Coronavirus overview by the Expat Mag.

beppi wrote:

Friends4ever86: You are of course right (and on top of those 18 months comes the time the industry needs to build up production facilities and make sufficient quantities of the vaccine - in this case billions of doses!).
As I said, they may in this case decide that taking the risk involved in improper testing is still better than letting thousands more die in the meantime.
However, a vaccine available in a year from now, as some experts claim possible, would be the fastest EVER - and I don't believe in it.
Hopefully we will all be here to see who is right in the end!

There is still no vaccine for SARS. What makes you so sure there will be for COVID-19?

EveeZee wrote:

beppi wrote:

Friends4ever86: You are of course right (and on top of those 18 months comes the time the industry needs to build up production facilities and make sufficient quantities of the vaccine - in this case billions of doses!).
As I said, they may in this case decide that taking the risk involved in improper testing is still better than letting thousands more die in the meantime.
However, a vaccine available in a year from now, as some experts claim possible, would be the fastest EVER - and I don't believe in it.
Hopefully we will all be here to see who is right in the end!

There is still no vaccine for SARS. What makes you so sure there will be for COVID-19?

That's true.  But then again, I don't remember such a high level of panic for SARS.   

From what is understood, for SARS (and then MERS), vaccines were put into development but never seen through to the end as the interest from the Government's and the associated funding just vanished (as the viruses were brought under control).  The spread of those viruses was nowhere near the current one e.g. SARS infected 8,000 people vs. 300,000+ now for Covid.  Forget the mortality for a second; the sheer number of cases leads to hysteria which leads to political pressure which then leads to wallets being unlocked - sad but true.

If the current situation continues to escalate, it may just lead to some commitment on actually seeing a vaccine through to the end of its developmental cycle.  But that won't happen overnight obviously - depending on who you believe, the timelines are anywhere from 6 months outward to 2-3 years.

XTang wrote:

That's true.  But then again, I don't remember such a high level of panic for SARS.

Because it was confined to China/Asia and globalization was not so wide spread. SARS could be just as dangerous today.

If the current situation continues to escalate, it may just lead to some commitment on actually seeing a vaccine through to the end of its developmental cycle.  But that won't happen overnight obviously - depending on who you believe, the timelines are anywhere from 6 months outward to 2-3 years.

Hopefully, you are right.

EveeZee wrote:

XTang wrote:

That's true.  But then again, I don't remember such a high level of panic for SARS.

Because it was confined to China/Asia and globalization was not so wide spread. SARS could be just as dangerous today.

If the current situation continues to escalate, it may just lead to some commitment on actually seeing a vaccine through to the end of its developmental cycle.  But that won't happen overnight obviously - depending on who you believe, the timelines are anywhere from 6 months outward to 2-3 years.

Hopefully, you are right.

EXACTLY!!.

So to put it bluntly (and a bit brutally), at the time of SARS, the rest of the world just did not care.   People getting infected or dying halfway around the world is a big difference from the same happening in your hometown.

And of course, SARS is much much more dangerous than Covid.  If it had the same asymptomatic profile and transmission rate like Covid, the panic now, would be justified.  And the nightmare situation would be Ebola with a 50%+ mortality, spreading like Covid (surface/droplets and not fluids as is the case); that is the real apocalypse scenario as shown in the movies .

COVID19 which is now called SARS-COV-2 may be transmitted via fecal-oral route

[link under review]

COVID19 which is now called SARS-COV-2 may be transmitted via fecal-oral route

That would suggest good hand washing, as I rather hope everyone practices anyway, is an especially good idea. However, it raises potential issues for people who engage in more 'adventurous' horizontal jogging techniques.

Fred wrote:

COVID19 which is now called SARS-COV-2 may be transmitted via fecal-oral route

That would suggest good hand washing, as I rather hope everyone practices anyway, is an especially good idea. However, it raises potential issues for people who engage in more 'adventurous' horizontal jogging techniques.

It hangs in the air, lingers on surfaces and it's in the water. And the CDC was right and those who did not take it seriously are damn fools. A surgical mask will not help nor will an N95 for most people and the only way to avoid getting it is to avoid being anywhere near it.

