

Apparently the birth certificate is an indication (to them) that I have parental responsibility.  Well, of course, this is dips**t stupid because birth certificates do not show who has parental responsibility.  It merely says who the parents are.  In the meantime, parental responsibility could have been given to someone else by a court/judge.  And they've already seen it before.  So it's utter nonsense. 

It's getting so annoying I could complain to my local MP.  It's a problem.  I could still try it on. Even if I'm not actually on the electoral register myself any more.   

Oh, and in an addendum to my efforts to get our 18 year old on to electoral register in the UK, our 18 year old was refused permission to vote as they cannot verify I am eligible to vote.   

This all seems silly to me.  I could be protesting about it by not being on the register myself. 

Partially I think they think they are being vigilant.  But they are just being pathetically annoying.

All I can offer is that in similar circumstances, ie dual national, renewal existing document, mine took 4 days with none of the hassle you’ve had; the only significant difference is it’s a child document, so I suspect (and hope) that they have a more rigid process.

Oh and BTW...

All the new cameras and facial recognition system at the passport desks at BUD airport seem to have been removed.   

Only thing left is the fingerprint reader.   

Don't know why.

    All I can offer is that in similar circumstances, ie dual national, renewal existing document, mine took 4 days with none of the hassle you’ve had; the only significant difference is it’s a child document, so I suspect (and hope) that they have a more rigid process.
   

    -@Cynic

What I don't understand is why they want the same documentation they already have?

Last time I deliberately applied for child passports from within the UK. 

We had far less problems then.

I obviously need to remind myself again not to do it from outside the country.

        All I can offer is that in similar circumstances, ie dual national, renewal existing document, mine took 4 days with none of the hassle you’ve had; the only significant difference is it’s a child document, so I suspect (and hope) that they have a more rigid process.        -@Cynic

What I don't understand is why they want the same documentation they already have?

Last time I deliberately applied for child passports from within the UK. 

We had far less problems then.

I obviously need to remind myself again not to do it from outside the country.
   

    -@fluffy2560

Perhaps you were a victim of the % check.  It used to be common practice in the Home Office to do random 100% checks of filed personal documents.  Alternatively, they could just be trying to piss you off.

Perhaps you were a victim of the % check.  It used to be common practice in the Home Office to do random 100% checks of filed personal documents.  Alternatively, they could just be trying to piss you off.
   

    -@Cynic

Well, that's wrong.  100% random checks is wasteful of resources.  They should be targeting resources according to risk scoring or intelligence received.  That's an oxymoron, government intelligence.

Personally I think they are full of sh**t and bloody minded.  It's only because we're not in the UK and our kid is a minor.

I have a feeling the next escalation will be a face to face interview.   

And where? How we would be able to arrange that, I do not know! And who is paying?

Could be at the Embassy but I think they won't do that sort of thing now.  Here they sold the UK Embassy downtown for many millions.  They moved to an uninteresting office building they apparently share with the Dutch Embassy.  Never been there but it's not far away.  I don't know what they do there anyway.  Sit around eating cucumber sandwiches and drinking Earl Grey.

If they ask for an in-person interview in the UK, I will have to abandon the application and will take it up with "my MP".   He's a Tory so probably isn't interested in anything unless it does something for him personally.

    Perhaps you were a victim of the % check.  It used to be common practice in the Home Office to do random 100% checks of filed personal documents.  Alternatively, they could just be trying to piss you off.        -@Cynic

Well, that's wrong.  100% random checks is wasteful of resources.  They should be targeting resources according to risk scoring or intelligence received.  That's an oxymoron, government intelligence.

Personally I think they are full of sh**t and bloody minded.  It's only because we're not in the UK and our kid is a minor.

I have a feeling the next escalation will be a face to face interview.   

And where? How we would be able to arrange that, I do not know! And who is paying?

Could be at the Embassy but I think they won't do that sort of thing now.  Here they sold the UK Embassy downtown for many millions.  They moved to an uninteresting office building they apparently share with the Dutch Embassy.  Never been there but it's not far away.  I don't know what they do there anyway.  Sit around eating cucumber sandwiches and drinking Earl Grey.

