Expired Rental Contract

09/21/23 @alan279.  It does, especially if you have another place all lined up.  You and your landlady will probably get into a discussion, maybe an intense one, about your security deposit. 

@abthree I have no security deposit. I don’t have another place lined up yet.

@alan279 As usual go with @abthree.

I will try to be a little help since I have not rented a place to live in over 40 years. My initial confusion was the "I am 4yrs into a 2yr rental contract".  So either I misunderstood or if that is actually correct, then you are living without a rental contract.

If that is the case then find a place as soon as possible, you really are living without a contract.  Surprises Happen.

Roddie in Retirement

Roddie....

That's how I interpreted it as well.

    I’m four years into a two year rental contract on my apartment. The landlady wants to increase my rent.

    -@alan279

Is this your first increase after four years? That alone would be amazing. Where are you located? Have rent and property values gone up around you? Do you like it there? And lastly, what hasn't increased in price? To fill you in, I've been a landlord for y-about thirty five years, in a couple of countries, including Brazil for fifteen years

@roddiesho Sorry for the unusual wording. Just nothing happened when the contract expired. The landlady didn’t say anything to me. I didn’t want to remind her to increase my rent. 😀

I just kept paying the rent month after month and not thinking about it. I think the contract expired in April 2021. But I never received a copy of the contract. She didn’t want a security deposit. She told me to give her as much notice as I could before moving out. Pretty informal, really.

So she informally told me Tuesday that wants to increase my rent. i was surprised. She then said the increase could be effective in October or November. Pretty informal, still.

Seems odd to me. But not as odd as my first rental contract in Brazil. 😵‍💫

@rraypo First rent increase in more than four years. I’ve been thinking about moving for a while. I’m in Ilhéus. Rents and everything have gone up and up. I’ve been in Brazil fifteen years.

    @rraypo First rent increase in more than four years. I’ve been thinking about moving for a while. I’m in Ilhéus. Rents and everything have gone up and up. I’ve been in Brazil fifteen years.        -@alan279

I've had rentals in Brazil for about fifteen years, rented out through property management. In the USA, I have been a landlord for almost 35 years. My experience in Brazil has been that property managers are VERY strict with lease contracts, requiring tons of background reports, inspections, and increases etc., It sounds like you have had a very good arrangement for you with your landlord.

In the USA, I can move a new tenant into a vacant place in one day and have done it in less than that nowadays. The background checks run in under a minute per person over 18 yo, and I can run them 24 hours a day, every day of the year, then it's only reference calls.  But not so in Brazil where my average has been two weeks, once a new and high-quality tenant is found, as there is so much more paperwork with the property managers, and things only happen during the day, weekdays, and nothing on holidays.

    I’m four years into a two year rental contract on my apartment. The landlady wants to increase my rent. I’ve been thinking about moving, so sooner seems better than later now. I don’t have a copy of the rental contract. I plan to pay the monthly rent tomorrow and hope to move soon. Does this sound like a good plan?
   

    -@alan279

Yes, you can do that, For as long as you did not sign a term lease renewall, you are on tenancy at will lease. 

I would ask the landlady for a copy of the original contract and any addenda to it. 

Otherwise, if you like your rental , you can always haggle to a lower rate. 

@sprealestatebroker I paid the rent today. I’m looking for another place to live. When  I find a place I like, I’ll move. And I will pay the rent on my current apartment until I move.,

Thanks!

@alan279 I would go with @sprealestatebroker's advice, he is the expert on that, but I defiantly think you should start to look around for another place in case it goes south.

Roddie in Retirement

For those who did not get it...

1.Tenancy at will = Month to Month Lease

2.Term Lease = the original contract you signed with a lenght of stay stipulation.  In Brazil, it is standard practice to sign off a 30 month lease, however, a tenant might  break the contract on the 13th month, granted he/she provided ample vacating notice, and without any monetary penalties

3.Vacating notice. Ideally 90 days for vacating the original lease, or 30 days after the lease has expired.

4.Security Deposit. Security deposit is not to be used up for owed monthly rent. You are entitled to a full refund of all moneys paid against the security deposit, plus accrued interest, provided you met the financial and stipulations of your lease contract. 

In case of security bond ( Titulo de Capitalizacao ), or Renter's Insurance ( Seguro Fianca ), the Insurer will disbursed payments, after a consent release from the landlord.

5.If you break the lease, then the landlord will forfeit security deposit held, and might seek additional damage on income loss, unless there is some sort of settlement.  Also covered in the Security Deposit might be damage against property. You may be liable for damages. 

6.The above paragraph only exempts a tenant of additional owed moneys if only he/she opted for Renter's Insurance option.

7.The Landlord may not ask for more than one type of monetary guarantee.  It also cannot ask for Security Deposit ( maximum three month's rent ) and Renter's Insurance altogether.  It's either one of the other.

8.In the case both agree to a Security bond ( Titulo de Capitalizacao ), the landlord/landlady  might, at his/her discretion determine the amount of the bond's face value.  Whether it is 3, 6 months, it's is at their discretion.

