Talking to a Viet girl in HCMC. Need some clarity.

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   Oh, what a revelation;  return to Victorian era of repression...

Sadly?  Other People exist.  (OP's included)     

Some wannabe naive too...     

Although, you may well be correct.

After all, religion & politics are already banned here...     
.

I would not say it is enjoyable, it is laughable.  Never met, known or heard of a viet girl who hooks up casually, unless your paying for it.

vndreamer wrote:

I would not say it is enjoyable, it is laughable.  Never met, known or heard of a viet girl who hooks up casually, unless your paying for it.

I do and have, numerous times, and it wasn't for money. Trust me, all VN girls aren't the shy,conservative people some posters on here make out.

If the OP says that he wants to play a little first and if he complains that he has to meet the girl a few times before he gets her, then I feel more sorry for the girls than for the OP.

I just wanted to help the OP find a place where he could let off steam and where he could be among like-minded people without hurting a girl.

Another advantage is if you visit such places, you will never doubt the theory of evolution again. 

vndreamer wrote:

I would not say it is enjoyable, it is laughable.  Never met, known or heard of a viet girl who hooks up casually, unless your paying for it.

You may be shocked at what goes on in Viet Nam.

"In return Tuoi Tre pledged to protect their identity.

Districts 3, 8, Phu Nhuan, Tan Binh, and Tan Phu have brothels with male sex workers.

They have many regular clients who are mostly single, divorced women and even elderly women. Normal price ranges from VND200,000 – 500,000 (US$10 – 25) per session, though as much as US$100 was charged once."

Nielsen Flute wrote:

Hello everyone. I need some advice on how to proceed with this girl I've been talking to for a while.

We've been talking to each other for a few years now on and off through Skype/Viber. By chance I was in Saigon for work in 2015 and we connected once in person, but due to a lack of time I simply couldn't make anything tangible happen.  Despite this, we kept in touch and started talking everyday. We would share stories about our lives, ambitions and sing songs and there were many intimate things said. It was a very pleasant experience and I got so close to her. Unfortunately, I had a great opportunity in KL/Manila so I decided to take that. We grew apart a bit but still kept in touch.

I'm now in a position where I can spend much more time in Vietnam. But I'm still confused as to why she kept in touch with me for so long. She's not my girlfriend yet even though I care for her a lot. My main concern is that she's expressed the desire to live abroad in the past, particularly in my hometown in the US and has unsuccessfully applied for an au-pair visa and is now trying to get some sort of student visa. This is sending off red flags in my head along with the fact that she speaks above average English for a Viet girl. 

We are similar ages -- mid 20s. I like her a lot and want to be with her, but I'm certainly not naive. I don't want to be used as a tool and then discarded. Can anyone shed some light on this situation?

Am I being paranoid? What would you do in my situation? Thanks for reading.

Bazza139 wrote:

.
"Are you really the OP who started this thread?"

Ease up, OB. 

We all learn more from our mistakes than free advice

Some of us even become better from being bad   
.

I thought I was easing up... 

You are right about the learning curve.

I've personally navigated similar pathways to get to where I am now... 

I'm not looking to condemn him or try to get him to use my moral compass.

I'm just saying that we now have a much more complete profile of this fine lad.

Going back to the OP, we now finally see that he (with a "she" avatar?) is not simply an average neurotic.

I think there is some genuine self loathing going on when (s)he writes:

"I'm still confused as to why she kept in touch with me for so long"

'He' trolled us with phrases such as "I like her a lot and want to be with her", and now we know what 'being with her' means.

His disdain for women, on any level other than the physical, is quite clear now, as we become fully informed as to his promiscuity, which is probably the real reason he never took the time to connect with her, back when he was only a short flight away.

I'm just assessing based on his own words; not judging.

IF I were his therapist, I would encourage him to make peace with himself, and be himself.

If he can be happy being the person he has described in his latest posts, good for him, and good for the women attracted to him.

But Bazza, we both know he's miserable.

