Residencia - 2020 - How to get it done.

Besides background check, do any of the other documents become outdated over time if need to resubmitted again?

Yes, but most are more easily replaced.

Examples, IIRC, included utility bills which had to be no more than 3 months old. in our case, those had to be resubmitted twice, because ours were one of of the cases mishandled by a certain, abysmal SD attorney. Took like 30 months!
  >> Fortunately, we hired Lishali and she bailed us out, or we might still be waiting. 

I think the bank reference letter from the US also had to be updated if older than six months. 

Forgive me for my uncertainty, we were taking so long in the DR that we started pursuing Panama's Friendly Nations Visa, as well...just in case the DR never approved us.  The processes are different, but similar enough that they've sort of gotten mixed up in my memory.

Hope this helps.

Jim

Your medical is also time sensitive. All income documents etc also need updating.

The best way to look at it is EVERYTHING is time sensitive. From what I have heard from others is that every embassy makes there own rules. I was fortunate and got along with the person Lilly and I had as a contact.

Expatrusher.  You said you're considering Panama as well since the dr is so onerous. I wonder how many people the dr has lost over the years to other countries competing for the gringo dollar. We'll never know, but I'll bet its many.

jwj938924 wrote:

Expatrusher.  You said you're considering Panama as well since the dr is so onerous. I wonder how many people the dr has lost over the years to other countries competing for the gringo dollar. We'll never know, but I'll bet its many.

Very true.  Had our DR approval taken much longer (say, another six months), we very likely would have just cut bait and completely given up on the DR.

The only reason it didn't take another six months, or cost another $1,200.00+ to the Ministry, was attorney Lishali's intervention on our behalf at the Ministry. 
>> I fudge the details here, because I don't want to make personal enemies in the Ministry -- or at least, any more than we already seem to have. 

If Lishali hadn't resolved the situation, we would have simply given up on the DR.  We'd have gone ahead with Panama for our snowbirding.  And I'd have written a blistering  article naming names and burning any last bridges back,  then published it on every expat forum I could find.  I'd have qute properly warned every prospective expat considering the DR of the high expenses and long, apparently arbitrary delays for some applicants.

Our first lawyer in the DR was either incompetent or corrupt -- or perhaps just on an ego-driven power trip to prove she can control other's lives.  >> Now, I don't name this disreputable lawyer anywhere. 
>> That's because after reviewing the DR's laws about slander, libel and damage to reputation -- and considering that we're not DR citizens and thus local courts aren't likely to give us a fair shake -- I decided not to dwell on the disreputable lawyer.
>> But, I do choose to spend time reinforcing the ABSOLUTE NEED to find and hire a REPUTABLE, KNOWLEDGEABLE IMMIGRATION ATTORNEY that sees the client(s) as his/her priority, and provides timely, reliable service at a fair price.

Fortunately, planner referred us to Lishali just when we were about to give up on the DR.  She didn't just save our residency application, she save our entire image of the country!
>> So, we vouch safe for Lishali every chance we get. 
>> Because, yea, she's an excellent immigration attorney with superb ethics!
>> But also because she's a superb example of what her nation can produce: young, talented people with the drive to make their nation a better place!! 

We've since met more such young professionals with the same drive and talent as Lishali.  Thus, we're now far more optimistic about the Dominican Republic's future. 

So, we're in for the long haul now, as snow birders and possibly, someday, full-time residents. 

I hope all that read this little missive will take the time to vet their Immigration Attorney better than we did our first one. 
>> And we stand by our strong recommendation for Lishali Baez as a wonderful person and AWESOME immigration attorney.
>> I'm sure there are others on the island, but we'll stick with Lishali. 

Blessings to all,

Jim
ExpatRusher

I don't think it's fair to say getting residency in the DR is onerous, due to your using the absolute worst "lawyer" that can be found on the island.  With a halfway competent lawyer, it is not too bad.  With a good one, almost easy.  Consider how difficult, or impossible in some cases, it would be for a Dominican to move to your country.  Your experience with that person is colouring your judgment if the process, I think.

Uncle Buck: 

My friend, I AGREE with you!!  The DR's residency should be easy, and that's one of the reasons we chose it as our first residency and overseas base.  We expected to be done in six months!

That's why as the one-year, then two-year marks passed, with nothing happening, we were dumbfounded at our situation.  We had expected to start wintering in the DR in January 2019, then January 2020 but COVID interrupted, then January 2021 but still no approved residency. 