COVID-19 = Coronavirus Desease

SARS-COV-2 = Virus - Severe Acute Respiratory syndrome Coronavirus 2

https://www.who.int/emergencies/disease … s-disease-(covid-2019)-and-the-virus-that-causes-it

kittycat1 wrote:

COVID-19 = Coronavirus Desease

SARS-COV-2 = Virus - Severe Acute Respiratory syndrome Coronavirus 2

https://www.who.int/emergencies/disease … s-disease-(covid-2019)-and-the-virus-that-causes-it

Your link is 404, but this one works
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Severe_ac … onavirus_2

Severe acute respiratory syndrome coronavirus 2 (SARS-CoV-2), previously known by the provisional name 2019 novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV)

COVID19 is now SARS-COV-2

This needs to be watched. Possibly more important than a vaccine.

HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT … amp;rank=2

It  could be an option as Plan B

however only physicians, MD doctors, will decide whether or not will work with real patients..

clock is ticking..

kittycat1 wrote:

It  could be an option as Plan B

however only physicians, MD doctors, will decide whether or not will work with real patients..

clock is ticking..

Hydroxychloroquine has a lot of it's own risks to be sure.

Drs in France are using it in conjunction with the antibiotic azithromycin

While the data have not yet been published, and should therefore be interpreted with caution, this non-randomised, unblinded study showed a strong reduction in viral load with hydroxychloroquine.

After 6 days, the percentage of patients testing positive for COVID-19 who received hydroxychloroquine fell to 25% versus 90% for those who did not receive the treatment (a group of untreated COVID-19 patients from Nice and Avignon).

In addition, comparing untreated patients, those receiving hydroxychloroquine and those given hydroxychloroquine plus the antibiotic azithromycin, the results showed there was "a spectacular reduction in the number of positive cases" with the combination therapy, said Prof Raoult.

https://www.medscape.com/viewarticle/927033https://www.clinicaltrialsregister.eu/c … 0890-25/FR

This was called fake news, but the tide is turning.

Philippine Destiny wrote:

This needs to be watched. Possibly more important than a vaccine.

HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT … amp;rank=2

That stuff commonly leave a severe need for the toilet paper a lot of idiots, sorry, people have been hoarding.
I used it on my doctor's advice the first time I went to Malaysia. I shouted down the phone at my doctor because he's a berk.

Fred wrote:

Philippine Destiny wrote:

This needs to be watched. Possibly more important than a vaccine.

HYDROXYCHLOROQUINE

https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/NCT … amp;rank=2

That stuff commonly leave a severe need for the toilet paper a lot of idiots, sorry, people have been hoarding.
I used it on my doctor's advice the first time I went to Malaysia. I shouted down the phone at my doctor because he's a berk.

Best to just bathe or you will rub yourself raw.

sorry for my denseness earlier, kittycat1

you are correct sarscov2 causes coronavirus disease (covid19)

Let's see the study?

Wouldn't you wish he had worn a mask so you could have stayed healthy?

Templatesun: Who are you referring to?

Here in the Philippines there is strict control on N95 masks. The DOH has issued guidelines on who is to use them and who is not. Those who are hoarding them can be arrested.

Surgical masks are not N95 masks. The coronavirus passes right through a surgical mask.

Even N95 masks can be vulnerable:

Since the coronavirus is an extremely small virus, it can pass through the pores of both the surgical mask and N95 respirator. Hence, considering the nanostructure of the protective apparatuses, there should not be any difference in their protective activity. In addition, contamination of the respiratory protective apparatus after use is another issue that needs to be addressed. Although the apparatus has a good structure that can prevent the passage of pathogen, if it is contaminated and reused, it will become the source of infection instead.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC4293953/

Did you catch that? not only does the virus pass right through both types of mask but the mask itself becomes a source of contamination. THIS IS BECAUSE YOU VIOLATED SOCIAL DISTANCE THINKING YOU ARE SAFE.

That is why social distance is being enforced. That is the only hope you have.

People need to be very cognizant of getting too close. Wearing a surgical mask and thinking you are safe makes people prone to violating social distance.