Happiness is in the Journey: not the destination

However, it is inevitable...

colinoscapee wrote:

vndreamer wrote:

I would not say it is enjoyable, it is laughable.  Never met, known or heard of a viet girl who hooks up casually, unless your paying for it.

I do and have, numerous times, and it wasn't for money. Trust me, all VN girls aren't the shy,conservative people some posters on here make out.

This is why I'm so adamant to jump into something serious here. I like the girls in Sai Gon but they are very pretentious and it's very easy to get stuck sitting across from a dubious girl who just hooked up with a guy from Tinder. But a few hours later...expects me to give her free language lessons and strings me along.

Ocean described me as self loathing and he might be right. It's going to take a lot of therapy to undo my the damage caused in my youth. The best I can do is have as many positive interactions as I can. And find someone that appreciates me on a deep level.

Double post

Andy Passenger wrote:

If the OP says that he wants to play a little first and if he complains that he has to meet the girl a few times before he gets her, then I feel more sorry for the girls than for the OP.

I just wanted to help the OP find a place where he could let off steam and where he could be among like-minded people without hurting a girl.

Another advantage is if you visit such places, you will never doubt the theory of evolution again. 

I'm not interested in hookers.

This country is nearly perfect for me but I do not like the audition, rehearsal, performance format the girls try to pull.

Nielsen Flute wrote:

...expects me to give her free language lessons

With the rare exception of the very fluent that kind of goes with the territory.  After six years of marriage, my wife still says "You have to teach me."   

Nielsen Flute wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

vndreamer wrote:

I would not say it is enjoyable, it is laughable.  Never met, known or heard of a viet girl who hooks up casually, unless your paying for it.

I do and have, numerous times, and it wasn't for money. Trust me, all VN girls aren't the shy,conservative people some posters on here make out.

This is why I'm so adamant to jump into something serious here. I like the girls in Sai Gon but they are very pretentious and it's very easy to get stuck sitting across from a dubious girl who just hooked up with a guy from Tinder. But a few hours later...expects me to give her free language lessons and strings me along.

Ocean described me as self loathing and he might be right. It's going to take a lot of therapy to undo my the damage caused in my youth. The best I can do is have as many positive interactions as I can. And find someone that appreciates me on a deep level.

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      Self-awareness is all we need: and you have that.

  Any form of 'therapy' confirms not only cause(s) and their consequences,
but also our part as the catalyst.   Overcoming our (past) irrational beliefs
is difficult because we survived the dysfunction.   Why do anything more?

You already are well on the road to recovery, which is why your deeper
questions are working for you instead of digging into denial.

We expats cannot provide complete answers, as we are a part of this
challenge you have set for yourself.   But you know you'll be Ok.

  Correct.  Positive interactions confirm you are on the right path. 
Confidence comes with practice, and you are already doing that, so ignore
the self-confirming biased sniping some puppets are trying to inflict on you.

The rest of us understand the difficulty

We got your back       
.

THIGV wrote:

Nielsen Flute wrote:

...expects me to give her free language lessons

With the rare exception of the very fluent that kind of goes with the territory.  After six years of marriage, my wife still says "You have to teach me."   

What's wrong with free language lessons?

I was just stopped on the street and invited to a cup of coffee with a Vietnamese family. I answered and continued to speak in Vietnamese. After a while the father asked me if I can speak English. The father wanted me to help his son study English. His son is in the tenth grade but he already speaks English as good as most Americans his age. And his attitude is better than the vast majority of his peers.

I tutored many Vietnamese in Texas during the last phase of the Orderly Departure Program. It's an incredible breath of fresh air to see kid that's honestly interested in learning.

I am here to tell you - a stint in a third-world country should be requisite for any degree of any sort. Exposure to the real world would fly in the face of the liberal crap taught in American universities.

American students are supposed to be getting a real-world education and not a political indoctrination.

Bazza139 wrote:

Nielsen Flute wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

I do and have, numerous times, and it wasn't for money. Trust me, all VN girls aren't the shy,conservative people some posters on here make out.

This is why I'm so adamant to jump into something serious here. I like the girls in Sai Gon but they are very pretentious and it's very easy to get stuck sitting across from a dubious girl who just hooked up with a guy from Tinder. But a few hours later...expects me to give her free language lessons and strings me along.

