Buying land with no Philippines bank account.

Currently in the US and thinking for my Filipina dual national wife to buy land in Philippines. We dont have any Philippine bank account and cannot open one without a Philippine address. Do I take my lumps and wire from a US bank to a Philippine bank and pay the fees or is there a better way?
-@Filamretire

No, a bank account matters little. for property purchase, 5 or 6 years ago we purchased our house and lot direct to the R/E agents trust account through a broker to get the best exchange rate and I'm positive you can do the same as a direct buyer, have a reputable attorney here in PH. that is up to speed on what you are doing and won't try to rip you off as they do try.

Good luck Fila.

Cheers, Steve.

Filamretire said . . . Currently in the US and thinking for my Filipina dual national wife to buy land in Philippines. We dont have any Philippine bank account and cannot open one without a Philippine address. Do I take my lumps and wire from a US bank to a Philippine bank and pay the fees or is there a better way?

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There are several things you must consider first.

(1) When are you planning to move to the Philippines? 

(2) Is this for an investment for the future? 

(3) If you do land buy can you trust the real estate agent?

(4) Buying land sight unseen?

(5) If you want to buy land, why not have the option of viewing in person multiple locations?

(6) Do not spend money unless you can afford to lose it.

(6) Keep your money close to you, avoid any possibility of taking lumps.

Humpty  Lumpty sat on a wall

Humpty Lumpty had a great fall

All the kings horses and all the kings men

Couldn't get Humpty's money back again

@bigpearl Thanks for the excellent advice, will be talking to the broker next week

Filamretire said . . . Currently in the US and thinking for my Filipina dual national wife to buy land in Philippines. We dont have any Philippine bank account and cannot open one without a Philippine address. Do I take my lumps and wire from a US bank to a Philippine bank and pay the fees or is there a better way?
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There are several things you must consider first.

(1) When are you planning to move to the Philippines? Next year

(2) Is this for an investment for the future? we will build our retirement house on it

(3) If you do land buy can you trust the real estate agent? Yes, they are a friend and well established in the development

(4) Buying land sight unseen? No, are still shopping around and visiting

(5) If you want to buy land, why not have the option of viewing in person multiple locations? Yes

(6) Do not spend money unless you can afford to lose it. We can, but of course it would be a huge dent in retirement

(6) Keep your money close to you, avoid any possibility of taking lumps. Lol yes indeed, i'm an avid viewer on many Youtube channels and reader of this forum. We will make sure to thoroughly check the deed/title of the purchased lot once agreed upon, and also I will wire money to a major bank for the land transfer

Humpty Lumpty sat on a wall
Humpty Lumpty had a great fall
All the kings horses and all the kings men
Couldn't get Humpty's money back again
-@Enzyte Bob

Yes all good questions. We are visiting and have visited several times, and we are looking at different lots, not decided yet, which are all in developments where we know people.

Only an observation but tasting the flavours, getting your hands dirty is the first place to start. We looked and visited for years, 4 exactly and finally found our bit of ground and house, took a lot of looking and patience.

Cheers, Steve.

My wife and I purchased a property in the philippines Q4 2022. My wife was visiting and found the property in October. We completed the sale in December. The title was released late January 2023. My wife is the buyer. It is direct purchase from a private seller. We hired a realtor to navigate the sale/transfer. Complete end-to-end realtor service was php40k. The realtor is not getting a commission. There is no escrow, no title research and they do not know the concept of earnest money. I wrote/copied US sale contracts since their contracts are grossly one sided. We paid downpayment direct to the private seller'sbank account. In retrospect that is not a good idea. We transfered the balance to the wife's trusted aunt's bank account. We had her and our realtor complete the transaction. So, having a local bank account will help to keep your money safe. I made sure when we are releasing money to the seller, BIR (tax), etc, I get a receipt and I know what is it for. Note the seller might ask you to pay his/her capital gains tax. This is the largest single cost associated with the sale. (6.75 % I think)

Watch your extra expenses, there will be people asking for grease money for legitimate transactions. Your wife will need TIN - Tax ID Number to get the title transfered to her name, get one if she's in the Phillipines. We are visiting in a week to talk to a building contractor. At the same time we'll also be hitting the beach.

wow thats a eye opener. Will have to check on that TIN Number.  Local bank account we will eventually create but need an address and I do not want to use inlaws address lol. Since it took some time to transfer the title, it might be better if we move there first, but that couldnt be until next year

