Immigration and Overstay Issues

Thanks Planner

When I say confusing I simply mean that I have not received any warning.  One would assume this to be a minimum on leaving the country so you know where you stand on your following trip especially as there seems to be a tightening up of procedures.  As I said I've been coming to DR for 5 years, always overstayed a little and just paid the fine on leaving.

Or perhaps I am being too simplistic!

Ducketts

Great updates, thanks

Ducketts
I asked the warning question and got this as an answer
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yes. Those that the system provides a warning for next re-entry. Problem is that sometimes it will not issue the warning based on the previous overstays without the present one in record, so the next entry might trigger a re-entry ban on full effect without the warning.

Like I posted, this is due to reliance on the tourist entry records and exit count/date for the passport book number. Until this is refined it will be a hit and miss sort of thing.

Once the Ministry decides on a satisfactory system for both the USA/CAN and EU data controls and storage, this will be streamlines and more efficient.

Until then, I encourage overstayers to instead extend their stay legally before they exit the DR and pay the penalty fees.

Am I missing something ??

What seems to the problem with going the residency route ?

Regularly, I get chastened for warning people that the old ways will change, willy nilly

But reading the requirements for extension.... and being done once or twice every 30 days ...
I ask - Why not renew once a year - not once a month ??

Easier, more secure, ....

It may be I am misunderstanding something

ducketts wrote:

Thanks Planner

When I say confusing I simply mean that I have not received any warning.  One would assume this to be a minimum on leaving the country so you know where you stand on your following trip especially as there seems to be a tightening up of procedures.  As I said I've been coming to DR for 5 years, always overstayed a little and just paid the fine on leaving.

Or perhaps I am being too simplistic!

Ducketts

Expecting a warning is I am afraid something beyond what I would expect to happen.
It isn't simplistic, but it is just unlikely that you would be warned.

As it is, you just take your chances each time you come back after overstays.  So far, at least, the odds have been immensely in the favor of those that overstay that they will be allowed back in yet again.

It seems - from Pichardo's answer I posted above -
that Yes... you will get warning if the system has you as delinquent

If the last stay - the one as you are leaving - is the straw that breaks the camel's back....
No - no warning since the system needs to process it and include in your infractions.

Anybody else read it like that ?

That's how I read it.

Thank you

Ducketts

WillieWeb wrote:

It seems - from Pichardo's answer I posted above -
that Yes... you will get warning if the system has you as delinquent

If the last stay - the one as you are leaving - is the straw that breaks the camel's back....
No - no warning since the system needs to process it and include in your infractions.

Anybody else read it like that ?

Warning you that you can't come back again, or for 18 months, would be a bit late if it was provided to you as you were leaving, would it not?

But then, for Migracion to tell you when you enter there would be a problem if you over stay this time it might be too much to ask.

Why does one need a warning?

If you knowingly overstay your permitted time you pay the penalty is the rule in other countries.

Why is DR different?

You could argue that DR Immigration has been so lax and corrupt for so many years allowing persons to come overstay and pay that it should give warnings, because we all became complacent.

Well it did last year to all foreign missions and immigration lawyers and they in turn advised their citizens and clients. And even more recently they now stamp your passport and write the permitted stay allowed.

There are no excuses anymore - but I do have sympathy for snow birds and the like wanting to come for 2/3 months when there still is not a simple way to apply to extend ones stay for an additional 60 days.

A warning on exit is better than NO warning = in my books.

It means....
Take action now or stay away for ?? months

Apparently , the 'lock out' period depends on the abuse of overstay.
I seem to remember that....somewhere there's a scale for the penalty

windeguy wrote:

PICHARDO just posted this on DR1.  It appears there is a detail I was not aware of  and that is two consecutive 30 day extensions are possible.  Since virtually nobody is going to request the first extension, the second request is extremely unlikely. Here is PICHARDO's post.  It betrays a knowledge beyond those who actually respond to questions on Migracion's Forum. 

A foreign person who enters the DR on a visa-free 30 days stay, can extend their stay legally using the method of application stated above, each time for a 30 days extra only and the limit is 2 such extensions on a consecutive filing (again by filing a request before the next 30 days are expired). The maximum is 90 days from entry, which breaks down to 30 initial stay, plus 30 ext, plus 30 final ext. These limits are based on a specific need for each extension.

There is no 60 days extension. Only 30 and max of two issued consecutively.