Ocean described me as self loathing and he might be right. It's going to take a lot of therapy to undo my the damage caused in my youth. The best I can do is have as many positive interactions as I can. And find someone that appreciates me on a deep level.

.
      Self-awareness is all we need: and you have that.

  Any form of 'therapy' confirms not only cause(s) and their consequences,
but also our part as the catalyst.   Overcoming our (past) irrational beliefs
is difficult because we survived the dysfunction.   Why do anything more?

You already are well on the road to recovery, which is why your deeper
questions are working for you instead of digging into denial.

We expats cannot provide complete answers, as we are a part of this
challenge you have set for yourself.   But you know you'll be Ok.

  Correct.  Positive interactions confirm you are on the right path. 
Confidence comes with practice, and you are already doing that, so ignore
the self-confirming biased sniping some puppets are trying to inflict on you.

The rest of us understand the difficulty

We got your back       
.

With all due respect, I've never heard such bullshit before.  And I have had to hear a lot in my life.


...  (maybe) you should .. 
     ...... stay (?) .......with your favorite
way of communicating... 
.... , or not?   

Modified to a PM

Jim-Minh wrote:

THIGV wrote:

Nielsen Flute wrote:

...expects me to give her free language lessons

With the rare exception of the very fluent that kind of goes with the territory.  After six years of marriage, my wife still says "You have to teach me."   

What's wrong with free language lessons?

I was just stopped on the street and invited to a cup of coffee with a Vietnamese family. I answered and continued to speak in Vietnamese. After a while the father asked me if I can speak English. The father wanted me to help his son study English. His son is in the tenth grade but he already speaks English as good as most Americans his age. And his attitude is better than the vast majority of his peers.

I tutored many Vietnamese in Texas during the last phase of the Orderly Departure Program. It's an incredible breath of fresh air to see kid that's honestly interested in learning.

I am here to tell you - a stint in a third-world country should be requisite for any degree of any sort. Exposure to the real world would fly in the face of the liberal crap taught in American universities.

American students are supposed to be getting a real-world education and not a political indoctrination.

.
I agree.  But asking people to open the door to their mind
before they open the door to the World..?   Difficult.     

Confirmation bias applies...     
.

Bazza139 wrote:

: Confirmation bias applies...      .

I do enjoy your thought process.
You inject a background levity that's interesting  but you are a sick puppy,
LMAO - Our Bazza - this board would not be the same without you.
"Mental masturbation is My mutual motivation"

Ciambella is right - you guys masticate an issue to death.
I am very interested in watching the digestion process.
But the final result is seldom pretty.

You must always remember:

Man who take problem in hand, always end up with solution.

colinoscapee wrote:

vndreamer wrote:

I would not say it is enjoyable, it is laughable.  Never met, known or heard of a viet girl who hooks up casually, unless your paying for it.

You may be shocked at what goes on in Viet Nam.

"In return Tuoi Tre pledged to protect their identity.

Districts 3, 8, Phu Nhuan, Tan Binh, and Tan Phu have brothels with male sex workers.

They have many regular clients who are mostly single, divorced women and even elderly women. Normal price ranges from VND200,000 – 500,000 (US$10 – 25) per session, though as much as US$100 was charged once."

Do you know if they're hiring?

Adhome01 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

vndreamer wrote:

I would not say it is enjoyable, it is laughable.  Never met, known or heard of a viet girl who hooks up casually, unless your paying for it.

You may be shocked at what goes on in Viet Nam.

"In return Tuoi Tre pledged to protect their identity.

Districts 3, 8, Phu Nhuan, Tan Binh, and Tan Phu have brothels with male sex workers.

They have many regular clients who are mostly single, divorced women and even elderly women. Normal price ranges from VND200,000 – 500,000 (US$10 – 25) per session, though as much as US$100 was charged once."

Do you know if they're hiring?

Will you be wearing the paper bag to the interview?

colinoscapee wrote:

Adhome01 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

You may be shocked at what goes on in Viet Nam.