Common sense is the big weapon. Just avoid crowds and that's about that.  However, a lot of people will have contracted it before it went viral, so there's little they can do except hope they're in the massive majority that recover quickly and naturally.

It's a numbers game so not a lot of point getting stressed out.

Jordan approves hydroxychloroquine
https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2020/03/ … 27230.html

France advances use of hydroxychloroquine
https://www.france24.com/en/france/2020 … r-bogillot

Indian Council of Medical Research has recommended the use of anti-malarial drug Hydroxychloroquine
https://www.news18.com/news/india/anti- … 47945.html

studies currently underway
https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/results? … &dist=

Hydroxychloroquine is not chloroquine.

Hydroxychloroquine is not quinine.

No one should go looking for Hydroxychloroquine or any variation in order to self medicate. You could end up dead.

People in hospital because they took the drug

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/23/afri … index.html

There's no cure so far for the new virus, or old stupidity.

Fred wrote:

People in hospital because they took the drug

https://edition.cnn.com/2020/03/23/afri … index.html

There's no cure so far for the new virus, or old stupidity.

In the hospital for taking it? What a moron. In the studies I listed above they are giving it to people who are in the hospital with no other hope outside of a quick death.

And I said above that hydroxychloroquine and chloroquine are not the same thing.

Apparently CNN and others are too damn stupid to get that.

Chloroquine is more dangerous.

Look at the studies above that I linked to to make analogies not stories that are political and deceptive and comparing apples to oranges. The French are far from being Trump fans and they are spearheading hydroxychloroquine research.

Yes, it is very dangerous. That is why clinical trials are underway.

Injecting ignorant politics into the subject is not helpful but as you said there is no cure for stupid or for the CHINESE Coronavirus.

Philippine Destiny wrote:

Injecting ignorant politics into the subject is not helpful but as you said there is no cure for stupid or for the CHINESE Coronavirus.

One assumes that was a dig at idiotic politicians that are attempting to use this for political gain - Their stupidity is very much incurable.
We've been lucky in Indonesia because only a few of the more moronic are using this for racism and politics, but that lot have no power so are very easy (and safe) to dismiss as pointless twits.

Fred wrote:

Philippine Destiny wrote:

Injecting ignorant politics into the subject is not helpful but as you said there is no cure for stupid or for the CHINESE Coronavirus.

One assumes that was a dig at idiotic politicians that are attempting to use this for political gain - Their stupidity is very much incurable.
We've been lucky in Indonesia because only a few of the more moronic are using this for racism and politics, but that lot have no power so are very easy (and safe) to dismiss as pointless twits.

It is a dig at CNN. they are not objective anymore than FOX.

Can we still call Chinese food Chinese food or is that racist?

Maybe Change MERS to RS so as to not offend the Middle East. 

Would not want to offend twits who are looking for any excuse to pretend to be offended.

Philippine Destiny wrote:

It is a dig at CNN. they are not objective anymore than FOX.

Can we still call Chinese food Chinese food or is that racist?
.

The virus started life, as far as we know, in China .. or at least it broke out there, but might have been imported by someone from outside, then mutated - No way to know.

I got sick of both Fox And CCN because neither are news, but both twist stories to suit their preferred lies.

As for calling it a Chinese virus, that's deliberate racism in an attempt to dig at China for trade and other political reasons, a stupidity I dislike in the same way I dislike all stupidity.
I have no time for racist rubbish, nor those that vomit it out.

Fred wrote:

Philippine Destiny wrote:

It is a dig at CNN. they are not objective anymore than FOX.

Can we still call Chinese food Chinese food or is that racist?
.

The virus started life, as far as we know, in China .. or at least it broke out there, but might have been imported by someone from outside, then mutated - No way to know.

I got sick of both Fox And CCN because neither are news, but both twist stories to suit their preferred lies.

As for calling it a Chinese virus, that's deliberate racism in an attempt to dig at China for trade and other political reasons, a stupidity I dislike in the same way I dislike all stupidity.
I have no time for racist rubbish, nor those that vomit it out.

You are totally political. This site says no politics allowed but you seem to get a pass because you spew political bs non stop.

You came into the Philippines Coronavirus thread a month ago when we were just discussing preparations and you started a huge argument telling us all that we were panicking and the CDC was lying to everyone.