    For those who did not get it...
1.Tenancy at will = Month to Month Lease

2.Term Lease = the original contract you signed with a lenght of stay stipulation.  In Brazil, it is standard practice to sign off a 30 month lease, however, a tenant might  break the contract on the 13th month, granted he/she provided ample vacating notice, and without any monetary penalties

3.Vacating notice. Ideally 90 days for vacating the original lease, or 30 days after the lease has expired.

4.Security Deposit. Security deposit is not to be used up for owed monthly rent. You are entitled to a full refund of all moneys paid against the security deposit, plus accrued interest, provided you met the financial and stipulations of your lease contract. 

In case of security bond ( Titulo de Capitalizacao ), or Renter's Insurance ( Seguro Fianca ), the Insurer will disbursed payments, after a consent release from the landlord.

5.If you break the lease, then the landlord will forfeit security deposit held, and might seek additional damage on income loss, unless there is some sort of settlement.  Also covered in the Security Deposit might be damage against property. You may be liable for damages. 

6.The above paragraph only exempts a tenant of additional owed moneys if only he/she opted for Renter's Insurance option.

7.The Landlord may not ask for more than one type of monetary guarantee.  It also cannot ask for Security Deposit ( maximum three month's rent ) and Renter's Insurance altogether.  It's either one of the other.

8.In the case both agree to a Security bond ( Titulo de Capitalizacao ), the landlord/landlady  might, at his/her discretion determine the amount of the bond's face value.  Whether it is 3, 6 months, it's is at their discretion.
   

    -@sprealestatebroker

In my experience, (maybe only happens  outside SP), contracts are only for 12 months.

        For those who did not get it...1.Tenancy at will = Month to Month Lease 2.Term Lease = the original contract you signed with a lenght of stay stipulation.  In Brazil, it is standard practice to sign off a 30 month lease, however, a tenant might  break the contract on the 13th month, granted he/she provided ample vacating notice, and without any monetary penalties3.Vacating notice. Ideally 90 days for vacating the original lease, or 30 days after the lease has expired.4.Security Deposit. Security deposit is not to be used up for owed monthly rent. You are entitled to a full refund of all moneys paid against the security deposit, plus accrued interest, provided you met the financial and stipulations of your lease contract.  In case of security bond ( Titulo de Capitalizacao ), or Renter's Insurance ( Seguro Fianca ), the Insurer will disbursed payments, after a consent release from the landlord. 5.If you break the lease, then the landlord will forfeit security deposit held, and might seek additional damage on income loss, unless there is some sort of settlement.  Also covered in the Security Deposit might be damage against property. You may be liable for damages.  6.The above paragraph only exempts a tenant of additional owed moneys if only he/she opted for Renter's Insurance option.7.The Landlord may not ask for more than one type of monetary guarantee.  It also cannot ask for Security Deposit ( maximum three month's rent ) and Renter's Insurance altogether.  It's either one of the other. 8.In the case both agree to a Security bond ( Titulo de Capitalizacao ), the landlord/landlady  might, at his/her discretion determine the amount of the bond's face value.  Whether it is 3, 6 months, it's is at their discretion.         -@sprealestatebroker

In my experience, (maybe only happens  outside SP), contracts are only for 12 months.
   

    -@Peter Itamaraca

Nope.

They are very common in Sao Paulo.

A 30 month lease, with an automatic opt out by the 13th month wihtout incurrying into financial penalty. 

It's  not written into law anymore.  It was  customary, and  inherited as a hedge from the days of triple digit  runaway inflation rates, back into the 90's so as to protect tenants. 

Instead of Rent Control , we had longer lease terms with increases pegged to a specific inflation index, spelled under the contract. 

You could only apply increases outside the specified indexes once the original lease was expired. 

Notice a surge on Flat Building Construction in Sao Paulo  surged dujring the 80's and beyond, to meet the demand for flexible tenancy demands. And local investors took in with gusto.

You can rent flats by flexible terms, daily, weekly, monthly .

Eventually, this caught on and it evolved to your typical Branded/Flagged hotel ( our equivalent to Days Inn/Ramada/Comfort Inn/ Best Wester/Marriot became Melia, Ibis, Formula One, Comfort Inn, Radisson, and now Hilton ), where you still can purchase a condominium unit designed for lodging, collecting guaranteed variable  passive income. 

@sprealestatebroker

Maybe you misunderstood me, or I did not explain myself well. I said that maybe 30 month rental contracts are common in Sao Paulo, but elsewhere I have only come across 12 month contracts...

That might be the case. 

In Sao Paulo, back when  I arrived in 2013, 30 months were the norm.

AirBnb might be to blame on short term rentals.  Landlords were unaware of this hidden demand

Id find a new place, ive been fortunate in not running into any of these crazy requirements for rentals. Most are shocked I am not trying to haggle down the listed price and are happy that I pay each month on time, one place i lived at for 4 years - started only with a 1 year contract, they didnt increase the price, they were just happy for the stable income.

