Probably the only foreigner in Palmas (for a while)

Hi OldDogGyn,
I speak intermediate Portuguese, but plan to learn Portuguese more aggressively once I arrive in Palmas.
I will enter in October with tourist visa, but probably go down the route of marrying my girlfriend as this seems to be the best way to get permanent visa.
Where in Goiania are you based? My gf family lives close to Goiania Shopping

Hi brighthw,

I know exactly how you feel, when I came to Brazil over ten years ago now I went directly to Manaus, Amazonas and at least in the area where I lived I was the only 'gringo' who had ever set foot there much less lived in the bairro.

That fact was really kind of overwhelming in the beginning, but I spoke Portuguese at an upper intermediate level albeit with a horrible accent and the people were so amazing that I soon abandoned all my initial fears.

I was not only accepted into the community, but I was also treated like visiting royalty, really! I was there to build a school for poor kids and everybody knew it. Everybody in the bairro wanted not only to get to know me, but also be around me whenever possible.

Despite the warnings from my friends in São Paulo (which I would really recommend others listen to very carefully) that I shouldn't let anybody know I had a computer, digital camera, camcorder and the like for fear of being robbed everybody knew about them. All the men in the bairro called me to bring the camera and take photos of their almost daily soccer games. The kids (all poor, street kids and from the favela) came to the school to play on the computer. I was invited to dinner every night in the favela and if I didn't bring the camera along and snap photos they actually were rather hurt. Taking a camera into a favela and taking pictures is something I would absolutely discourage others from doing because of its inherant danger, but the way I was received in the area everybody in the favela wanted photographs with me, of their kids, their dogs,everything imaginable.

Truth was that at that point I must have been living in the safest house in all of Brazil because all the street kids, budding bandidos, etc., were keeping watch over it and over me. I had my own private army of little 'bodyguards' almost 24 hours a day. They also put word out through the very effective favela grapevine here in Brazil that nobody was to mess with me or they would account to some of the scariest people you would ever want to know. Scary to you, but to me they were just my new friends.

It can be like that for you too, it all depends on the way you treat people here and the vibes you put out. I had no plans of staying in Brazil, but after my experience in Manaus it was impossible for me to leave this country. I never will because I love Brazil and the Brazilian people too much. I could never be happy anywhere else.

Cheers,
William James Woodward - Brazil Animator, Expat-blog

ODG,
If it is ok with you I will get in contact when I visit Goiania, sounds like my gf family house in Goiania and your house seems to be very nearby each other. As a noob foreigner in Brazil every advice is valuable for me and I am looking to seek as much as I can!
As for the visa issues you are right, I will have to sort out to get a work permit or go down the marriage route. Is it easy to get work permit once I get a job in Brazil? Is it possible to look for work with a tourist visa?
The reason I ask this is that in UK it is impossible to get work permit, and companies dont even bother looking at CVs and apps if the applicant does not have valid rights to work in the UK in almost all cases.

Hi brighthw,

I'm sure Gene won't mind me answering this one for him.

Yes, it's pretty much the same here. With a tourist visa you are not permitted to work for 'remuneration' in other words no paid work, you can volunteer. That doesn't stop most people without work permits from finding informal work, selling their services or something they make to earn a living.

Lots of people are self-employed, do repairs, build furniture, make handicrafts, etc. You can also find a job somewhere where you will not be an employee that they report to the government tax collectors because they themselves are not registered businesses. There are lots of things like that. The downside is that working informally you won't make a lot of money.

Cheers,
William James Woodward - Brazil Animator, Expat-blog

I currently live in London working at an investment bank, waiting for my employment to terminate end of this month. I was originally born in South Korea and have come over to the UK in 2001 with my family and went through the secondary and university in London.

I am targeting banking/financial sector as I hope to use experience and qualifications, would they also be reluctant to issue work visa for me? If this is really the case, then I guess the only way is to get married within a few months and then start looking for jobs / start business legally...

Just getting married won't resolve things....  you have to get married and then pass throught the whole process of getting your permanent visa before you can get the work permit. That can take up to two years or more. The permanency process is fraught with bureaucracy. The only other way to obtain the work permit is get an employment contract with a company here that will help with the documentation (rare).

Cheers,
William James Woodward - Brazil Animator, Expat-blog

ok so im getting confused with this visa issues.
my understanding is that once i get married in a cartorio and apply for the permanent visa, the application itself acts as kind of a visa - which will let me stay in brazil legally and with rights to work until the visa is issued.
another thing, i thought permanent visa automatically grants working rights as well, just like permanent residency grants all rights except voting in UK. is this not the case?

Hi brighthw,

Not exactly as you are thinking you've gotten mixed messages..

Yes, the marriage and the application for permanent visa will allow you to legally remain in the country until the process is completed, however long that may be. If you want to know the truth, technically just the marriage certificate does that, you would have to carry it around with you at all times however. Once you have applied for the visa you get a protocol and that's the document that proves you are legal in Brazil until you get permanency.

No, you will not be able to apply for a work permit based solely on the application for the permanent visa... you must actually be granted the permanent visa. So, in other words you can stay but you can't (legally) work until you finish the process. It's a double edged sword which keeps most foreigners from marrying here and applying, they mostly chose to marry and remain in their home country applying for the permanent visa there, just so they can continue working. The government has probably set it up this way on purpose. They don't want ANYTHING to be easy, not ever.

Check with the Ministry of Labor (Regional Headquarters) nearest you, they may accept the application for permanent visa protocol as kind of provisional visa, SINCRE (since you should have registered within 30 days of arrival in Brasil) and your CPF and issue you a temporary work permit based on that. You would have to return and get them to stamp it for every extension that you get on the visa protocol (they never get that done in the timeframe estimated so you take it back to be stamped by DPF).