Now the entire Philippines is shut down.

You are preaching democrat talking points with your racism bs.

It is no different than calling MERS MERS.

and "might have been imported by someone from outside"

put on your tinfoil hat

China is also a country so Chinese denotes location not race.

Chinese is also an ethnicity not a race.

Political shills twist words to stir up emotions and short circuit people's rational thought.

I found this about disease naming convention:
https://www.who.int/mediacentre/news/no … seases/en/

Before 2015 naming diseases after places was common. Doctors and health organizations all over the world referred to various diseases by place names.

Were the millions of them racist? Many of them were naming these things after the very place where they lived...their own country etc.

So now the practice to avoid stigma is to not do so. I can understand that.

But if someone does it is it racism? It is ridiculous to assume that it is.

It may be political to refer to a disease by a place name, because a person is attempting to assign blame.

But it is equally political to say that doing so is racism in order to shut down a narrative.

Where is objectivity?

As a Chinese, I want to answer this question, because I just had a look, it seems no Chinese answered this question yet.

Yes, I am a Chinese, first I want to say, I am proud of it. As a normal Chinese, I want to share what I experienced in last 2 month:

The coronavirus start to affect our life  from Jan. 23, since we know that Wuhan city is sealed. We started to talk about this but not feel fear yet, it seems very far from us. Jan 25 is Chinese new year, we drove to countryside(we have a house in my husband's hometown, which is in a small viliiage), and this was best choice we did at that time. 

As previous Chinese custom,  Jan 25 to Jan 31 should be most busy days, around 80% wedding or party should be held during this time, and people would go to relatives or friends's home to dinner together. But from Jan 26, we got information, all the wedding or party must be cancelled or delayed, and the road to outside is blocked by a tree. All people must stay at home. 1.4 billion Chinese stay at home from that day.

Every 2 days, one of each family can go out to buy food or Daily Necessities. Before Jan 22 we bought some pork, beef, and lamb to prepare for the Chinese New Year, so we just need some vegetables. It's lucky we have some good relatives, my father and mother plant some vegetables and after one week, my husband's sister, uncle, sent us more than 20kg vegetable also (there are 6 people in our family), these good relatives help us to get through those days.

As I said, we stayed in a small village, and behind the village, there are many mountains and a lake. so during those days, we three (my husband, my son and I) always go to search the deep of mountain, or go around the lake, of course we wear mask even there is little people there.

Feb. 18, we got notice from my son's school, that all the students need start having class online, there are 3 ways to have class: TV, Computer, Cell Phone. Till now, my son have been studied at home more than one month, and we just go news that, Grade 9 and Grade 12 students will start school study in advance from April 07, others, I think around April 21.

My husband start to work from Feb. 25, as we have no choice, our factory need open. We're running a LED lighting factory in Guangdong province, at first week, only 3-4 employee come back, because you can only leave your hometown with a healthy proof from goverment.  Till now 3/4 workers are back, but we still feel hard, as overseas market is less and less from March. But we are also lucky, as we got some support from goverment too. We have enough masks, we can loan with very low rate...

Why I type so much as I want to share with you, all the Chinese people really had a hard time, a dark time, and all Chinese people stay at home more than 1 month , even 2 or 3 months to fight with the virus. Now if just talk about the source of the virus, it doesn't solve any problem. Now Chinese have controlled the virus, because the goverment worked with all Chinese people together, we fight together. We are still wearing mask everyday now.


Hope the virus pass soon, hope all of you keep safe.

It is really good they exonerated this guy

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronaviru … stleblower

We have to applaud that.

How is the connectivity for Pt Telkom in the midst of all of this?

Look at this thread
https://www.expat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=882192

It opens up with this
"The 'Wuhan' (China) coronavirus is accelerating its spread all around the globe"

and guess who is the first to respond

"You won't have to.
All the worry about something that's mostly still a news push because Prince Andy hasn't been arrested, Brexit hasn't quite happened yet, and global warming hasn't fried us all, will give you a heart attack - Dead people have no chance of catching the virus."

That is you Fred.  And you do not sound offended at all. Could it all be an act?