If they ask for an in-person interview in the UK, I will have to abandon the application and will take it up with "my MP".   He's a Tory so probably isn't interested in anything unless it does something for him personally.
   

    -@fluffy2560

Well, it's somewhere between the 2, we know it's not 100% because they didn't ask me to produce anything at all, and you got to produce some; these things are normally decided by the process - like how many boxes got ticked - it's automatic, there is no person deciding this, the quality check of that process will be the audit procedures; if you're not happy, I'd write to them and ask for an explanation.

I just asked my kids (all dual nationals); the twins both lived in the UK at the time they last renewed and had a similar experience to me (applied online and got their new passport back within a week), the one that lived in the EU when she last renewed tells me that she applied online, again no request for extra paperwork, but it took 4 weeks - in the meantime she had her Dutch passport that she could use.  Her husband did a lot of running around to get his UK residency (mainly checking his qualifications were what he said), but it took about 6 weeks, and he picked it up from the central Post Office in Leeds.  My son had a short break in Spain last week and came back yesterday, he travelled on his UK passport and had no hassle either way; probably lucky I guess.

Just out of interest, my wife renewed her Dutch passport last time we were in Holland; she phoned up the Gemeente on Monday to make an appointment, they saw her the next day, they took photos and filled in the form for her, she just signed it, and she got a call to pick it up on the Friday; I was dreading having to notify the Home Office (she has permanent UK residency) of the change in ID; I went online, ticked a few boxes and then was asked to place the new passport on top of her IPhone, it made some buzzing noises, the computer screen refreshed and said I had been sent her new document (I'd previously chosen PDF), it was in her e-mail when I picked her phone up and looked.  When we got back to Hull the following Sunday, the Immigration computer had already been updated.

Just spoke to my wife (she's in Germany visiting her sister atm), she flew from Leeds to Schiphol last Thursday; she had no problems with Immigration at either end. The border NL/D was open, no checks, she's been flitting around both countries, no Immigration checks at all, in fact the joint Immigration building at Gronau has gone, probably been bought by the adjacent Old People's home.

Here's a weird one post-Brexit.

I received a letter from the Hungarian Election body telling me I am eligible to vote in the forthcoming European Parliamentary elections.

I'm no longer an EU citizen!

Mrs F says it's because I live in Hungary.   She says that's what's written on the official letter.  Well OK then.

I thought all my rights had gone when the Brexit hammer came down. and we were disenfranchised. 

Apparently it seems we cannot vote in the UK but can do here.   Curiouser and curiouser.

The border NL/D was open, no checks, she's been flitting around both countries, no Immigration checks at all, in fact the joint Immigration building at Gronau has gone, probably been bought by the adjacent Old People's home.
   

    -@Cynic

I think we've just had bad luck what with our kid being a minor and us being here.   Posted off more required documents today.  Luckily our countersigner had a scan of his Irish passport and I could print out a colour copy to attach.   

Kids only use the British passports to enter the UK.  So  they get on the plane with HU passports, then use the machines to enter the UK on their British passports.  Coming back, they use their Hungarian passports of course. 

Anyway, HMG is looking more badly run that ever these days.   HM Passports should have just asked for all this at the beginning and then I wouldn't have had to spend like £25 on postage in sending supporting documents and wasting a lot our time, I reckon it's cost me about 5h to 8h so far. I could have got away with spending about £10 on postage and spending 10m queuing at the post office.  That 5h to 8h lost could have been spent more productively gardening or watching old movies or even working.

I think Gronau was a border crossing I went through in the late 1980s and where they insisted on a heavy inspection of my rental car apart.  I was younger,  didn't know what I was doing, or where I was and just drove around one Sunday in a company provided car.   I think they spent about an hour on it.   I just watched.  I didn't care, it wasn't my car.       

    Here's a weird one post-Brexit.
I received a letter from the Hungarian Election body telling me I am eligible to vote in the forthcoming European Parliamentary elections.

I'm no longer an EU citizen!

Mrs F says it's because I live in Hungary.   She says that's what's written on the official letter.  Well OK then.

I thought all my rights had gone when the Brexit hammer came down. and we were disenfranchised. 

Apparently it seems we cannot vote in the UK but can do here.   Curiouser and curiouser.
   

