In Effect: US - Brazil Social Security Treaty

Thanks for posting!

I just completed the process necessary to begin receiving US social security benefits. What a nightmare. During that process I did not see any news about this new Agreement between Brasil and the USA. This is great news, however I cannot find the language in the Agreement which eliminates the 5 year US residency requirement for a Brasilian spouse of a US citizen to be eligible to receive survivor benefits. Can you point me to the specific section for this change in the law?

That provision is not specific to the Agreement, so you would not find it there.   It applies to all countries which have signed a Social Security Agreement with the US. 

You can find the actual basis for this  major new benefit for Brazil spouses of US citizens here.

https://www.ssa.gov/international/payments.html

Look under the heading:  Requirements for Dependents/Survivors.  [Alternatively, under Publications.] Read very carefully  "Your Payments While You are Outside the United States."   You'll find the information that you are seeking there.

Thank you very much, Marcos.

To be more specific, I not concerned about my Social Security benefits. I am receiving those while residing in Brasil. I am concerned about a Brasilian citizen & resident dependent and their survivor benefits.

It is quite confusing. The document I am referring to is titled, "Your Payments While You Are Outside the United States (EN-05-10137). It states, at page 4, "If you are a citizen of one of the countries listed below... " (Brazil is listed) then states, "If you are receiving benefits as a dependent or survivor, you must also meet the conditions listed in this publication under the heading "Additional Residency Requirements for dependents and survivors".

OK, what are those additional residency requirements?  Before the pamphlet lists those requirements, it states "If you are a resident of a country that has a U.S. social security agreement we will continue your payments". The USA now has such an agreement with Brasil, so is that where to stop reading? I would love to simply stop reading there, but unfortunately my experience with US Government publications tells me "keep reading".

So, then comes the "Additional residency requirements for dependents and survivors." section. That section states, "If you are a citizen of a country for which we require dependents and survivors to meet additional residency requirements, you will have to show that you lived in the United States for at least five years. (emphasis added). It also states that "during those five years, you must have been in the family relationship on which we based your benefits."

So, does the language related to countries with which the US has a Social Security Agreement trump the "additional residency requirements" language? Then, just to eliminate any clarity which might have been evident to some, the pamphlet states, "However, the U.S. residency requirement does NOT apply if you meet any of the following conditions:" and there is a condition which states, "You are a resident of a country...listed in the section titled "Countries that have social security agreements with the United States" in this publication."  (pg 10 of the publication)Brasil is not listed but there is a link www.socialsecurity.gov/international/countrylist3.htm . Unfortunately, Brasil is not on that list.

So, unfortunately, I remain confused and uncertain as to survivor benefit status of a Brasilian citizen who has not lived in the USA five years and resides in Brasil but is a dependant of a US citizen residing in Brasil who is receiving Social Security retirement benefits.

I very much appreciate your time and effort in responding.

I didn't seem to get an alert that you responded, PTRio, but here goes, if a couple weeks late.  Sorry about that.

- "It is quite confusing."   That is an understatement.  US bureaucrats just can't seem to get their writing act together.  The word "Circumlocution"  would seem to sum up this particular style well.  You seem to get that, the way you have literally followed all their circuitous dead-ends LOL.

- "I would love to simply stop reading there, but unfortunately my experience with US Government publications tells me "keep reading".   Mine too.

- "So, does the language related to countries with which the US has a Social Security Agreement trump the "additional residency requirements" language?"    Yes, that is certainly my understanding.

- "Unfortunately, Brasil is not on that list".   Yes, that is true, but I would not read that much into it.  It would appear to be simply due to the SSA bureaucrats' not getting around to updating Country List 3.   

Remember that that publication came out in June 2018, four months before the US-Brazil Social Security Totalization Agreement actually went into effect.

More important than that [outdated] country list, is their official [updated] status table of agreements:

https://www.ssa.gov/international/status.html

Which, certainly more than that country list, offers definitive proof  that Brazil is indeed one of the "Countries that have social security agreements with the United States"

As such, that would imply that a dependent of a US citizen residing in Brasil who is receiving Social Security retirement benefits would indeed be eligible for Survival Benefits even though he has not lived at least five years in the USA and presently lives in Brazil.

Appreciate your response, thank you. And yes, I agree, the fact the SSA bureaucrats (and they are certainly among the most bureaucratic among bureaucrats) have not updated their website or published updated information is the source of what is likely a lot of confusion currently over this new development. I do hope this thread will remain on the xpats.com website for some time as there will no doubt be others who try to navigate through this process and reach the same dead ends with respect to the currently published information. Just calling Social Security can be an hour or longer project.  All the best.

If you're not enrolled in STEP, you may have missed this message, just received from the US Embassy in Brasília:

"The U.S. Embassy in Brasilia is reminding U.S. citizens that representatives from the Social Security Administration’s Federal Benefits Unit (FBU) in Lisbon will be visiting Belo Horizonte on March 20, Manaus on March 27, and Brasilia on March 29, 2019.   They will meet with interested parties to discuss the implications of the new Social Security Totalization Agreement between the United States and Brazil, which may allow workers who accrued social security credits in both countries to combine their credits when applying for benefits.  In some cases, family members may also be eligible for benefits.  The representatives are also available to assist individuals with other Social Security and Federal Benefits services.  For information about their services, documentation requirements etc., please visit their website at https://pt.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-se … security/.   FBU representatives will be available to conduct individual consultation sessions, but only for those who schedule appointments in advance.

To schedule an appointment in-person or by phone with the FBU Lisbon representatives in Brasíília or Belo Horizonte on these dates only, please send an email to BrasiliaACS[at]state.gov  with “FBU - and the city where the visit will occur (Brasilia or Belo Horizonte)” in the subject line, or call (61) 3312-7294. 

To schedule an appointment with the FBU Lisbon representative in Manaus on this date only, please send an email to acsmanaus[at]gmail.com with “FBU - Manaus” in the subject line, or call (92) 3611-3333 from 9:00am-12:00pm. "

Appointments will be confirmed by reply email.

To all US expats, it is a great help to sign up for the STEP program. Information about safety, SSA, IRS, laws and other news is nice t get.

That's for sure!  Besides all the information, I just like having the Embassy know that I'm out here somewhere.

So true abthree. When I first moved here, I had traveled many places and required extra pages passport. So spent day in SP. When speaking with them they asked if I would be a "travel ambassador" since they had no one in Foz area. Nothing fancy, was here to help if a US traveler required something. Lasted for about a year the they did away with such, but thought it was a good idea. (Only had 1 request)