And what do we have here?
https://www.expat.com/en/expat-mag/3084 … enter.html

An article By expat.com that is about coronavirus

and the first line of the article:
"As the Coronavirus originated in China "

The site contradicts you about its origins and no cries of racism?

It seems that Fred is very selective about his political statements.

I am sure I can find a lot more if I keep hunting.

Fred wrote:

Philippine Destiny wrote:

Injecting ignorant politics into the subject is not helpful but as you said there is no cure for stupid or for the CHINESE Coronavirus.

One assumes that was a dig at idiotic politicians that are attempting to use this for political gain - Their stupidity is very much incurable.

Stupidity in peope may be incurable, but in a democratic, free society it can (and should, in my opinion) easily be cured in the next elections.

beppi wrote:

Fred wrote:

Philippine Destiny wrote:

Injecting ignorant politics into the subject is not helpful but as you said there is no cure for stupid or for the CHINESE Coronavirus.

One assumes that was a dig at idiotic politicians that are attempting to use this for political gain - Their stupidity is very much incurable.

Stupidity in peope may be incurable, but in a democratic, free society it can (and should, in my opinion) easily be cured in the next elections.

No. Actually it cannot be cured by elections. Elections are just the way that those who really hold the power fool the masses with false hope - as all candidates get their funding from the money interests.

It goes back and forth and back and forth and the two sides do the same things  and the people never catch on.

I pointed this out in another thread how that Obama and Trump's cabinets were both chocked full of Goldman Sachs people. Fred there has pointed out Mr Wilbur Ross who is a member of Trump's cabinet, but he failed to name the former employer of Mr Ross  - an employer that has a close history with the Clintons and Mr Obama.

Everyone pretends they cannot see the other side of these things.

I have a much higher opinion than you about democracy and freedom.
Or maybe they just work better in Europe, where I live, than in the USA, which you mention?
In any case, it is the best system we have - and probably the only one that works in the long run.

beppi wrote:

I have a much higher opinion than you about democracy and freedom.
Or maybe they just work better in Europe, where I live, than in the USA, which you mention?
In any case, it is the best system we have - and probably the only one that works in the long run.

It is broken in USA as both sides are controlled by the same people.

glad you like yours

What do you think when they find the vaccine?

Just fyi. the German General Medical Council now recommends the wearing of simple face masks.

As health care experts
infectious deseases - PhD Physicians worlwide wisely recommends us to do ,

Self-isolation its the sensible rule,
as therefore for thus to help to ease -some of their -already-so-overwhelmed everyday-frantic work of doctors, nurses, paramedics and some other key-workers by home-staying all of us, its a must, our duty and responsibility, we owe that to all of them who look after our health, that and undoubtlely uncountless infinite much more..

EveeZee wrote:

Just fyi. the German General Medical Council now recommends the wearing of simple face masks.

I could not find such a recommendation. On the contrary, the Robert-Koch-Institute (Germany's leading authority on infectious diseases) writes on its webpage:
"Hingegen gibt es keine hinreichende Evidenz dafür, dass das Tragen eines Mund-Nasen-Schutzes das Risiko einer Ansteckung für eine gesunde Person, die ihn trägt, signifikant verringert. Nach Angaben der WHO kann das Tragen einer Maske in Situationen, in denen dies nicht empfohlen ist, ein falsches Sicherheitsgefühl erzeugen, durch das zentrale Hygienemaßnamen wie eine gute Händehygiene vernachlässigt werden können."
(Rough translation: There is no evidence that wearing a mask lowers infection risk. The WHO advises against it, because it gives a wrong sense of safety.)
The association of German lung doctors (there's probably a Latin word with "...ists" for them, but I don't know it) writes basically the same on their webpage: https://www.lungenaerzte-im-netz.de/kra … ansteckung
All agree that only infected persons should wear masks, to prevent speading droplets of bodily fluid (with viruses) to others. And for exposed medical personell, there are special masks (not available to the general public) that do help - most of them cover the whole face (because infection through the eyes is also possible).
Also all agree (and China has successfully shown) that social distancing is the most effective tool of all - two meters of air help far more than half a millimeter of paper, textile or vlies.