    -@fluffy2560

That is strange because you are not allowed to vote in the European Elections.

That said I am still allowed to vote in my local elections. It's down to the discretion of the town. 

        Here's a weird one post-Brexit.I received a letter from the Hungarian Election body telling me I am eligible to vote in the forthcoming European Parliamentary elections.I'm no longer an EU citizen!Mrs F says it's because I live in Hungary.   She says that's what's written on the official letter.  Well OK then.I thought all my rights had gone when the Brexit hammer came down. and we were disenfranchised.  Apparently it seems we cannot vote in the UK but can do here.   Curiouser and curiouser.         -@fluffy2560

That is strange because you are not allowed to vote in the European Elections.

That said I am still allowed to vote in my local elections. It's down to the discretion of the town. 
   

    -@SimCityAT

Maybe that's it.  Maybe it's local elections.  But Mrs F said specifically it's European elections.   I think they've made a mistake.  Everyone here over 18 has exactly the same letter.  So it's a bit of an odd one.

            Here's a weird one post-Brexit.I received a letter from the Hungarian Election body telling me I am eligible to vote in the forthcoming European Parliamentary elections.I'm no longer an EU citizen!Mrs F says it's because I live in Hungary.   She says that's what's written on the official letter.  Well OK then.I thought all my rights had gone when the Brexit hammer came down. and we were disenfranchised.  Apparently it seems we cannot vote in the UK but can do here.   Curiouser and curiouser.         -@fluffy2560That is strange because you are not allowed to vote in the European Elections.That said I am still allowed to vote in my local elections. It's down to the discretion of the town.          -@SimCityAT

Maybe that's it.  Maybe it's local elections.  But Mrs F said specifically it's European elections.   I think they've made a mistake.  Everyone here over 18 has exactly the same letter.  So it's a bit of an odd one.
   

    -@fluffy2560

We have a local election here next month; Mrs C has received a voting card; surprised her.

We have a local election here next month; Mrs C has received a voting card; surprised her.
   

    -@Cynic

This sounds like some normalised thing, perhaps people who are in receipt of an Article 50 residence permit (RP) (even in the UK), some rights are retained. 

My RP says my residence is under Article 50.  Maybe it says that on UK RPs too. Maybe anyone who isn't under Article 50 is not allowed to vote.

I'm going to get Mrs F to really read this letter from the HU authorities to work out what they are saying. 

All the letters look exactly the same so it's an odd one.

Might be some quirk here that it still allows you to vote in the European election. 

    We have a local election here next month; Mrs C has received a voting card; surprised her.        -@Cynic

This sounds like some normalised thing, perhaps people who are in receipt of an Article 50 residence permit (RP) (even in the UK), some rights are retained. 

My RP says my residence is under Article 50.  Maybe it says that on UK RPs too. Maybe anyone who isn't under Article 50 is not allowed to vote.

I'm going to get Mrs F to really read this letter from the HU authorities to work out what they are saying. 

All the letters look exactly the same so it's an odd one.

Might be some quirk here that it still allows you to vote in the European election. 
   

    -@fluffy2560

Just checked Mrs C's Indefinite Leave to Remain document and my daughter's husband's Residence Permit; none make any reference to any EU Article.  The only link to anything is on Mrs C's letter, where it refers to Appendix EU to the Immigration Rules, which is on the UK Gov website (link).

Been through BUD airport again and things have changed for non-Schengen arrivals.

There's new signage of a Union Jack/flag with UK passport holders specifically directed to the "All Passports" queue. 

There are many new machines which presumably must be EES related but why?   They  are powered up but to me they seem to be in the wrong place - just before passports.   Why they are there, who knows.  They should be before check in and why within Hungary, surely they need to be outside the borders.  Odd.

When I left on Monday, the entire T2B self-check-in area was cordoned off and only for use by El-Al passengers.  There are new self-bag tagging machines in front of the check in desks.

In other news, an important dude from China -  Winne (the Pooh) 11th - was supposed to be arriving late afternoon.  Plenty of supporters bussed in for it - meh. Overweight smoking cops were lining the streets to ease his arrival.  We felt we had to really dash to avoid them closing the roads for hours to facilitate that very important bear and his tiresome Hungarian friends Eyore and Tigger.  What is more spooky is that yesterday was World Donkey Day.