@Filamretire If you buy land, don't let the seller have you pay the cap gains. Also, they may create 2 deeds of sale with 2 different prices and the attorneys seem to go along with this. One is for the actual sale amount and one is for a reduced sale amount for tax payment. This is not legal but it is almost a custom here. You have to decide if you wish to play along. Be advised that there is no title insurance here and that can be a big problem here when a few years from now some relative comes up with an adverse claim on the lot. If you are not living here, you cannot go to court to squash the claim and you will have to make a settlement to remove the claim. That happened to us but we were already here and won the court case after spending 80K lawyers fees and 2 years. It seems our R/E agent was a relative of the seller and the adverse claim had probably been a part of the plan. Fortunately we had a good lawyer and foiled their scam.

@danfinn  cap gains by seller noted, I saw this was typically the case too.  Deed/title I will get a certification from the registry of deeds that the TCT is indeed clean. Otherwise I back out.

Clarification: BIR (Bureau of Internal Revenue) required the TIN when we're paying the tax due from the buyer.

...

danfinn is spot on about the practice of lowering the sale value on the Deed to reduce taxes.

It is a big risk.

...

I have to develop a very strong stomach to deal with the corruption in all levels of this transaction. I was so close to not buying this property. This is one big reason we hired a realtor we can trust to do all the work.

@Jackson4 10-4

@danfinn cap gains by seller noted, I saw this was typically the case too. Deed/title I will get a certification from the registry of deeds that the TCT is indeed clean. Otherwise I back out.
-@Filamretire

It's not like that. If some relative of the previous owner files an adverse claim on the land by extra judicial settlement where brother and sisters divided the land, the ROD has no record of that yet it is enough to file an adverse claim. That is what happened to us. ROD cannot guarantee a clean title, they can only guarantee what it is at the present time. In our case they attached the adverse title to the certified copy and the lot was impossible to sell until the court order from the judge in our case ordered the ROD to remove the claim.

In retrospect, there was nothing we could have done to prevent this. Furthemore, it seems like the scam was underway from the start although no proof of that. Sure, the ROD can show you a clean certified title with no modifications but who is to stop some family member showing up later, after title is in your name, to make a claim. Also Philippine laws is very sympathetic to those who make claims. But due process did prevail in our case. IF we could have purchased title insurance (the practice in most Western countries when buying R/E), the worst case for us would have been a refund of what we had paid. But no company apparently wants to accept that risk in this country which should tell you something already. I think Mr. Enzyte covered that by saying don't pay more than you can afford to lose. You cannot insure your loss; you need to be prepared to go to court to defend your TCT. However, if we had to do it all over again, yes we would purchase land in the future. I do not believe fraud and scam are the norm but maybe 5-10% of the time it is.

danfinn - you got me concerned on our purchase. So, if ROD already transferred the title to my wife's name, are we in the clear or can someone still file an adverse claim? We already received a certified copy of the title.

It sounds like anyone can file an adverse claim against any land at any time, by a relative. What is stopping people from doing this constantly? Do they have to pay for court cost if they lose?

Great input guys.

Also make sure that all the municipal and Barangay rates and fees are up to date, our property here the owners were 5 years behind so make sure that number is sorted.

Another issue to consider if not on the ground here are you buying the property unseen/Just photos?

That's risky. We were on the ground and talked to neighbours, measured the lot etc based on the title and tax declared lot. The owner told us the boundary to the ocean finishes here where he had his fence but my measurements showed a further 8 odd metres beyond his fence and after we took over the property engaged a surveyor (PHP 6K from memory) to confirm the property boundaries and yes the previous owner was wrong, my measurements were accurate.

As for adverse claims? Welcome to the Philippines where all is open slather for scammers.

Good luck, breathe and simply be aware and go through the motions.

Cheers, Steve.

@Filamretire In our case we had to pay the court costs. Our attorney advised against countersuing to recover court abd attorney costs.

@Jackson4 In our case we purchased the land in 2004 with a clean TCT. We were living in the states. Around 2015 we put thd land up for sale and in 2016 we found a buyer. When the buyers agent pulled the title there was an adverse claim shown in the "Memorandum of Encumbrances". I think it was added in2010. The adverse claim grants them no property rights but no buyer will pay for land with such a claim attached. We lost the sale. In 2017 we moved here and sued to have the claim removed. By 2019 the title was clean again and we sold the kand in 2019. We sold the land at 5x what we paid in 2004 so it was a good cap gain (which as an American, I had to pay taxes on). Obviously the family scammer played the long game by adding a claim to the title knowing eventually the owner would need a clean title so he could demand cash to remove his claim (for us he demanded 150k php). Too bad for him we sued and won.