However, I'm simply not painting all the dirty details of the picture...to protect others, not myself.  There was some very nasty dealing going on behind closed doors, about which I can't and won't provide details on electronic media -- you never know who's reading your posts or emails. 
>> I forthrightly and unapologetically assert that there ARE severe problems embedded within the residency process in the DR...fortunately, it doesn't surface very often.  Usually when there is money to be made...but sometimes, just as an ego trip.   
>>  I would not make those claims if I didn't feel strongly about them.  And having experienced a 30-month residency application process, I think I have some perspective. 
>> Also, please note, expat.com itself has many more similar stories over many years past.  Sure, most people breeze along pretty well...but some are put through the grinder.
>>  Sadly, we were one of the unlucky "winners" of this particular bad process.  Maybe it was bad luck, maybe it was something else.

Did our situation color my/our perspective about the DR?  Of course it did!!  Essentially, we paid several thousand dollars to a supposedly legit lawyer who would get our package done in record time!   They even came "highly recommended" by one of the overseas living info groups.
>> The reality was far, far different.  Let me tell you, when your supposed immigration attorney doesn't answer your calls or emails for MANY months at a time, you get pretty jaded.
>> And BTW, that overseas living information org no longer recommends that lawyer; they now recommend Lishali.  We were FAR from the only people she shafted, and bad news travels fast.

Quite sadly, that bad lawyer is still doing damage to other clients.  A person on a Facebook group for Expats in the Dominican Republics posted about two weeks ago, complaining about their lawyer, having waited over two years for anything to happen on their applications. Yes, it was/is the very same lawyer! 
>> Unfortunately, as far as I can discern, FB deleted the post, because I can't find it anymore.  I'd imagine a certain lawyer complained to FB and got it removed...which is far easier to do than, you know, actually performing the agreed, contracted services on behalf of their client.

Remember, the CORE of my tale, is the awesomeness of finding an outstanding immigration attorney who bailed us out of a 2.5 year imbroglio of almost zero progress. 
>> And my advice to future prospective residency applicants in the DR stands firm:  MAKE VERY, VERY SURE OF WHO YOU HIRE AS YOUR IMMIGRATION ATTORNEY.   Do it right the first time, 
>> Or your residency process will indeed be "onerous,"   As was ours, until Lishali took it over and resurrected things. 

So, we recommend Lishali without reservation or qualification.   Period.  She's not only a fantastic lawyer, she's just plain brilliant.  She has restored our faith in the DR. 
>> I must also add, the new Immigration Minister himself is a man who gets things done right!!  I'm hoping for big improvements in the Ministry under his leadership.

Anyway, Buck, I hope I've not offended you in any way with all this.  I bit my tongue for over two years, not complaining...trying to give our first lawyer every benefit of the doubt possible, as they manufactured glib excuse after excuse for their lack of performance.  That is, when they even bothered to answer phone calls or emails. 
>>  Maybe I'm just venting some built-up frustrations at long last.  I think it's more that I don't want new residency applicants to similarly waste money and time with a bad lawyer. 

Maybe we can do lunch in the DR sometime, when we get up to your area, and I can provide some details that will frost your eyebrows a bit.

Jim

UncleBuck wrote:

I don't think it's fair to say getting residency in the DR is onerous, due to your using the absolute worst "lawyer" that can be found on the island.  With a halfway competent lawyer, it is not too bad.  With a good one, almost easy.  Consider how difficult, or impossible in some cases, it would be for a Dominican to move to your country.  Your experience with that person is colouring your judgment if the process, I think.

Ok let's move on please.

Moral of the story - be careful who you use as a lawyer.

There are lots of potential issues as nothing here is easy.

Good morning Lishali.
In your post you comment  "for retirado the certification of income is an inexcusable document to apply". I am not sure what this means. My spouse and I have pension income in excess of $1750.00 US. Do we need letters stating the amount of out pension incomes, or do we need statements from our bank?
Thank you
Rick

Letters from your place of retirement or the company that manages the pension funds.

I have tagged Lishali on this.

Good morning Finnigan,

Thank you for your message.

I have sent you a direct message answering your question.

Best regards,

Lily

Thank you so much Jim, you and your wife have been amazing to me!

UncleBuck.  The 'onerous' stories are legion in number.

We didn't find the process to be too onerous  - whether it was Lily's assistance or just being prepared, we didn't find the process to be too difficult.

ddmcgee,  then you are an outlier to the norm. BTW, please tell us how long it took you, start to finish, how many visits to various offices, total price, etc. Then viewers here can judge whether they would consider it 'onerous'.    I recently heard one guy say he had to make 8 trips to the Boston consulate, from the other side of the state. He considered that onerous, do you?

jwj938924 wrote:

ddmcgee,  then you are an outlier to the norm. BTW, please tell us how long it took you, start to finish, how many visits to various offices, total price, etc. Then viewers here can judge whether they would consider it 'onerous'.    I recently heard one guy say he had to make 8 trips to the Boston consulate, from the other side of the state. He considered that onerous, do you?