It really depends where you go and who you deal with however I personally have never had to throw down any kind of a deposit.

It probably helps I do out of pocket repairs ( small ones ) with advising them I am doing it. If you make any changes without notification that can be a world of hell for you!

However if you just find a next place, give her a few months notice after you get the new place so she can post it to replace tenancy and you will be fine!

Here's a   tip for any apartment hunter worth trying on your own, without the help of a real estate broker or running into a greedy slumlord.

Always look for overlooked buildings..Hint...  Remember those charming walk up apartments, on sans door man buildnigs ( Watch Seinfeld if you did not get it )?   

Well, most of them are the equivalent in Brazil to the "Loja e Sobreloja".  That's a walkup apartments upstairs and store fronts downstairs, mostly featured on sans doorman, sans elevator type of buildings.   

Often times, the upper floors  were merely designated for storage of an improv office suite where an accountant, dentist, or lawyer hung his shingle.Downstairs you had the store fronts.  A dead ringer, is a building with two sequential numbers ( odd or even ).  Say, Rua Teodoro Sampaio, 560/562.   

Not having an elevator means a cheaper condo association dues. Elevator buildings demand a maintenance contract.   Also, those walkups do not warrant enough work to have a superintendent in the payrool.  And if the building has no condo association, it means the building is a Fee Simple Ownership type, meaning, Condo or not Condo, the retail rent subsidizes uppstairs units.  Add that and lower tax rates, you save a bundle on the fixed costs.   

They are often found on old settlements/neighborhoods.  Your merchandise store, your lunch counter, your local bakery.

They might not be trendy or fashionable to Brazilians, but you ain't a Brazzer, so start a trend on your own. Be a trendsetter and a frugal bloke. You are a foreigner, which affords you to be excentric.

And the best part, other than the fact you are left alone, and became incognito, is that you are in fact much safer than your doorman building dwelling.   

You know your shit brudder kkkkkkkk

Thanks Gasparzinho 777 ( Casper the Friendly Ghost ).....

And by the way, folks. 

These walk up buildings ( anywhere from two stories to about 5-6 stories, anything over 3 stories needs to have an elevator, not necessarily a doorman ). they tend to be located on more settled parts of towns.

Power Centers and Strip Malls are still non existing in Brazil. So free standing store fronts, while common place, often are side to side with two story structures. 

When these things were built, you could literally walk into these store fronts and ask for the landlord, who might occasionally by by the back office or by the Cash Register.   They are probably long gone, collecting rent. You still can walk up to the store personnel and inquire about vacancies, and the building owner.

Another great option  are gated streets sans HOA or Condo Association. They are all over, in every neighborhood in Sao Paulo, more prevalent on sprawling residential settlements in Sao Paulo. You will find less of them on posh neighborhooods, but if you must save, and land on a safe borough, then this is an option worth considering. 

Just for your information, i spent a good part of two years, under the candle light ( ok electric light ), pouring and culling data on Sao Paulo's property tax records.  So , amongst residential buildings, single family homes, and all commercial type of property hoildings, I did gather quite a collection of gated single family home settlements.   

A gated street is no less than a gated public alley way on a dead end street.  Sometimes on a cul-de-sac layout, sometimes, just a dead end alley way.  Most homes are your typical row house duplexes, with parking out in front, if space permited. 

Gates were often locked at all times, but a recent city ordinance forced these settlements to leave gates unlocked during business hours.

You can PM me for your search, as a registered and licensed broker, by the way. 

They do no collect condo dues, or HOA dues, but anything overdue to be done  behind gates, usuallly the homeowners pass the hat out for collections.

09/30/23    Thanks Gasparzinho 777 ( Casper the Friendly Ghost ).....

Another great option  are gated streets sans HOA or Condo Association. They are all over, in every neighborhood in Sao Paulo, more prevalent on sprawling residential settlements in Sao Paulo. You will find less of them on posh neighborhooods, but if you must save, and land on a safe borough, then this is an option worth considering. 

A gated street is no less than a gated public alley way on a dead end street.  Sometimes on a cul-de-sac layout, sometimes, just a dead end alley way.  Most homes are your typical row house duplexes, with parking out in front, if space permited. 

Gates were often locked at all times, but a recent city ordinance forced these settlements to leave gates unlocked during business hours.

These sound like what we call "Vilas" here in Manaus.  They often look cozy and relatively safe, and some are quite attractive.  The houses tend to be on the small side, though, and are mostly lower-middle class housing.

I had an inflation clause in a rental contract many years ago. Which inflation index is usually used today?

@alan279

Interesting - I have never seen an inflation clause in a 12 month rental contract, only in purchase contracts where some owner finance has been involved. There are several indexes that can be used, and in my experience it is usually down to agreement between buyer and seller, but mainly we have used IGP-M/FGV.

@Peter Itamaraca I had preprinted 12 month contract with an inflation clause tied to a specific inflation index some 15 years ago. I just kept paying the same rent for several years after the contract expired.