So, BUD airport again:

Passports have better signs allowing EU and British people to the e-gates to exit the Schengen zone.   

Makes me wonder why all the other countries cannot allow British people to go via the e-gates for entry or exit. 

Another peculiar thing - I showed my passport to the passport person and as usual I included my RP.   Judging by the speed, he didn't scan my RP - usually they do.   THey always scan the passport. I don't know why he didn't scan the RP.  Maybe a mistake.

Strangely he asked me if I wanted an exit stamp?   Why would I be asked for that? RP holders do not need exit or entry stamps. 

Obviously I said no, because why would I need it?

    So, BUD airport again:
Passports have better signs allowing EU and British people to the e-gates to exit the Schengen zone.   

Makes me wonder why all the other countries cannot allow British people to go via the e-gates for entry or exit. 

Another peculiar thing - I showed my passport to the passport person and as usual I included my RP.   Judging by the speed, he didn't scan my RP - usually they do.   THey always scan the passport. I don't know why he didn't scan the RP.  Maybe a mistake.

Strangely he asked me if I wanted an exit stamp?   Why would I be asked for that? RP holders do not need exit or entry stamps. 

Obviously I said no, because why would I need it?
   

    -@fluffy2560

Although I've used many airports all over the world, I've never used BUD.  From managing my own operations at these airports, I can say that no one airport, train station, dock is the same; even things like the local police chief can introduce his own personal requirements which transcend whatever the legal requirements may be.  You will encounter people who have no idea why they are there, except to ask silly questions or what you experienced today, from the walking freight passing through.  I've said previously, if you put a peasant in a customs or immigration uniform, he remains a peasant in a customs or immigration uniform; the mindset very rarely changes, in my experience, it gets worse.  Perhaps your questions were the question of the day passed down from the boss, who has demonstrated he/she knows no better.

Hope you have a safe trip.

        So, BUD airport again:Passports have better signs allowing EU and British people to the e-gates to exit the Schengen zone.   Makes me wonder why all the other countries cannot allow British people to go via the e-gates for entry or exit.  Another peculiar thing - I showed my passport to the passport person and as usual I included my RP.   Judging by the speed, he didn't scan my RP - usually they do.   THey always scan the passport. I don't know why he didn't scan the RP.  Maybe a mistake.Strangely he asked me if I wanted an exit stamp?   Why would I be asked for that? RP holders do not need exit or entry stamps.  Obviously I said no, because why would I need it?         -@fluffy2560Although I've used many airports all over the world, I've never used BUD.  From managing my own operations at these airports, I can say that no one airport, train station, dock is the same; even things like the local police chief can introduce his own personal requirements which transcend whatever the legal requirements may be.  You will encounter people who have no idea why they are there, except to ask silly questions or what you experienced today, from the walking freight passing through.  I've said previously, if you put a peasant in a customs or immigration uniform, he remains a peasant in a customs or immigration uniform; the mindset very rarely changes, in my experience, it gets worse.  Perhaps your questions were the question of the day passed down from the boss, who has demonstrated he/she knows no better.Hope you have a safe trip.        -@Cynic

Reminds me of lipstick on a pig.

In my mind, it's not a job one would actively seek.  The number of interesting cases must be very few and far between.  Once in a blue moon would it make any difference whatsoever.  Everyone one has already entered their passport data in airline system to get a boarding card.  If they uploaded a photo of the passport, it's job done really.

Anyways, I reckon UK (passport holders) will be back in a kind of free border movement arrangement by the end of the first Starmer government.   The forthcoming EES queues will be horrendous. It won't be free movement of labour but border control "lite".

It'll be painful at airline check in and especially check in at home or via an app on the phone.   An EES number will need to be provided.  So they'll be checking RPs there too unless it turns out that we'll have to upload our passport/RP images.  If they (the airlines) transport people without EES, they'll need to return them back on their costs.

BUD airport (inbound again, in the afternoon yesterday):

This time the Passport person tried to stamp my passport. 

I had to say, please don't do that, I've got an RP.  And then he said, "Oh, yes, OK".  Just a passport robot.