Brief summary of our journey:
January 9, 2020 - Applied for Residency Visa as Pensioners in Washington, DC
February 6. 2020 - Received our Residency Visas (via mail)
March 12, 2020 - Submitted our applications for residency in Santo Domingo and completed our medical exams
September 21, 2020 - Notified that our applications were approved
September 25, 2020 - Received our Residencias and Cedulas

We had only one trip to the consulate, leaving our passports with them along with a postage-paid ExpressMail envelope. We received an email requesting one additional document (bank statement that wasn't available at the time we applied), we emailed the PDF of the statements on February 1, as soon as it was available to us.

We paid $820 to the Consulate, which included translation fees for all of our documents. We had about $400 in other direct expenses - background checks, certified copies of documents, apostilles, postage, copying documents, etc.

The fees paid in Santo Domingo were included with Lily's legal fees, and I don't have a break down of that handy.

Just curious why the big gap between watch to Sept?  Did you move there before September?
We thought we could start now and be there by end of the year this year??

A guess

The gov't shut down or slowed down for CV19

all things took longer

Thank you.  That makes sense.  We have been like this for so long now, sometimes I forget about it.

"A guess

The gov't shut down or slowed down for CV19

all things took longer"


Correctamundo. Everything ground to a halt, so we waited a bit longer than normal for the approval.

Yes - right after we completed our application, the shut downs happened. The limited staff in Migración was focused on business visas.

There was also a change in administration in August!

modaisky1971 wrote:

Just curious why the big gap between watch to Sept?  Did you move there before September?
We thought we could start now and be there by end of the year this year??

And yes, we moved down in July - as soon as the border opened up! Our residency visa was in process, so we were here legally until we were approved!

excellent!  Thank you for the update.  All of these timelines are so confusing.  We just sold our home and close Sept 30th but know it likely won't be until end of year that we can go as paperwork isn't yet started.  I just don't want another full winter here in Canada! LOL

We came down in July, but we didn't ship in our car and household items, bring our dog down, or start construction on our home until after we were approved. We didn't want to have too much to "unwind" if, for some reason, we weren't able to get our residency.

Confirms that you're an outlier. Still, it seems you left some expenses out, like total lawyer expenses.

jwj938924 wrote:

Confirms that you're an outlier. Still, it seems you left some expenses out, like total lawyer expenses.

What, exactly, confirms that I'm an outlier? There are plenty of others here that have not had issues gaining residency, and there are quite a few that got shafted by an attorney who was more interested in marketing her services than in actually helping clients! The people who have problems are the most vocal and those horror stories are the ones you'll remember.

I didn't list the attorney's fees because I don't feel that's my place. If Lishali wants to disclose her fees publicly, she can. I'm sure there are differences in both her own legal fees as well as the fees paid to Migracion based on the type of residency being applied for and the particular circumstances of your application.

Well said and absolutely correct!

I know both lawyers in question here..

I ran from the first one after 2 phone calls

The only thing that attracted me initially was she came to Cabrera every Friday
Lazy me....

Those who used her must have missed some clues..... not shaming here
I was living here...
A true foreigner might not have gotten the innuendos

Good riddance, I say

Your statements and.....about 8 years of horror stories. And it's why so many, especially snowbirds, dont bother with residency.

So yes I agree there are many horror stories.

However we often don't here the thousands of success stories! 

Human beings tend to tell 7 people the horrors and 1 person the good stuff!  We need to spread the positive.

Personal experience: I know at least 40 individuals and couples who have worked with or are working with Lishali.  ZERO complaints.  Many cases were tough screwed up cases that she got fixed and resolved. 

No one is perfect obviously but Lishali is damn good.

I cannot say that about many lawyers here.  Actually only one other one, he is a labor lawyer and also damn good.

Hello: This may not be the right forum but this is my first time making a comment. This question is for the planner? Can you recommend quality auto dealership that sells quality used cars?

Welcome to the forums.  This is the wrong place but that's ok. 

If you search you will find threads about buying vehicles. Many if us recommend the services of Cruffman who knows the vehicles, the problems the dealers and the systems here!

Hello, does anyone a good Immigration lawyer? I need a reference please. We are thinking of return the DR for sure living between US and DR since our children are there in the US. Would really appreciate the help!

Yes - Read through this post and you'll see lots of satisfied clients of Lishali (Lily) Baez. You can reach her at 809-860-1231.

She's awesome!

I also recommend her!

Thank you for the quick response.

Me too Lily is great