Once granted the visa you will then have to apply for your CIE (Carteira de Indentidade Estrangeiro) this is your foreigner's ID card and it is equivalent to the RG (Registro Geral) of born Brazilians. Once you have applied for that document you will receive a protocol from the Federal Police and a printout called a SINCRE (Sistema Nacional de Cadastramento e Registro de Estrangeiros) this printout and your protocol and a valid CPF are the MINIMUM documents you need in order to obtain your work permit. You can get the CPF any time, you can't do that with the CIE.

Yes, the permanent visa (any kind of visa actually) guarantees you all the rights enjoyed by a born Brazilian, except the vote and candidacy for public office. Only naturalization gives you those rights and limits candidacy for public office to specific levels in government. (I.E. you could never become President or Vice-President of the Republic.... God forbid, I can't figure why anybody would ever want to be).

I know it is an extremely complex and confusing process so that's why most people don't understand anything about it.

Cheers,
William James Woodward - Brazil Animator, Expat-blog

WJ, your last post has cleared up some clouds over the visa issues.

So basically the application for permanent visa through marriage will allow me to 'stay' within Brazil, but does not actually grant any working rights so it is kind of tourist visa without the 6 month limit, right?

My understanding is that if I choose to marry in Brazil and then come back to London and apply for permanent visa here, then I can get this within 1-2 months, and this permanent visa will grant me all the rights just like the permanent residency of UK?

Assuming that I cannot find a generous employer who will get me a work permit, the best and quickest way to 'legally' work in Brazil would be to tie up the marriage within a few months of my arrival, come back to London and wait for the actual permanent visa to be issued by the Brazilian consulate in London and then re-enter Brazil with that, hence I have no limited rights except voting and standing for office.

Would you agree with the above? thanks.

Hi brighthw,

Basically, that's it in a nutshell your permanent visa application simply becomes like an unlimited tourist visa until the process is completed! However, before you decide to marry here and go back to London check with the Ministry of Labor and see what they have to say. They might be a bit more flexible than the Federal Police in terms of the work permit issue. So there still may be some hope at the end of the tunnel.

Also if you apply for a permanent visa in London generally it is a bit quicker, but I've never heard of them being issued in 1 - 2 months, generally it's more like 3 to 6 from the information I've gotten from other expats who have received their visas abroad.

If you do chose to return to London will you be marrying here in Brazil before you go, or wait until you return? If you have all the documentation necessary for marriage already it would probably be more practical to marry here first. Another route if you are going to wait until after you return to London is the 'marriage by proxy' that I mentioned above. However in your case it is even simpler and less expensive. It is actually 'casamento por procuração em cartório'. Your bride has the wedding at a cartório here in Brazil just as she would if you were here in person. The only difference is that you have a stand-in at the ceremony here. There is a specific for that must be filled out and notarized, but it is accepted by all cartórios here. That at least would save you the cost of an extra trip. If you want I will try to find a link to the form and pass it along to you.

Cheers,
William James Woodward - Brazil Animator, Expat-blog

Hi brighthw

I will be moving to palmas in the next 6 months, my wife and kids are going this month. how is things going for you? did you find work? is there anything you regret anything? hope to hear from you.

Hello, brighthw.

I am a Brazilian native and live in Goiania near the Goiania Shopping as well (in Setor Bueno).

I saw your post and read almost all the replies from our friends in the forum.

I regret the work permit thing is so complex, but here we have the possibility to find a "work around", for example, if you start your own business (in the name of your wife) while your papers go through. But as you have mentioned you are from (and target) the banking sector I'd like to suggest that you see if you can talk to bank Itau in London (there's a branch at The Broadgate Tower - Level 20, 20 Primrose Street, London, UK EC2A - 2EW - Tel.: (44) (207) 070 4321). Itau is a Brazilian bank which has been growing very fastly in the recent years and your skills might be appreciated by them in case you want to come to Brazil and that would ease your way down to my country. The only cons is that you might land in Sao Paulo instead of landing in Goiania (the reasons you already know from our colleague's post), but the flights between Sao Paulo and Goiania usually last only 1:15 and they are not expensive. They are also very frequent, so you should not have problem commuting to-from Sao Paulo weekly. the bank might even agree on giving you these flights as part of your benefits.

Goiania is not a great city to have fun, it is not as green and mild as London is and we have serious problems with mosquitoes and crime also, but in the other hand here are a lot of opportunities waiting to be explored here. That you will have to come down and see by yourself. Keep your doors open in London, just in case, as you might not like our dry and warm desert-like weather in the long run. Sao Paulo has a better weather but is too large and has a terrible transportation system and traffic jams.

In Goiania, the consolidated markets where you are most likely to earn big money (in my opinion) are: 1. Medical Services; 2. Beef Cattle Farming; 3. Legal Services; 4. Commerce. In Sao Paulo: 1. Industry; 2. Banking; 3. Medical Services; 4. Information Technology Consulting; 5. Legal Services; 6. Commerce.

What I suggest is that you seek opportunities at some Brazilian banks before coming and see if you get a work permit, get married (if you think you will be with her forever) then come down for a season and decide where is the best place to stay and for how long.

Hope to have helped.

All the best and success!
Pedro Carneiro Jr.

brighthw wrote:

I currently live in London working at an investment bank, waiting for my employment to terminate end of this month. I was originally born in South Korea and have come over to the UK in 2001 with my family and went through the secondary and university in London.

I am targeting banking/financial sector as I hope to use experience and qualifications, would they also be reluctant to issue work visa for me? If this is really the case, then I guess the only way is to get married within a few months and then start looking for jobs / start business legally...