I've got a lot of pages in my passport but it gets filled up quickly, usually between 5 and 7 years, I have to get a new one.  Stamping it unnecessarily just costs me money and time.   Maybe we'll be back in the Single Market this time next year.  haha!

Only other observation was an increase in Customs activity at the Nothing to Declare exit.   Targets seem to be young women travelling alone or in ones or twos.  Presumably profiled as potential drug mules depending on where they come from.   

Or it's just a Customs Officer job creation scheme for the unemployable.

@fluffy2560

The stamping of passports is ending this year, when all passports will be digitally scanned and stamped.

    @fluffy2560
The stamping of passports is ending this year, when all passports will be digitally scanned and stamped.
   

    -@SimCityAT

Yes, I realise that but that's for non-RP holders.

I don't think the HU passport stamper employment scheme will stop at all.   

As RP holders, we'll still be manually inspected and possibly manually stamped by mistake or otherwise. 

It's not clear to me how RP holders will be dealt with and where. 

EES won't get us directly into the Schengen at the e-gates.

It's to stop everything from wasting time, passports are scanned anyway so why add extra time stamping it? Meant to be cutting down on waste, so digital stamping is the way forward. BUT as we are already in the system we will be treated as an EU resident. 

    It's to stop everything from wasting time, passports are scanned anyway so why add extra time stamping it? Meant to be cutting down on waste, so digital stamping is the way forward. BUT as we are already in the system we will be treated as an EU resident. 
   

    -@SimCityAT

I think it wastes more time.  All it does is shift a level of bureaucracy on to us, the "consumer" while giving very basic additional information to the paper pushers.

Earlier on I Google'd it and with RPs or without, we all are required to go to a Passport Jobsworth anyway. 

In Hungary, they scan both the passport and the RP.  So nothing changes there as we're not required to use EES. 

And for EES people the Passport Robot will look at your documents (again) and probably scan it (again).

The only extra information they have is the number of entry-exits and therefore they'll know if the passport holder has overstayed.

It's just a load of nonsense.  I reckon this is solution looking for a problem.   I cannot see there being millions of overstayers in the EU.  Maybe a few thousand maximum.

The problem with automated systems (of all types) is that such things are powered by electricity and the common trait across all such systems is that they are subject to random failure, but never random repair.  If these things fail on day 1, no problem, the people still remember how they did it the day before, but the further away you get from implementation, the more people will have moved on and those still there will forget what they did and then chaos.

    The problem with automated systems (of all types) is that such things are powered by electricity and the common trait across all such systems is that they are subject to random failure, but never random repair.  If these things fail on day 1, no problem, the people still remember how they did it the day before, but the further away you get from implementation, the more people will have moved on and those still there will forget what they did and then chaos.
   

    -@Cynic

Random repair and random failure.  I remember that.  The EU does have a track record in large system implementation but this one seems to be rather dodgy.  Along with ETIAS, it's been delayed several times and no-one thought about Brexit and how it might cause massive queues everywhere.  But that's typical government, hedging and managing risk is expensive and there's often no mandate or legal framework for it.    Lack of joined up thinking....again.

I read about 4 engined planes years ago and it might seem 4 engines is safer than two but of course, 4 engines have twice as many parts as 2 engined planes and then, one might think, be more susceptible to failure.

My smoke detector just failed. I took it apart thinking it was the battery and I find it's soldered into the unit. If anything was going to fail, it'd be the battery so short sighted design.  It's not replaceable or rechargeable but I might just solder a new one it.  In any case, I think battery smoke alarms are no longer allowed in buildings, they must all be mains powered, presumably with battery backup.

Used to be a thing for carriers over the pond that 4 engines were the standard; first time I flew in a 2 engine was a 767 to Canada in the early 90’s. It felt strange. I don’t remember my 1st flight, a Constellation!

    Used to be a thing for carriers over the pond that 4 engines were the standard; first time I flew in a 2 engine was a 767 to Canada in the early 90’s. It felt strange. I don’t remember my 1st flight, a Constellation!
   

    -@Cynic

Ha! A Constellation!  I remember those planes.   