Things are slowly changing and I strongly advise those overstayers to legally extend their stays in the country.

Again, until we don't finalize the General Amnesty and finish and accord with Haiti, the over 90 days visas for winterbirds will not be in the pipes.

Well Pichardo is saying something different to what is written in the regulations to the immigration law 631-11 which is exactly what DGM have told you is required to extend the tourist stay apart from the two seperate 30 days:

PÁRRAFO III.- La solicitud de prórroga debe estar acompañada de los siguientes documentos:
1. Para los Turistas:
a) Formulario de solicitud debidamente llenado;
b) Pasaporte con vigencia mínima de seis (6) meses a partir de la prorroga.
e) Boleto aéreo o marítimo de regreso;
d) Una dirección en la República Dominicana;
e) Certificado médico expedido por un medico autorizado con su debido exequátur;
f) Prueba de solvencia económica;
g) El pago de los derechos previstos.
En caso de ser aprobada la prórroga, la O.O.M. sólo podrá conceder una prórroga de
permanencia por sesenta (60) días. En caso de ser rechazada la solicitud, se procederá conforme
a lo que dispone la Ley y el presente Reglamento.

He may well be wrong on this one, unless he is writing the rules.

This thread should stop.  It is just confusing people with the unclear use of 60 Day maximum vs a 60 day overstay. 

It's simple as stated by Windy:

A foreign person who enters the DR on a visa-free 30 days stay, can extend their stay legally using the method of application stated above, each time for a 30 days extra only and the limit is 2 such extensions on a consecutive filing (again by filing a request before the next 30 days are expired). The maximum is 90 days from entry, which breaks down to 30 initial stay, plus 30 ext, plus 30 final ext. These limits are based on a specific need for each extension.

There is no 60 days extension. Only 30 and max of two issued consecutively.

With the people I know that have and continue to use this method it is exactly as I understand it with a total of 90 days in the country and is supported by the Dominican and their countries websites.

Let's finish already.

And with that, let's stop debating.

DominicanadaMike wrote:

This thread should stop.  It is just confusing people with the unclear use of 60 Day maximum vs a 60 day overstay. 

It's simple as stated by Windy:

A foreign person who enters the DR on a visa-free 30 days stay, can extend their stay legally using the method of application stated above, each time for a 30 days extra only and the limit is 2 such extensions on a consecutive filing (again by filing a request before the next 30 days are expired). The maximum is 90 days from entry, which breaks down to 30 initial stay, plus 30 ext, plus 30 final ext. These limits are based on a specific need for each extension.

There is no 60 days extension. Only 30 and max of two issued consecutively.

With the people I know that have and continue to use this method it is exactly as I understand it with a total of 90 days in the country and is supported by the Dominican and their countries websites.

Let's finish already.

This is the confusing piece of information.

DGM have confirmed word for word what is in the regulations for the immigration law. The mention of two times 30 day extensions is written nowhere other than in a post by Prichardo and certainly not in the country's legal wording. This is confusing and should not be confused and mixed in with what DGM say.

Windyguy asked if what Prichardo stated was correct and got no answer from DGM.

Go look everything DGM posted about extending the tourist stay is word for word what is written in the regulations but the regulations state 60 days extension only - which makes everything easier for people like ducketts rather than putting them off with 30 + 30. Important point and needs to be clarified and not shouted down. See the correspondence with DGM below.

https://foro.migracion.gob.do/forums/to … e-turista/

To add another forum, is confirming now an example of someone who went to DGM and sought an extension and got 60 days once off. Pichardos 30 + 30 could be a red herring.

What we know for fact is 30 + 30.  Let's see if we get a thing different on the inquiry.

PICHARDO has stated that new rules will only be written at the "Haitian Amnesty" is over.  Whatever the Haitian Amnesty being over means.  PICHARDO is well connected in the DR government in that he would know what is being discussed and is not yet implemented. So, there is no way to know what will happen and I have no idea when the Haitian Amnesty will no longer preoccupy the government when it comes to immigration  changes.

Ok let's clarify:

NOW 30 day tourist visa, apply for 1 thirty day extension for a total of 60 days.

Anything else is speculation.  The source may be good but until implementation it doesn't exist! 

That is what we deal with.

There is currently no "warning" , overstay and pay fines, you may be stopped when you come back.  Most important word is MAY.  Make your own decisions and take your own risks.

That is the current bottom line!

