Is a 240k net salary enough to live a comfortable life in Budapest?

crizti wrote:

I wonder, will this value be enough to rent a small flat in the 13th or 6th district, spend something like 6k in grocery per week, eat out and enjoy nightlife once a week, and use the public transportation?

This has been widely discussed here. Impossible to say in anything but a generic manner, which may not be helpful, since details on what you want to buy at the supermarket or how upscale or downscale your eating out habits may be need to be considered.

For what it is worth, my wife and I spend about 60,000 HUF each month for food and household costs, not including heating expenses (which are seasonal). And we live a very modest life, rarely eat out, and grow our own food in the summer.

For more fine grain cost details that may be of help, I suggest:

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/ci … y=Budapest

My husband and I only take out 200,000 HUF a month for expenses.
Sometimes we only spend half that amount and other months we spend it all.
depends on what's up each month, right now I am looking at somewhere around 100,000 for the dentist for a bridge so hard to say exactly how things can go each month.
We can spend at least 10,000 a visit at Tesco per week plus another 6,000 during the week at other markets. Sometimes less sometimes more.I don't even buy "junk" foods like chips or cookies very often.
We do not pay rent, only around a low 9,000 a month in common costs for our flat plus all utilities, health cost is out of pocket as well, somewhere around 15,000 a month for the 2 of us.
We cook at home 99.9 % of the time and rarely eat out. We without bragging cook better then most restaurants do plus we know exactly what sort of oil etc. we are using, only use good quality salt etc. We drink at home too but usually around half a bottle a day for the 2 of us unless I get extra stressed out then it's a whole bottle day.
We pack lunch when we go to the lakes or just about anywhere. know most places are too pricey for what they give you and it just gets under our skin to overpay.
We are retired and have way too many items of clothing etc. so hardly ever buy new clothing, I load up on jeans etc. about every 2 years when we go home for a visit to the US. Funny how I say I go home, I have been here a long while in Hungary and still do not think of it as home.
If you have children I think you can stretch your 240,000 monthly but saving would be hard.
many people live on far less then 100,000 a month in Hungary so perhaps we westerners are too spoiled and expect the same lifestyle we had in the west.
I know in my case for the money I spend in HU I could live in a decent flat in the US for seniors citizens with a free shuttle bus and a almost private swimming pool and spa with exercise room in the building. I sometimes think we are over paying in HU for the quality of life we are getting, noisy neighbors, too crowded in the city etc.
Used to be very cheap in Hungary that's why we put in in our minds to retire here, getting more pricey every year here so seriously thinking of going back to Vegas and playing Bingo in the casinos... Or at least swimming in a nice pool for $1. a day at the local community center, huge modern pool for a buck a day, nothing like that in Hungary.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

at least swimming in a nice pool for $1. a day at the local community center, huge modern pool for a buck a day, nothing like that in Hungary.

A bit off topic, but for free swimming there are still a couple of tiny, free beaches (no facilities) at Lake Balaton.

Yes, thanks we often drive to Balaton or even closer lake Velence( sort of muddy waters there though)
Of course taking in the cost of petrol and time is another thing.
Used to go in Las Vegas to a totally empty lap pool indoors of 16 lanes for only $1. a day or $20. for 3 months and $60. for a year! Clean water with "real" serious lifeguards not like here where 8 year old girl's drown in front of lifeguards and crowds of people like happened last summer at Paskal. Can still hear the young mother's screams in my head.It was our first time there swimming and it turned into a nightmare, so sad...
We don't really mind the petrol cost but thinking of sharing rides to Balaton on line, why not we have extra room and wouldn't mind someone chipping in for gas.

I would in general say for anyone considering moving to Hungary just come here for the experience, don't come here if making big bucks is your trip.
It is sad to really think that some people here in HU have gone to school for years and make less then I made after just taking a half-assed blackjack course in Las Vegas for 2 weeks.
Just come for an adventure not to make your fortune.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

It is sad to really think that some people here in HU have gone to school for years and make less then I made after just taking a half-assed blackjack course in Las Vegas for 2 weeks.

Ergo, the often stated saying that London is Hungary's second largest city, because it supposedly has so many Hungarians that left Hungary for better paying jobs.

Sorry for my long rant, just have a ton of insane stories in my head and too much time on my hands. Time maybe to use this energy for more then internet chatting.

Marilyn Tassy wrote:

Sorry for my long rant, just have a ton of insane stories in my head

I, for one, like reading your long posts.  They are an interesting mix of life experiences.