"In return Tuoi Tre pledged to protect their identity.

Districts 3, 8, Phu Nhuan, Tan Binh, and Tan Phu have brothels with male sex workers.

They have many regular clients who are mostly single, divorced women and even elderly women. Normal price ranges from VND200,000 – 500,000 (US$10 – 25) per session, though as much as US$100 was charged once."

Do you know if they're hiring?

Will you be wearing the paper bag to the interview?

I'd rather not but some of the customers may insist on it. 

Adhome01 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Adhome01 wrote:

Do you know if they're hiring?

Will you be wearing the paper bag to the interview?

I'd rather not but some of the customers may insist on it. 

Ok, the position is open to ugly people, you're in with a chance. 

Adhome01 wrote:

colinoscapee wrote:

Adhome01 wrote:

Do you know if they're hiring?

Will you be wearing the paper bag to the interview?

I'd rather not but some of the customers may insist on it. 

To hell with the paper bag idea - even if I wasn't totally in love with my 'BETTER HALF' - - - I'd be far too chicken anyway  !!!     

The place down on the MeCong Delta ( Ben Tre ) where my 'BETTER HALF' comes from, the women folk  have a much more direct approach when dealing with un-faithful men - especially husbands !!!   

The woman there simply wait until the man is sleeping soundly one night - - -
then out comes a VERY sharp kitchen knife - -

and the local street dogs get a free meal of 'sausage' !!!   

Flip465 wrote:

The place down on the MeCong Delta ( Ben Tre ) where my 'BETTER HALF' comes from, the women folk  have a much more direct approach when dealing with un-faithful men - especially husbands !!!   

The woman there simply wait until the man is sleeping soundly one night - - -
then out comes a VERY sharp kitchen knife - -

and the local street dogs get a free meal of 'sausage' !!!   

The man gets off easy, have you not seen or heard what they do to the woman?

Actually - no, haven't heard anything about what would happen in a case like that. 

BUT, if the wayward woman's family, was anything like my 'in-laws' and their entire extended family -

I imagine the outcome would be far less than pleasant for the woman concerned !!!   

Did hear that MANY, MANY decades ago, there was a distant 'auntie' on mt M-i-L's side of the family

who took it upon herself to go through the other women's bags, etc, while the whole family was

gathered at the grand-parents home for TET.   

Whole lot of cash, gold and jewels went missing.   

No-one to this day will even hint as to what happened - did find out through a Cong An friend that

what ever happened, it was pretty damned vicIous and extremely nasty.

That one woman has never been seen or heard from since.

Her parents were told what she had done - - - a the whole matter was quietly forgotten about,

DAMNED SHAME WESTERN POLITICIANS DON'T GET THE SAME TREATMENT FOR ALL THEIR LIES   

Dating in this city is so stressful. I have a new girlfriend who is sweet but the drama is just off the charts. Took me multiple dates. I'm the first guy she's been with officially but the constant texting and manufacturing these nonsense scenarios is draining. It's becoming unbearable. I'm also catching the side eye from women when we go out. She's younger and a little plain looking maybe so I'm getting 2nd thoughts on still looking around for someone more mature and suitable. Very high maintenance but she's smart and is in college.

On the the upside the food here is fantastic, the people are mostly friendly and accommodating. Im treated well and enjoy my surroundings. Tons of stuff to do.  Some depth in the country. Just need this final piece of the puzzle.

.
Biology is not a puzzle

The prime (primal?) concept of mating/marriage is an end in itself:

ALL marriages are economic arrangements at base.   
The romance is the myth; survival of the species is the reality

So she has her head screwed on and waiting for her nut to complete
an inevitable union; with you or not.   Yes, you will pay...

..in ways you cannot begin to imagine...

Men want sex: Women want security.    Your 2nd thoughts are valid
and doubt your best protection, so you are thinking correctly

The rest is written in his story.   Yours and History...

Choice, not chance will decide your destiny

You will choose wisely           
.