My Mum and Dad were flying on those around Australia and the Pacific way back in the 1950s.   My mother's first plane trip was in a Constellation.   They got to Australia on a ship and it took about 6 weeks!

The Constellation was a lumbering 4 engine beast.  A classic airliner.   My Dad didn't like radial engines.  They used to use them in tanks during WW2.  He said the oil drained into the lower cylinders over time and if you didn't drain them, the engine would be damaged when you tried to start them.

Two engines now and ETOPS is the current way over the pond. 

        Used to be a thing for carriers over the pond that 4 engines were the standard; first time I flew in a 2 engine was a 767 to Canada in the early 90’s. It felt strange. I don’t remember my 1st flight, a Constellation!        -@Cynic

Ha! A Constellation!  I remember those planes.   

My Mum and Dad were flying on those around Australia and the Pacific way back in the 1950s.   My mother's first plane trip was in a Constellation.   They got to Australia on a ship and it took about 6 weeks!

The Constellation was a lumbering 4 engine beast.  A classic airliner.   My Dad didn't like radial engines.  They used to use them in tanks during WW2.  He said the oil drained into the lower cylinders over time and if you didn't drain them, the engine would be damaged when you tried to start them.

Two engines now and ETOPS is the current way over the pond. 
   

    -@fluffy2560

My first flight was a USAF flight from Mildenhall to MacDill AFB in Florida; my dad was in the USAF and had been in the UK doing his national service.

My first flight was a USAF flight from Mildenhall to MacDill AFB in Florida; my dad was in the USAF and had been in the UK doing his national service.
   

    -@Cynic

When I was in the RAF, I was based at RAF Waddington and spent short periods in Catterick.   

I remember Mildenhall and Lakenheath well. 

Driving past the outer fences, it looked like "little America" in there.     

    My first flight was a USAF flight from Mildenhall to MacDill AFB in Florida; my dad was in the USAF and had been in the UK doing his national service.        -@Cynic

When I was in the RAF, I was based at RAF Waddington and spent short periods in Catterick.   

I remember Mildenhall and Lakenheath well. 

Driving past the outer fences, it looked like "little America" in there.     
   

    -@fluffy2560

I had a family friend from when I was based at Gütersloh who worked on the RIC around Waddington; funny enough, he's also an Expat, now living in France.

        My first flight was a USAF flight from Mildenhall to MacDill AFB in Florida; my dad was in the USAF and had been in the UK doing his national service.        -@CynicWhen I was in the RAF, I was based at RAF Waddington and spent short periods in Catterick.   I remember Mildenhall and Lakenheath well.  Driving past the outer fences, it looked like "little America" in there.              -@fluffy2560

I had a family friend from when I was based at Gütersloh who worked on the RIC around Waddington; funny enough, he's also an Expat, now living in France.
   

    -@Cynic

When I was there in the mid 1980s,  it was Early Warning aircraft.   We used to have the USAF and Air National Guard come in on exercises.  When they came, wow, the food was fantastic.  Absolutely super grub.  And did we need it!  We were consuming 4000 calories a day when on exercises hiding out in fields and lugging weaponry around.   

Mid-80's I was in Canada, spent 2 years there on and off working (Calgary, Edmonton and Seattle).  I still kick myself for not taking the job I was offered in Calgary.

    Mid-80's I was in Canada, spent 2 years there on and off working (Calgary, Edmonton and Seattle).  I still kick myself for not taking the job I was offered in Calgary.
   

    -@Cynic

I didn't really like Calgary.  It seemed like a place looking for a purpose.  It was OK I suppose but quite dull.  We went to Banff and across to British Columbia.  Swam in some lakes etc, looked at some bears etc.   I suspect it would have been a lot more interesting in Toronto or Montreal.

        Mid-80's I was in Canada, spent 2 years there on and off working (Calgary, Edmonton and Seattle).  I still kick myself for not taking the job I was offered in Calgary.        -@Cynic

I didn't really like Calgary.  It seemed like a place looking for a purpose.  It was OK I suppose but quite dull.  We went to Banff and across to British Columbia.  Swam in some lakes etc, looked at some bears etc.   I suspect it would have been a lot more interesting in Toronto or Montreal.
   

