Anyone experienced? Please help

@Kamil99

Hello Kamil. Though certainly no consolation, you are not alone in finding yourself in this situation.

Here are a couple of links with perhaps some useful info for you.

This thread is a bit dated but will still contain pertinent advice

Posts from a member recently, here

My advice to same member, here.

A sticky thread on the VN forum's main page covers VIETNAMESE FAMILY LAW ACT

(direct link, here)

Good luck, Kamil. Please let us know how you fare.

Your feedback would undoubtedly help others

@Kamil99

Kamil, I forgot to mention the expat.com search page.

Here are the results when searching for the word "custody".

Try variations on that (eg. child, divorce, access etc)

Again, good luck

@Kamil99 Just spit-balling here for a possible solution ... Might be worth approaching the local temple or church leadership and plead your case ... I have heard of this solving difficult situations in many cases in Asia ... Any way you slice it, it's tough when kids are involved ... trust me ... when I was a pre-teen, my mom dated a mafia boss in Houston (post nasty divorce w/nasty custody battle)... my dad had to disappear due to bad blood between he and my mom ... sighhhh ... wish you the best whatever the outcome. Oh, and prayer couldn't hurt either ... regardless if you are the praying type.

...I am completely broke... I found out that there is an office called "Law Enforcement Office" and I need to make an application there by Vietnamese.. have no idea how..
-@Kamil99

Main advice (for anyone reading this thread): if you are going to father a child with a Vietnamese woman in Vietnam, be sure you are independently wealthy AND fluent in Tiếng Việt AND have an independent way to live in Việt Nam (such as an employment TRC)

Those are the three huge strikes against you, going forward.

Hopefully you can get this turned around, but you'll probably need ongoing assistance from a Vietnamese lawyer, and that won't be free or cheap.

The fact that you are "completely broke" is likely a main reason you've been cut off, right?

I'm guessing you would be telling us how much child support money you are sending, IF you were sending any...?

What will you do to support yourself AND your daughter when you return (on a 30 day eVisa?)

I'm guessing you will use up money that could be used to help support your child by spending money on your travel expenses in order to see her?

Good luck with all of that.

@Kamil99

I have heard (purely anecdotally) that there exist a "compassionate visa (?)", which could be granted to people who are the sole supporter of a VN citizen. Again, at this point this is hearsay. Best to check directly with VN immigration officials. In fact, I would suggest you exhaust  all of the options available through immigration prior to throwing money in to the VN legal system.

There is also a possibility outlined here. My thinking is that as a citizen your parental rights would be easier to have enforced (and expectedly less costly). Also, no further visa runs, but...

THE CONDITIONS TO GRANTED VIETNAMESE CITIZENSHIP

"As a spouse, father, mother or child of VN citizen"

Conditions for this to occur, in your case, would be...

"Have full civilization action about  full capacity as the regulations of Vietnam law.

Obey the Vietnamese constitution and laws; respect the traditions, customs and habits of Vietnames ethnic.

Must renounce foreign nationality.  (now that's a bit of a rough one)

Must Have Vietnamese names, and clearly stated in the decision of citizenship application."

Also, see "Some special cases"

(requires "A copy of a birth certificate or valid papers to prove paternity")

Do please keep us updated, Kamil.

I am confident others would benefit from your feedback.

@Aidan in HCMC I really appreciate this.. It helps me a bit of relief that I am not alone and there are actually some good people.. I feel horrible for the past months..

@Friday with Mateo I am definetely praying type.. and that's all I have been able to do for this case mainly so far.. I understand your approach but unless it's dictated by law.. My ex is going to try to take advantage of any situation.. I feel like it.. For now, I have 2 possible solutions.. 1) from the Law Enforcement Office, 2)from the District Committee.. Whenever I have any progress.. I will let you guys know about the details... Thanks a lot.. This is al a part of life.. Humans are capable of anything..

