Business visa run and bank account - could I get into trouble?

@Noelwastaken

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Hello Your first employer risks a lot for having made you work in you sponsored for the TRC.

Bearing in mind that only the employer can legally obtain a TRC for you. Once obtained, if you change employers, the new employer must start the process again.

It is strictly forbidden to work in Vietnam without a TRC and you risk being placed on the blacklist.

In language schools, you have to sort because some keep your passport, pretending that they are doing the TRC but do nothing.

For the bank, without TRC, even if you manage to open an account, it will be impossible for you to transfer your money abroad. So the starting point is to get the TRC.

Try changing cities, if you are in Hanoi, try Ho Chi Minh City or other big city. Take precautions: Leave your passport with your employer only in front of witness and obtaining a receipt and start working only when you obtain the TRC.

In the meantime, you can stay with your tourist visa and, if necessary, do a Visa run in a other country, the only way to stay in the territory.

    Hi everyone,
I'm an English teacher from South Africa living in Hanoi. I have to do a visa run soon, as my current tourist visa is going to expire in like 2 weeks.

I've been working for a company that did not want to get me a TRC or business visa and all that. I've been with them for only a month and I didn't think too much about it because it was just a quick fix for money while I got settled in Hanoi.

One of my coworkers is offering to help me get a business visa through one of his "contacts'" companies, so that I can finally open a bank account here and not worry about only being paid in cash, paying for services in cash etc. (It's been a bit of an inconvenience).

My coworker is a very nice guy and super chill, but I've only known him for this one month, and I'm still super green to living in Vietnam. (I've been here since October, only moved to Hanoi in the new year from the country-side).

Another friend, someone I also have only known for very little time says to be careful and not go through with his offer, because I could get blacklisted and deported if the authorities find out. She's been living in Vietnam for many years now, so I am considering her opinion heavily despite not knowing her well.

I tried to ask my older brother for advice, since he's also been living and working here for 5 years but his opinion is mostly 'you might get burnt for doing this, you may not, the risk is up to you'. So it's not really.. much help, just stating the obvious.

I've ran into quite a bit of trouble moving here to begin with. My first employer made me work under her contract without paying me, and when I wanted to leave it was a whole battle of threatening to get me blacklisted. I've posted about it on here previously.

So I'm pretty exhausted from fighting these type of battles.

My coworker has been living here a long time with his Vietnamese wife and claims to own many businesses. When I asked him further about the visa, he said 'they won't ask questions, you just show them the business visa and they'll let you in. I've done this for many people.' Of course, I want to believe he is a good man, but I can't really put myself at unnecessary risk anymore.

I guess as I'm typing this, I'm coming to the conclusion that I should probably just do another tourist visa run, and get a bank account once I'm with a new company who can sponsor a TRC or something that will let me get a bank account.

And before anyone starts on the 'you can open a bank account with a tourist visa' thing, I've tried with multiple banks that local friends have recommended - Vietcombank, AB Bank, Bid V.

Vietcombank was a huge pain and said I can only open a savings account where the money can't be moved at all, not even for online banking.

AB Bank said I will need a 6 month visa (what type, they didn't specify), to open any bank account at all.

And I still haven't tried Bid V - my friend said they won't issue a card but they will let me do online banking and transactions, but I'm not sure.

I'm just really tired of being locked out of society in these ways. Maybe I should just bear with being cash only for a while.

Thanks for reading, I'd love to hear thoughts.
   

    -@Noelwastaken

please disregard the person who's telling you it's illegal to work here without a TRC.

the truth is, it's illegal to work here without a work permit.

you've been working without a work permit, so...

you've already been engaging in illegal and risky behavior.

you cannot legally get a business Visa (or TRC) in your situation unless you first have a work permit.

so if anyone is offering to get you a business Visa you should instead ask them to get you a work permit.

but as I said it seems that no matter what you do you're going to be engaging in illegal activity here so I'm really not sure why you are being cautious with one illegal activity when you have not been cautious concerning your current illegal activity.

Cheers!

@OceanBeach92107 I know I have been, but that's why I'm trying to get into a better situation.

@berpasfrvn Thanks for the reply, sorry for replying so late - I didn't get notifications for some reason.

So you recommend I don't work for my next company until they can get me a TRC?

It probably seems so basic, but I dunno I just got here not long ago and I still don't know what is norm, what is legal etc. Particularly because the last school I worked for recently acted like I was unreasonable for requesting a TRC when I started. They said it's too expensive even if I split the admin fees with them and such.

I'm so broke at this point and I'm just really stressed about getting into trouble for stuff I didn't know. It's why I'm trying to ask around.

Everyone just ends up saying 'the advice so and so gave you is wrong, but I can't give you an answer either, maybe go to this person/resource' and then I go to whichever person or forum they recommend and then get the same spiel and I just keep going around in circles of people telling me I'm wrong but not being able to say why.

Sorry I'm a bit exhausted and frustrated haha

    @berpasfrvn Thanks for the reply, sorry for replying so late - I didn't get notifications for some reason.
So you recommend I don't work for my next company until they can get me a TRC?

    -@Noelwastaken

You can't get a TRC or a legal business visa UNTIL YOU RECEIVE A LEGAL WORK PERMIT!

And until you receive your work permit, you are working ILLEGALLY.

Your number one priority should be qualifying for and getting A LEGAL WORK PERMIT.

Otherwise you are just talking silly.

Your pretending that you didn't know you were working illegally isn't going to mitigate the penalties when you are caught, and an illegal business visa is only going to make the situation worse while also making you poorer.