    -@fluffy2560

I guess you had to know where to go and when the big events were on.  Klondike days, the Stampede, or the Stanley Cup were fun events, even got to learn the basics of American football and baseball and how to 2-step and shape a Stetson.  There were some famous Brit football expats living in our apartment block, weekends were always fun.  The furthest east I went was Saskatoon, we spent a month there.

I guess you had to know where to go and when the big events were on.  Klondike days, the Stampede, or the Stanley Cup were fun events, even got to learn the basics of American football and baseball and how to 2-step and shape a Stetson.  There were some famous Brit football expats living in our apartment block, weekends were always fun.  The furthest east I went was Saskatoon, we spent a month there.
   

    -@Cynic

I'd call it the Canadian Milton Keynes.   I wouldn't say Skelmersdale as that would be a step too far.

Nothing to with Brexit, but it's the best forum for this post.

Well today is the day when people got to the polls in the UK.

It's going to be an election no one has ever seen in generations.   You have to go back to 1832 to see when a political party had a large defeat.

But back then politics was a lot different than what it is today so kind of an unfair comparison. All the same, it's on the same par if you don't include Ireland.

Final YouGov MRP shows Labour on course for historic election victory

    Nothing to with Brexit, but it's the best forum for this post.Well today is the day when people got to the polls in the UK.It's going to be an election no one has ever seen in generations.   You have to go back to 1832 to see when a political party had a large defeat.But back then politics was a lot different than what it is today so kind of an unfair comparison. All the same, it's on the same par if you don't include Ireland. Final YouGov MRP shows Labour on course for historic election victory-@SimCityAT

Yes, Tories are too far gone to rescue themselves.  I heard a minister on LBC radio conceding defeat.   Their whole approach seems to be stuck in some kind parallel universe.  They go on about tax cuts but what people want, what they really really want (thank you Spice Girls) is better public services - better hospitals, care for the elderly and the disabled, improved roads, blah-blah. 

I haven't really heard so much about immigration being a massive issue and all hours I listen to LBC radio, watch mainstream news channels like the BBC, Euronews, The Economist, France24 and a raft of others (but not GB News).  "Stop the boats"  as a killer policy has fallen on deaf or indifferent ears.  Bringing in the big guns like Boris the Buffoon has totally misjudged the mood.

I don't really see why the Tories see any of this as a surprise.  I remember Margaret Thatcher going off the rails. It seems to be that 10-12-14 years, is the limit in a democracy for the rot to become truly congealed into the politicians mindsets. Then a change has to be made. 

It's the same here in HU, OV is reaching his limit.  He's already seeing his base reduced after the Euro elections.  He'll probably win the next election but with reduced numbers.  As the years pass, he looks like an utter dinosaur whereas his challenger, Magyar Peter, looks young and dynamic (even though he was also strongly Fidesz).   

What is quite strange is the rest of Europe is going the other way, away from centrist or leftist thinking - Meloni in IT, Fico in SK, WIlders in NL, the anti-Macron thing in France.   It's not good in Europe and it could become worse with Trump on the rampage.

I saw a Euronews report from Spain and most British expats retirees are indifferent to UK politics but a few said they want Freedom of Movement back.  I really want that too. It's stuffed up my British children's and several of my relatives opportunities.

With a Labour super majority in the UK, we could be in for some tyranny.  They will be able to make changes with impunity.  I'd prefer to see more  parties in parliament to allow for at least some dissent.

  I saw a Euronews report from Spain and most British expats retirees are indifferent to UK politics but a few said they want Freedom of Movement back.  I really want that too. It's stuffed up my British children's and several of my relatives opportunities.

With a Labour super majority in the UK, we could be in for some tyranny.  They will be able to make changes with impunity.  I'd prefer to see more  parties in parliament to allow for at least some dissent.
   

    -@fluffy2560

I've just done the deed and as she doesn't have a vote here, and she cares much more than I do, I gave my wife my vote, it will leave a bad taste in my mouth, but it's done.  Particularly galling when I switch on my PC and this pops up in my mailbox.

Not sure about this supermajority, when Johnson won the last election, he had a majority of 80 and could have done the same, the problem was they didn't agree much about anything except being called a Tory.