@OceanBeach92107 Your points are perfectly correct.. I agree.. I wish I had someone warning me before I took this decision.. But anyways.. She is very rich.. She is coming from a very wealthy family.. Her father was the CEO of a company.. EVN for all his life.. When I worked in VN for 4 years.. I was an English teacher and supporting my family (her and baby) with all of my salary all the time.. In VN culture, the man is supposed to give all of his earnings for the wife to control and manage.. at least to my knowledge.. I did that all this time and now I am completely broke.. Right nowI am in Cambodia . and waiting for my Business visa to pass from the immigration so that I can come back to VN.. When we divorced.. She didn't request any child support at all.. trusting her family.. My only problem is that she doesn't let me see my daughter.. even if I have a court order saying that I can see her..

anyone knows about a legal agreement between husband and wife that prevents boths sides from something like this happening? before or after divorce..

@OceanBeach92107 Your points are perfectly correct.. I agree.. I wish I had someone warning me before I took this decision.. But anyways.. She is very rich.. She is coming from a very wealthy family.. Her father was the CEO of a company.. EVN for all his life.. When I worked in VN for 4 years.. I was an English teacher and supporting my family (her and baby) with all of my salary all the time.. In VN culture, the man is supposed to give all of his earnings for the wife to control and manage.. at least to my knowledge.. I did that all this time and now I am completely broke.. Right nowI am in Cambodia . and waiting for my Business visa to pass from the immigration so that I can come back to VN.. When we divorced.. She didn't request any child support at all.. trusting her family.. My only problem is that she doesn't let me see my daughter.. even if I have a court order saying that I can see her..
-@Kamil99

Thanks for giving a clearer picture of the situation.

It seems to make good sense for you to take care of your employment first, including (hopefully) a TRC or business visa giving you some residence status other than a tourist.

Get some financial stability again before you attempt to get involved in legal proceedings you cannot afford at the moment.

Also, whatever the reasons and behavior underlying your divorce, it's really important (especially here in Vietnam) that you only speak or write supportive words about your child's mother.

You might start at this time by writing a letter to your child.

Tell your child that you are very happy and at peace knowing that she is being cared for by her mother and extended family who certainly love her very much.

Mention that you remember her in prayers continually and that you are looking forward to a future time when it will be possible to visit with her and her family.

Also mention that you are regularly saving money for her benefit, and that you hope the time will come soon when you can provide regular support for her needs.

In the long run, I personally think you'll stand a better chance of having a good relationship with your daughter someday if you take a tack similar to that.

In my own personal experience in the USA with a woman who didn't want me involved in our child's life, it wasn't until he turned 13 that she realized the importance of me being involved in our son's life.

Now he's 33 years old and we have a good relationship that's evolved since then.

Getting to "see your daughter" is an aspiration many of us understand.

But if you really and truly care about the future of your child born to a Vietnamese mother in Vietnam, it will probably be best for her if you send clear signals to her mother (through your letter to your daughter) that you intend to be the type of father her family will want to be involved in your daughter's life.

Good luck!

@Kamil99 Please do not "write off" the informal system ... in most Asian cultures ... there is an elder in the neighborhood who carries a lot of weight in his or her judgement of local matters ... I know we Western folks are not accustomed to this style of conflict resolution ... but there is nothing to lose by at least exploring this ... and no matter what happens ... sometimes you just have to step aside and say ... :the universe has its ways, and I am just along for the ride" ... Take a deep breath and enjoy the good things ... I recently read a book called "Never Fall Down" ... amazing story of a Cambodian kid and his struggle to survive the most difficult circumstances under the Khmer Rouge rulers ... and lastly ... the great rocker David Le Roth once said ... "Don't sweat the Small Stuff ... and it's all Small Stuff" ... ok one more ... my Okinawa grandmother once told me "Time heals all" ... at the time, it meant little ... but after the time passed ... it really was super advice from a wise old woman. I will say a pray it all works out for all the people involved. Family affairs are rarely simple.

the universe has its ways, and I am just along for the ride" ... Take a deep breath and enjoy the good things ...

This one is similar to my religion.. I don't know any old elders who would be interested in resolving this issue.. At this time.. I am only praying and trying to survive too...