    @berpasfrvn Thanks for the reply, sorry for replying so late - I didn't get notifications for some reason.So you recommend I don't work for my next company until they can get me a TRC?It probably seems so basic, but I dunno I just got here not long ago and I still don't know what is norm, what is legal etc. Particularly because the last school I worked for recently acted like I was unreasonable for requesting a TRC when I started. They said it's too expensive even if I split the admin fees with them and such.        -@Noelwastaken

Ultimately, it is the fault of these "schools".  so, NO, don't work for any company until they can get you a WORK PERMIT. Do NOT listen to any of their BS sob stories!

First, you need to get a new tourist visa before your current one expires so that you do not overstay. I assume that you can get a 3-month visa these days? That will give you plenty of time for the next step.

Second, you must find an honest legitimate employer that can hire you legally. Since the Tết holiday has come and gone, the peak hiring season is starting now. The best thing to do is network with other teachers who can give you advice, support and job leads.

Also, post your CV and apply for jobs online:

https://vietnamteachingjobs.com

Definitely consider leaving Ha Noi, if not Vietnam. I've already blacklisted the country myself. Anyway, there are better cities. Vũng Tàu comes to mind. You can live at the beach, and there's a fair amount of work. It's too boring for many though, so schools are usually looking for fresh blood down there.

If you're on facebook, there's a group called "Hanoi English teachers’ bad experiences exchange".

You can join and share your experience and get some advice. There are also numerous other groups for job listings and discussion. Just search for "Vietnam Teaching Jobs". If you're not on Facebook, just do a general web search. Based on my search results just now, there seems to be a lot of demand at the moment.

Best of luck!

@jayrozzetti23

(with permission, I'll add to your post)

Thirdly, Noelwastaken, stop working illegally, immediately.

If (when!) caught, expect a very hefty fine, deportation, and possibly being blacklisted from not just working in Vietnam, but quite probably from even reentering Vietnam.

Also, have you read this recent thread? (Link)

Do your visa run, and take heed the advice you've been given here.

Good luck

    @jayrozzetti23
(with permission, I'll add to your post)
Thirdly, Noelwastaken, stop working illegally, immediately.
If (when!) caught, expect a very hefty fine, deportation, and possibly being blacklisted from not just working in Vietnam, but quite probably from even reentering Vietnam.

Also, have you read this recent thread? (Link)

Do your visa run, and take heed the advice you've been given here.
Good luck
   

    -@Aidan in HCMC

Well, not to disagree with you because the risks certainly potentially exist; however, I think the general trend now is "voluntary self-deportation".

@jayrozzetti23 Thanks man, I really appreciate your reply.

I've done some job hunting and I've gotten a few offers from legit companies :~) It looks like I'll be able to get my work permit and then TRC and I don't have to worry about breaking any laws. It seems a lot of people are coming for the previous company I worked at now, because they've been tying people into working for them illegally.

I'm actually fine with living in Hanoi itself! I much prefer it to secluded spots, but the beach does sound lovely. I'm hoping I can finally move on to the next chapter of my life and not worry so much.

I'm actually fine with living in Hanoi itself! I much prefer it to secluded spots, but the beach does sound lovely.

    -@Noelwastaken

Give us an update on how you are feeling in Hà Nội in August.

Good luck!

@OceanBeach92107 Yeah honestly thanks for commenting. It's been a real wake-up call that I need to take things more seriously. I'm going to be looking for a job that can sponsor my work permit and TRC.

I guess I've just spent a lot of time around people lately who are like "It's all illegal anyway! Do what you gotta do!", so it's become very normalised in my immediate circles to just do risky stuff like this. - This is also both desperate expats and just.. expats who have been living here so long I think they believe they're above the law and feel like they can give newbies advice like this.

I've only really had one friend here in Hanoi who has been at me saying I shouldn't dabble in these sorts of things, so I appreciate you and them pushing me to not get in trouble.

Cheers.

@OceanBeach92107

What happens in August?

@Aidan in HCMC

Thanks for the link - I'm a bit confused if the programme is a requirement or an incentive though?

If it eases your mind, I have gotten some offers already who are willing to sponsor me to work legally. I've started to understand the weight of my decisions to work illegally.

    @Aidan in HCMCThanks for the link - I'm a bit confused if the programme is a requirement or an incentive though?If it eases your mind, I have gotten some offers already who are willing to sponsor me to work legally. I've started to understand the weight of my decisions to work illegally.        -@Noelwastaken

You're welcome.

It is a requirement for all people wishing to teach English in Vietnam who do not hold an education degree. See post #8 in that thread for a list of "...who must participate in this program...".

edit: as I read it, exemption requires a minimum of a B.Ed, held by a native English speaker

@noelwastaken, hello.  Maybe you need to forget TRC by the moment, because you seem to be misunderstanding the limitations as a solution.  Regarding  job activities the only difference  between Visa and TRC is: the VISA is requested with you abroad, and TRC is requested with you inside Vietnam

If you only need a bank account inside Vietnam, receive money from overseas to Vietnam (but for sending to overseas), try TIMO DIGITAL BANK, they accept also Visa Turists but the account has a deadtime if Visa or TRC is not renewed

Your friend seems supporting you for a Business Visa (DN) and not a Working Visa (LD), that could be the reason why he is doing easy.  Both are for working but the DN doesn't need a Working Permit up to 3 months per year, and you will never get a TRC with that visa type.

The TRC are only eligible for diplomatics, investors, family or Working Visa (LD) as an employee with a contract beyond 6 months, .   

The TRC+LD  is linked to your employeer, that means:  contract finish, TRC bye bye and maximum you can stay 30 days to find another job and restart your paperwork once again.

Good look