Thanks, if one lives long enough we can write a book.
My friend in Vegas actually did write a book about her life and is getting ready to write another, her life as been so strange.
She was one of the first women dealers in Las Vegas in the 1960's. Used to be a male only job.
These days they actually perfer  to hire women, guess they think we are push over's ,not true, just sometimes men don't like to put up with fools where as women are used to it!! Ha, ha, just kidding.

I am waiting for you to write a book x
Anyway I don't think people would be able to rent an apartment and pay all the bills on that wage but the apartment rooms are often huge compared to the UK so it is OK sharing. I for one could live comfortably just in my bedroom . I have already got two sofas, an armchair and my four poster bed in there !!! My flat in Bournemouth could fit into it .
Maybe take up ball room dancing ?

crizti wrote:

As I understood there's a high tax burden in Hungary and for a 370k gross salary you will have 242k approximately.

I wonder, will this value be enough to rent a small flat in the 13th or 6th district, spend something like 6k in grocery per week, eat out and enjoy nightlife once a week, and use the public transportation?

Hello Crizti

You may have moved to Bp by now, nevertheless I'll comment on your questions as it might be of interest to a wider audience. 

235 eFt (ezer = thousand Forint) per months (ca. 800 Euros, 600 £) is as far as I remember last year's => average household income. However, statistics has it that there would always be some individuals cashing in obscene amounts, distorting the mean, while the great majority of people would live on (a lot) less. But then, life in Bekescsaba or the southwestern end of Lake Balaton will also be more affordable than in Bp city.

To give you an idea, a scientific university staff employee with PhD degree earns about 160-180 eFt/month net, ie, after tax, roughly 600 Euros, and thus only about 1/4 to 1/5 of salaries for comparable employment in the UK, and also below the poverty line in Germany. Yet, people here do live on such income.

The figure you mention of nearer 400 eFt gross salary sounds like a contract with a multi-national company. You may be able to negotiate extras, such as a company car.

Renting a 50-sqm 2-room panel-block apartment in sought-after areas, such as the 11th district, will cost a new tenant from 80 eFt (250 Euros, 180 £) plus utilities (as of mid 2015, used to be 60 eFt two years earlier). Rents decrease towards the city outskirts. Average monthly running costs of such an apartment typically comprise common maintenance (10 eFT), centralised heating (10 eFt), electricity (5 eFt), gas & water (5 eFt), thus totalling roughly 100 Euros or 75 £. For a 100-years old-style 100-sqm flat, slap on another 50% on both rent levels and utilities. 

Food costs amount to about 2/3 of those in Germany, where especially basics (bread, potato, fruit etc.) are more affordable than abroad, while on the other hand petrol costs equal western levels. I wonder how people can afford keeping a car. No need in Bp anyway, as public transport is very efficient, the monthly ticket costing just under 10 eFt (35 Euro, 25 £). On the other end of the scale, "luxury" items like a day ticket for visiting those famous Turkish baths (Gellert, Szechenyi), 15 Euros worth, seem to be pitched exclusively at tourists' wallets.

Not sure who told you tax levels were high. In fact, Orban introduced a lowly flat rate of 16% on virtually all income (salaries, capital gains, savings interest, etc.) in order to disincentivise tax evasion. Add to this a compulsory contribution of another 6% to the national health system (EHO). Notice that the latter does not constitute your health insurance, you can't walk into a doctor's practice claiming treatment. You would be regularly insured either via deductions through your employment or contributions on a self-employed basis.

Hope this is helpful
Cheers
Jurgen

PS: Anyone any other questions, please do ask...

jurgen_in_bp wrote:

Not sure who told you tax levels were high.

A matter of perspective. Income tax lower than Germany, higher than in Switzerland for marginal average wage earners. (Personal note: My personal income tax while living in Switzerland was less than 16%)

But VAT is the highest in the EU. And while VAT is a consumption tax, if one only earns an "average" Hungarian salary most, or all, of that income goes to spending it on necessary goods and services which all carry that VAT burden. Which is why, functionally, and if unable to put a significant amount into a savings account, VAT can be considered, functionally, an addition income tax, just one that is applied post-receipt of the income.

So, a 26% VAT might be considered a relative additional 7% tax on income than in Germany** (19% VAT) and a whopping relative additional 18% tax on income compared to Switzerland (8% VAT).

So even if you get more relative money in your pocket with a lower income tax, it only visits there for a short time.

** Adjusting for the original higher income tax in Germany, Hungary still wins the relative income % tax rate, but more Germans have savings accounts than Hungarians -- which is an important fiscal considerations for inequality on another issue -- gross income disparity between EU nations.

Thank you all for your insights and sharing your experiences.   I am preparing now to move to Hungary in late December from Istanbul, where I teach.    It will help me form an idea of a budget.