@OceanBeach92107 There are a lot of wrong things my ex wife doesn't realize .. There are a lot of things can go very wrong with a daughter growing up without a father.. Clinically proven stuff.. and besides, the health system.. education system.. legal system.. etc in VN is not very promising for my daughter to be here.. My ex already knows that I wanted to go back to my country for living.. She is using everything that I hold dear against me.. and trying best for manipulation.. I don't feel that all of these are fair.. Only a kid and a father suffering as a result.. I am able to listen to your recommendation clearly but I am not sure if I can follow emotionally.. Cz I feel so hurt ...

@OceanBeach92107 There are a lot of wrong things my ex wife doesn't realize .. There are a lot of things can go very wrong with a daughter growing up without a father.. Clinically proven stuff.. and besides, the health system.. education system.. legal system.. etc in VN is not very promising for my daughter to be here.. My ex already knows that I wanted to go back to my country for living.. She is using everything that I hold dear against me.. and trying best for manipulation.. I don't feel that all of these are fair.. Only a kid and a father suffering as a result.. I am able to listen to your recommendation clearly but I am not sure if I can follow emotionally.. Cz I feel so hurt ...
-@Kamil99

I'm glad you are being honest.

You just explained why your ex is having no contact with you.

This is a clash of cultures, and she certainly knows what you'd like to do if you could.

You've also made it clear why she might not have wanted to remain married to you.

Keep proceeding with that mindset and that argument and you'll almost certainly stand no chance of prevailing with your legal actions in Vietnam.

You would essentially be attempting to convince the government that you are a better option as a custodial parent than her Vietnamese mother.

If you don't see the futility in that (especially as a "totally broke" ESL teacher without any means of support in your home country) then you are sadly unaware of the prevailing cultural and legal norms in Vietnam.

Good luck!

@OceanBeach92107 I guess there may be a bit of misunderstanding due to my lack of self explanation. I never intended to take my child away from her mom. I intended to go to my country when we have a financially stable life. Not this time. During our divorce, my ex wife told thr judge and me that she is willing to let me see the daughter and raise her together etc. But when she gave me my first visitation day and time and I arrived there.. She said that I need to wait for her more.. I asked how long and she said around 1 hour. I asked why? She said that she went outside to a shopping mall and will be back from there. I got angry. I said that you gave me this time and place 1 week ago. Why you treat me like this now? And she said that come later then.. I don't have time for you, I am a single mother with a baby. She said that she will let me know when to see her. After sometime, she didn't for almost 1 month. I went to the police station near her house and tried to explain the situation. Unaware of the legal application differences here... One of the police called her and asked her why she is not leting me see my daughter I guess. And then she got mad.. She messaged me and said that she is cancelling my TRC now. and I should go back to my country. I went back to the judge and explained the situation. Judge called her and talked. Judge explained to me that my ex wife wants to meet with me in Immigration Department for cancelling my TRC and also letting me see my daughter there.. That sounded very ridiculous but still I accepted. When I arrived at the immigration office, there was no daughter.. I asked her where is our daughter? And also recorded the whole thing on video. I still let her cancel my TRC cz that is her legal right if she chooses to do so. After a long 4 months now.. 2 days ago was the birthday of my daughter and she sent me 2 photos of her with the cake. I said that she looks good and thanked her. After 1 day, she deleted the photos and blocked me. I am totally lost.. But I am determined that I will try my best to go and do my legal right as much as I can.. The rest I only trust my God. That's all

Sighhh ... I really feel your pain ... my parents went through a VERY nasty divorce and custody battle ... it still impacts the entire family (11 kids in my dad's side) almost 50 years after the fact ... My divorce days were painful too ... my vindictive wife would do anything (and I mean ANY THING) to hurt me ... and she did ... but I took the high road and never let my sons and extended family see (as much as possible) the bad stuff that typically goes on in divorces ... you are in a tough pickle friend ... just do your best with what you have ... that is all you can do ... your daughter will always love you and as she matures, she will see things more clearly and hey, when she is an adult ... well, she will make adult choices free from the control/influence of her mom ... but I know it must feel bad RIGHT NOW ... just do your best to endure it ... it gets better as time passes ... try and stay as positive as possible ... don't let the "divorce games" destroy the good inside you and turn your heart dark ... hope it helps ... seems you have some good folks here who care ... love yourself and take care of you ... your daughter needs that more than ever, me thinks