Hi there!
This may seem like a stupid question.....
After 2+ years of trips to Samana (5), San Francisco de Macoris (2)
Santo Domingo (1), I got my (non voting) Cedula & my
Temporary Residency which expires 21 August, 2019.
ALL stuff done here in the DR.
NOT STARTED IN CANADA like everyone says you must do.

2 years ago, we visited Canada. I was here full time for 4 years prior,
No overstay charge because I had started the residency process.
What happens if I can't renew my residency because of health reasons?

If you can't renew then you will be illegal I believe!

In Canada you can't buy a one way ticket.
You must buy round trip ticket.

When i knew I wasn't going back, 7-8
years ago, I just waited a few
days & called & cancelled my return flight.

It's good to hear you were able to handle the whole process from DR rather than start the demand in your own country of residence.

Well done

Ducketts

In 2008 when I got my residency....
there was no 'home country' part to the application

It has changed

And Tomas... in the past - like last year - I bought one ways in Canada
WestJet....

I bought one way tickets on Air Canada this year into and out of  the D.R.

Tomas Cabrera wrote:

Hi there!
This may seem like a stupid question.....
After 2+ years of trips to Samana (5), San Francisco de Macoris (2)
Santo Domingo (1), I got my (non voting) Cedula & my
Temporary Residency which expires 21 August, 2019.
ALL stuff done here in the DR.
NOT STARTED IN CANADA like everyone says you must do.

2 years ago, we visited Canada. I was here full time for 4 years prior,
No overstay charge because I had started the residency process.
What happens if I can't renew my residency because of health reasons?

If you don't renew you will be illegal. Why would anyone think otherwise?

If it ever comes to the point that you are able to renew again, you may be able to renew by paying a penalty for each month you did not renew.

If you did everything from the DR, it may have been a "fake" residency.  Or you found someone who is corrupt and on the inside at Migracion and did it in a way that looks legal.  That is not how the system works at this time  You must start in your home country.

ducketts wrote:

It's good to hear you were able to handle the whole process from DR rather than start the demand in your own country of residence.

Well done

Ducketts

It is not the "legal" way to do it at this time.  But hey, things are done illegally all the time.

Years ago, there was a Migracion Mafia that took money from clients looking to become legal residents.  They took their clients money, went in the back door of Migracion, got residency cards printed and their clients were happy.  Until the record keeping caught up to those clients and they found out their residencies were not actually in the system. This Migracion Mafia was so good, they were even tied in to the office where Cedulas were issued to foreigners, so the client was never aware until new data bases were used to track everyone.. Then they had to "adjust" their status. 

I know,  it happened to me when I tried to renew about a year again case the usual group of "doubting Thomas' say it never happened.  It was at that time where I spoke to several lawyers who also had clients in the same situation.  I got back into the system with residency and a cedula.  I had to provide a translated birth certificate with an Apostile and pay the renewal fees.  But then,  I have no choice but to be a legal resident here.   It is the only way I can get a driver's license. 

Others can certainly feel free to ignore any situations as they arise,  since it will never happen to them.
Who expects to be warned if they break the law?    Where does that happen as normal course of events?

Once again, I am sure that those that overstay will be safe forever from any consequences. 

Note: The last statement above is meant to be facetious.

Windy - your story is unique....

My story has no complications other than the increased paperwork & time need now vs 2008

For those who might be fearful.....

I have NEVER been tripped up at DGM ONCE.... never once
unless you call needing to replace a buena conducta that was out of date a trip-up
It was over 90 days.

I don't change my own oil, don't fix the house electricity, don't handle government applications - without professional help.

There may be more paperwork than a few years ago...but it is hardly as threatening as I read here .

I had over 10 yrs of residency before Naturalization... my share of renewals...incl medicals
I got tired of two trips to the DGM....having always lived it as just one until recently

not that hard at all.... tedious is not difficult

WillieWeb,  I spoke to several lawyers to find out why I was "singled out" regarding my residency renewal when I went for a 10 year residency and found out I could not renew at all until discrepancies were corrected.  I found out there were many people in the same situation and each lawyer had clients in the same situation.  It was likely because of new data bases and corruption within the Migracion office.

The prices to "fix" it were between $1,500 and $3,000 US just for their help., and I had to get my birth certificate with an Apostille, which was the hardest part and they could never have done so.    So I did the process myself and renewed my residency without any other assistance. 