Nielsen Flute wrote:

She's younger and a little plain looking maybe so I'm getting 2nd thoughts on still looking around for someone more mature and suitable. Very high maintenance but she's smart and is in college.

I think she's gonna leave you on her own.

I wouldn't say that to anyone else.  But after reading all your posts I have to advise you...

...listen to Bazza!  He will be a good mentor for you.

Andy Passenger wrote:

Nielsen Flute wrote:

She's younger and a little plain looking maybe so I'm getting 2nd thoughts on still looking around for someone more mature and suitable. Very high maintenance but she's smart and is in college.

I think she's gonna leave you on her own.

I wouldn't say that to anyone else.  But after reading all your posts I have to advise you...

...listen to Bazza!  He will be a good mentor for you.

You're supposed to be rooting for me to get a nice girl lol

Cut your losses from this relationship.  As a married expat living in VN for almost 10 years, I believe the most important lesson I took hard knocks for were that #1-Vietnamese have a different concept of honesty, and see no problem similar to a western 'sin of ommission'.  #2-Solid VN people are rock solid adhering to traditional Confucian traditions.  The most important is respect of parents and elders, above all else.  Family, baby, husband are next on the list.  The youngest daughters feel pressure  to support their families, if not directly, but by normal social stigma.  I have known several VN women who have moved the to the US, and have either returned, or lived in a rural area feeling very alone.

Pretty well agree with what 'GuidoVN' said [ I decided that there was no really a whole lot  back in the 'old country' for me - so I moved to Viet Nam.   The main problem for me is the cost of private medical treatment.  It's actually cheaper to fly back, get whatever medical treatment I need, then fly back to Viet Nam.  This is the second time I've had the change of culture problem to put up with, so it's really not that bad for myself. In the end, my wife is very happy, her family is now very happy, and apart from getting flooded in Sai Son every so often, I'm also VERY happy.  The ONLY person who isn't really happy is my daughter from my first marriage      I figure she's in her mid thirties and should be able to look after herself by now - and I'm bloody sick of her always needing more and more money from me every payday !!!     I'll stay in Viet Nam - at least then most of us are happy.    PLUS - I've now got the exact type of a wife I've wanted all my life !   

My current relationship is fine (for now) but every girl I meet and try to date seems to want something from me. They don't vocalize what it is it but I can sense they are sizing me up and seeing what I can do down the road. When they say stuff like "I have an aunt in Canada..." or "How much do you pay for rent?" it sets off alarm bells.

Also noticing that they've got strong personalities and try to to impose themselves  on you (i.e. control freaks).  And if you pushback it causes problems. Like you just met me 5 minutes ago and are trying to give me orders....eat more....live here....do this...etc. Lol.

Compared to to other Asian ( Pinay or Indo or Thai ) girls I've dated, they are noticably less sweet and affectionate . Very hot and cold actually. I didn't notice this during my first trip because I was starstruck.

It's still a bit early to tell but we'll see.

Nielsen Flute wrote:

My current relationship is fine (for now) but every girl I meet and try to date seems to want something from me. They don't vocalize what it is it but I can sense they are sizing me up and seeing what I can do down the road. When they say stuff like "I have an aunt in Canada..." or "How much do you pay for rent?" it sets off alarm bells.

Also noticing that they've got strong personalities and try to to impose themselves  on you (i.e. control freaks).  And if you pushback it causes problems. Like you just met me 5 minutes ago and are trying to give me orders....eat more....live here....do this...etc. Lol.

Compared to to other Asian ( Pinay or Indo or Thai ) girls I've dated, they are noticably less sweet and affectionate . Very hot and cold actually. I didn't notice this during my first trip because I was starstruck.

It's still a bit early to tell but we'll see.

.

                 Doubt is your best protection
                               - unless taken to extremes...

    You have identified the red flags in the best way; your 'gut feeling',
    which is rarely wrong.     Always err on the side of safety.

            You'll be Ok       
.