I would advise not to buy property here while outside the country especially if it will be for retirement, I suggest to wait, then when you can travel here and stay with her relatives or rent condo etc while looking at property/opening up bank account etc...

To many things can go wrong if your not here to overlook the process. I have seen many times owners who are selling and think they know where there property lines are and find out later they were wrong...Also research who pays what on a sale, normally the seller pays the Capital sales gain tax here, unless it has been negotiated in price...and that’s just the starting basics

yes we are here the area, and will walk away if I find any issues like that

yes we are here the area, and will walk away if I find any issues like that
-@Filamretire

But you do not know until years later. That is the problem when there is no title insurance. You need to be able to defend your title and that generally means living here.

@Enzyte Bob good rime he in this case the smal adaption is very humoristic.

Before I marry I'm planning to have a lawyer write up the least agreement because I have heard stories about couples who break up only to be forced out of the home.   I know I can own the house but not the land.  Plan to live in the province, simple clean living .

Under the Investor's Lease Act of the

Philippines, a foreign national can enter into

a lease agreement with a Filipino landowner

for a long-term lease with an initial period of

up to 50 years, with a one-time option to

renew for 25 years.

@DonRam If you are not sure you can trust her, and it takes years and years and more to build solid trust, that is an excellent way to go. She cannot kick you off land you are leasing and it is a great way to foil her family who might coax her into a legal separation and making you leave. 

If you build a house in the province on extremely cheap land, if things don't work out, as you said can own the house but not the land and if you own that house I think you would be perfectly entitled to hire a big backhoe or bulldozer and have it knocked down. Then you can just walk away and all you have lost is the price of your inexpensive bit of province land and the cost of hiring a backhoe or bulldozer. I would like to hear the opinions of others about this as I may stand to be corrected.

A word to the wise is sufficient, but . . . . .  a wise word to an Expat in love goes out the window. A 25 year lease, 50 years? anyone planning to live longer?

When it comes to the Philippines never spend or invest more than you can lose. Many Expats are mired in a love trance and make poor long term decisions, well beyond the length of their romance or marriage.

For $100 your Filipina can have you off the land or worse yet under the land.

Anyone out there listening?  Nope and Dope rhyme.

@FindlayMacD

I am at a loss of words for that suggestion. Maybe I misunderstood something though. Waste a perfectly good house where many people have no place to live? How about the cleanup? Are you suggesting just leaving a pile of rubble? You would be breaking laws, I believe.

And what is the purpose of that action - spitefulness?

Anything that is "extremely cheap" always comes with a risk.

I suggest not buying and building if you can't trust the people involved. Renting is so cheap, as you know.

I built a beautiful little house in the province recently and am simply prepared to walk away if things don't work out for some reason, but the plan was to leave it to her anyway. After 9 years together, the least I can do is give her some security for her future.

Again, I may have misunderstood your comment, if so I apologize.

Going back to the topic: Buying land with no Philippines bank account.

Just opened a bank account in the Philippines yesterday at BPI. It appears a foreigner can open a bank account. We opened the account under wife's name using the Philippine identity as she is a dual citizen. Checking account requiredc a minimum deposit of PHP10k and PHP250 for 50 starter checks. The account will become dormant if no transaction for a year. We used a local address for the account, there is also a place to put a foreign address, it never occurred to me to ask the bank if a foreign address can be used without a local address. But since a foreigner (non-Filipino) can open a bank account, I am guessing a foreign address can be used.

-@nlwufavtcn

A picture paints a thousand words.

-@nlwufavtcn
A picture paints a thousand words.
-@Jackson4

@Jackson4, I agree but sometimes some word won't be bad too.

@nlwufavtcn, Could you please tell us more about youself and how we can help you?

SInce you are new here, do not skip the introduction part here >  New members of the Philippines forum, introduce yourselves here - 2023

Cheers,

Cheryl

Expat.com team

@Jackson4

Interesting? BDO told me I could not open an account as a foreigner.  It sounds to me like you were able to open the account due to your wife being a citizen, and that a foreigner cannot open in their own name. Can anyone clarify?