As an aside,  When I got my first residency back in 2003,  I was in Santo Domingo and had someone help me get my first driver's license. That person took me to the offices, had my blood tested, residency checked, eye test and a driver's license was issued.  I renewed it a couple of times.  Then , the last time I went to renew, it was discovered that I really did not have a valid driver's license to start with.  It was never really in the data base, and they were recently linked up and I was found out.  I did suspect that I had a fake license , but it was accepted everywhere until that moment.  Then I got my "real" license a couple of renewals ago.  Had to take the computer test and read an eye chart.

As another aside,  I went to renew another type of license I have.   I was refused and the comment was that I was in jail.  I had to go to Santo Domingo, walk up to a window at the appropriate office and show them that I was not actually in jail.  Then they corrected their data base error and I received my license. 

Data bases.  Only as good as the data in them.  They are being improved and they are being linked.

hahaha

I expect your problems stem from 'the good old days' when things were fast & loose
As we know now.... not so fast , not so loose...

Your were swept up in cleanup.

I too had driver's license help - in POP.
All went smoothly.... 2009 maybe.

All depends on the person helping and the official (not so official) circumstances.

all in all, it's a better system without the gerrymandering - IMO

Windeguy & Willieweb,

Your stories are quite frightening and certainly does not give me any confidence in the DR system.  God help us all.

Ducketts

Ducketts. These are stories from back when things were "done" with contacts inside.  Relax. Those days are pretty much gone with the new systems.in place.

Windeguy - I can confirm that I personally know several who had a very very similar experience, most from the north coast.  It DID happen back then. From what I understand it's no longer possible to bypass like that!

Back to the subject of extending ones tourist card or tourist visa stay which is important to some contributing to this thread.

Since 8th May 2019 one has only been able to renew residencies and the like online. One simply cannot go to DGM and ask for an extension to your tourist stay.

And in the letters sent to foreign missions and immigration lawyers last year they wrote: 'Para mejorar aplicacion de ese tramite, la DGM se encuentra trabajando en su platforma technologica a fin de habilitar en linea la gestion de estos procesos.'

The format posted on the DGM website forum, surely  must only be available online and therefore should be an easier process once one understands the medical and solvency documentation to be deposited. Remember the wording is there for ALL nationalities and the case reported on another website did not have to povide all the documentation.

It is now upto a tourist who wants to extend their stay legally and avoid the 'high chance' of later denied entry as th DGM's words, to try to extend online and use the DGM forum to ask if not possible.

Or simply ignore everything and take the risk.

I probably had a corrupt lawyer when I applied for my residency, as apparently did others who were asked for more information years later.  It is well know that there was a group in Migracion that sidestepped the proper processes.  I was ushered in ahead of others waiting in lines.  Should have been a clue something was "happening".

That is one reason why I now do as much as possible myself.

Hi Tomas,

A couple of clarifications.  You cannot start the residency process in the DR it must be in your own country.  Probably the first tip something is wrong.

You can buy 1 way tickets from Canada, I have done so many times and have never been asked any questions.

You will have to pay the overstay fee if you are in your first residency process.  Quite simple, no card, you are not legal and not a resident.  Being in the process does not count.

Typically the medical is just to ensure that you have no contagious diseases and are not a drug addict.  If this is not the case you probably will not have any issues.

Cheers.

So now we know that Canadian airlines are not doing what they should. Bad, bad airline. Very bad.   Thanks for that DCMike.  I agree with what you said, but some have been able to explain being in process for residency and gotten away with that when leaving the country and not paying overstay fees.   Perhaps not any longer.

You are supposed to receive your file number.  That should allow you to not pay overstay fines while.in process. That is what I am told.

Didn't work for me Planner...but again...it always, always depends...

I understand.  Rarely do things work as they should!

For what it’s worth I went to the DR Consulate in Toronto today. I was told that a 30 day extension to your initial visa could only be done in Santo Domingo and that you could no longer apply at the airport. Further to that I was also told that it would not be approved anyway, with no satisfactory reason given.

Staff could not advise on any increased vigilance enforcing the rules on people who continually overstay but admitted that they have heard the rumours as well. As far as being denied entry and the length of the expulsion I was told there was not any time frame before you could come back but rather that issue would have to be addressed by a Dominican Lawyer on your behalf before you could return.

No surprise was response I should apply for residency when advised of my desire to stay several months at a time