Well  Nielsen your learning. Ine the culture here begins with sizing everyone up, male or female. It is tge nirmal hierarchy thinking if Asia for the most part.  They will resort to huge fabrication make thenselves into something they are not. And your right to be dubious of there whento conversation drifts to life in a foriegn country. In most xase they are probing the immigration opportunities acailable if they can keep you around. Many of these ladies wil run for tge hills when you say youwant to live the rest of your life in VN, your living with a friend rent free because you have very linited funds.
  I think they all go to relationship classes on pampering there partner. I have had them try to literally feed me by putting the food into my mouth. I was afraid of cough at night. They will be up patting you on the back and calling 911. But when you come home   they will be at the gate to open it. My first wife was so controlling that my entire life was taken away. But the current partner ( never again a wife) is just fabulous. Never tries to control, only please me. One could not ask for a better partner.
Enjoy reading your dating blog.

I recently dated a girl from Ho Chi Minh while I was visiting and found her very sweet but also a 30-year-old business owner of a successful salon. I expected her to be a little alpha but after spending two weeks ( almost every day with her) found her to be very controlling and ...a lot of friction  between us because of control issues.

For me I definitely want to balance and you will never have harmony with two Alpha strong personalities LOL.

I don't see bossy Vietnamese women as much of a problem because I know it's something very deep in their culture, and they're used to Vietnamese men actually listening obediently to them on day to day activities. Being very stubborn myself, I don't allow this and I think many Vietnamese women, while complaining, will actually like/respect this. Just as an example, last month I was in Rach Gia and my girlfriend came over and I told her that *I'd* drive her around with my motorbike. She complained and said no way, she'd drive. I was determined, and she finally agreed and she ended up having a great time, calling me "xe om Canada". It's just a small thing but my ex Vietnamese wife told me the same thing, that Vietnamese women want to be bossy but will respect a man who doesn't allow them to roll over him. Of course we can't generalise and not all Vietnamese women all the same.

Nielsen Flute wrote:

Also noticing that they've got strong personalities and try to to impose themselves  on you (i.e. control freaks).  And if you pushback it causes problems. Like you just met me 5 minutes ago and are trying to give me orders....eat more....live here....do this...etc. Lol.

I think the smart ones will learn to adapt to you and give you freedom, but the ones stuck in their mindset will never let go and those are the ones you want to filter out.

Something that bugs me, I see it with the wife of a friend of mine, when he goes somewhere or hangs out with someone she doesn't like, she'll get angry, she'll give him the silence treatment for a day and so one. He plays the game by often not telling her who he was with or where he went. I find it pretty sad and I think the wife is very close minded because she's definitely pushing him to hide things, and he contributes to this by avoiding telling her the truth. I get the feeling this is cultural as I have seen it with other Vietnamese couples and in my experience this is handled a bit differently with couples I know in the West. In this case it's pretty much about my friend's Vietnamese female cousin who's a bit "low class" and "party-oriented" but heck, that's his family. I would never accept my girlfriend or wife trying to prevent me from seeing a family member, no matter how bad they are.

My ex insisted I give up all frienda , pets and speaking to childern. Tried to tell her their are boundaries in life and sometimes we must stay in our own lane. She would not hear of it. Finally had enough and got rid of her. But common discriptive words you hear from foreigners about VNese ladies  is “ strong” “ controlling” etc. The only friends I know of who get along easily with them are very passive men. In my country we would say they do not wear the pants in the family. Having said tgat I am now with a women that lets me lead.

Vagabondone wrote:

The only friends I know of who get along easily with them are very passive men. In my country we would say they do not wear the pants in the family. Having said tgat I am now with a women that lets me lead.

Strong conservative attitude.

For me man and woman have always been equal.
Nobody needs to wear the pants.

If you want to boss someone around, buy a dog.

Why such men choose a strong woman is a mystery to me.

Andy Passenger wrote:

Vagabondone wrote:

The only friends I know of who get along easily with them are very passive men. In my country we would say they do not wear the pants in the family. Having said tgat I am now with a women that lets me lead.

Strong conservative attitude.

For me man and woman have always been equal.
Nobody needs to wear the pants.

If you want to boss someone around, buy a dog.

Why such men choose a strong woman is a mystery to me.

Just make sure you know who wears the panties...