@Jackson4
Interesting? BDO told me I could not open an account as a foreigner. It sounds to me like you were able to open the account due to your wife being a citizen, and that a foreigner cannot open in their own name. Can anyone clarify?
-@AlbertaDonuts

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To clarify, as Jackson4 mentioned, they opened the account in his wife name.

So you have a choice of two things for a bank account.

(1) Get Married

(2) After 59 days get an ACR-1 card

When I arrived in the Philippines my wife opened an account at BDO. There was not a trust issue, we were married 11 years at the time. My wife was a Filipino citizen when we met and married in the states.

Even five years later with my 13A card I didn't find it necessary to put my name on the account. Actually my stepson has the card and does all the banking for me (getting cash) and purchases, what a convenience for me.

The BPI bank manager told me a foreigner can open a bank account. My wife and I are dual citizen now so we both are in the account and the property we just purchased. I googled it, it appears there are certain conditions a foreigner can open a bank account, however I am getting a feeling the bank can close an eye depending how well they know you.

It is a lot easier to transfer money to our account since we are building a 5 story student housing at the University belt. I can't bear the thought of wiring money to someone else's account, it does not matter if they are the wife's relatives. It is a lot money in perspective. One can get rid of friends but you'll always cross paths with relatives, ugh!

@AlbertaDonuts When I came to Philippines about 4 years ago, I visited with BDO cuz my USA Bank - Wells Fargo - had a relationship with them for easier wire transfers. The Manila BDO Branch told me that I would need to have an ACR-I Card to open an account, which I obtained as soon as allowed. I decided on living in Cebu City area, and when I went to open an account at the BDO Branch at SM City Mall; I was told that a foreigner could not open an account. However, I persisted, and told them how the BDO Manila Branch had told me I could. Without too much debate, they allowed me to open a Pesos Savings Account with a Debit Card. They would not allow me to have a Credit Card (Too Old I Think - 70 at the time), nor I think a Checking Account. And, I was surprised to learn later that I could not exchange Pesos for Dollars as a foreigner, so transferred Pesos into my GF's Account; and then she had no problem converting to Dollars. I was told that China Bank is easier to work with, but I am staying with BDO for convenience sake.

Not very many are converting their USD through banks. There are gazillion money changers around where one can get better exchange rates for your foreign currency. Last week at SM North in Quezon City, I saw two money changer stores right next to each other with each having a line 5 deep. I was running low on php towards the end of my vacation i had to convert some dollars. I was concerned about pick pockets and thieves but it was safe.

@Jackson4

You will have been fleeced. Save the greenbacks for your return stateside and use the queue free ATM

@Jackson4
You will have been fleeced. Save the greenbacks for your return stateside and use the queue free ATM
-@Lotus Eater

Oh yeah we're back stateside and we've been fleeced alright. Remember we visited the wife's relatives. I do not have immediate family in the Philippines. You know the custom (maybe). You bring presents, host wine & dine and dole out some moolah before leaving. I am beginning to question this concept.

Yeah I hear you Jackson. Been there a few times and now I say no. We were in Singapore a few weeks ago and Ben wanted to buy gifts for the family, COME on Ben what for, it's our holiday and not theirs, you want to buy chocolates and trinkets for impressing your relatives use your own money,,,,,,, guess what? No gifts. Nada.

We have helped out the family plenty of times but chocolates and souvenirs are an ego thing. Stand your ground and be an A hole like me and I'm sure plenty of other apparently wealthy foreigners do the same.

Back on topic, Banks here are lame and couldn't find a tree in a forest.

OMO.

Cheers, Steve.

To clarify, as Jackson4 mentioned, they opened the account in his wife name.

So you have a choice of two things for a bank account.

(1) Get Married
(2) After 59 days get an ACR-1 card

When I arrived in the Philippines my wife opened an account at BDO. There was not a trust issue, we were married 11 years at the time. My wife was a Filipino citizen when we met and married in the states.

Even five years later with my 13A card I didn't find it necessary to put my name on the account. Actually my stepson has the card and does all the banking for me (getting cash) and purchases, what a convenience for me.
-@Enzyte Bob

Thanks Bob, I did not realize the ACR-1 card would allow me to open an account. I appreciate this and other comments I have read from you. Perhaps one day I will be able to buy you a drink and say thanks in person.

Cheers,