Social security tax question

Hello fogliadesigns,

Welcome to Expat.com

Thank you for asking your question here.

Let's hope that someone on this forum who has prior experience with this will be able to provide some insight.

All the best,

Cheryl

Expat.com team

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To fogliadesigns:

It seems that on the treaty between Italy and the US, the social security is not covered.

On the italian governmenti website, at the link (I hope expat.com does not cancel it) https://www.finanze.gov.it/export/sites … IRS_en.pdf you can find the english version of of the treaty between Italy and the USA to prevent double taxation.

However, at the second article it is written

«2. The existing taxes to which this Convention shall apply are:

(a) in the case of the United States: the Federal income taxes imposed by the Internal Revenue Code (but excluding social security taxes), and the Federal excise taxes imposed on insurance premiums paid to foreign insurers and with respect to private foundations (hereinafter referred to as "United States tax")»

I am wondering if your mother has the italian citizenship. In that occasion she might ask (but I am not sure about it) ask for the "pensione sociale", that is given by the italian state to its elderly  citizens  who do not have any other  income (or a very low one) .

Asking a CAF usually is a good, low cost way to ask how much taxes are due to the italian government.

Good luck!

    To fogliadesigns:
It seems that on the treaty between Italy and the US, the social security is not covered.
On the italian governmenti website, at the link (I hope expat.com does not cancel it) https://www.finanze.gov.it/export/sites … IRS_en.pdf you can find the english version of of the treaty between Italy and the USA to prevent double taxation.
However, at the second article it is written
«2. The existing taxes to which this Convention shall apply are:
(a) in the case of the United States: the Federal income taxes imposed by the Internal Revenue Code (but excluding social security taxes), and the Federal excise taxes imposed on insurance premiums paid to foreign insurers and with respect to private foundations (hereinafter referred to as "United States tax")»
I am wondering if your mother has the italian citizenship. In that occasion she might ask (but I am not sure about it) ask for the "pensione sociale", that is given by the italian state to its elderly  citizens  who do not have any other  income (or a very low one) .
Asking a CAF usually is a good, low cost way to ask how much taxes are due to the italian government.
Good luck!
   

    -@glimpser

You might be confusing "social security taxes" that is referenced as FICA, which is tax on income that funds social security and medicare but is colloqially known as social security tax.  This is different than taxation on Social security income itself.

I found this reference on the IRS website  https://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-trty/italypro.pdf

"Thus, if the United States makes a social security payment to a resident of Italy who is a citizen of both the United States and Italy, only Italy can tax that payment."

I also found a similar statement in a table presented another IRS page but I could find it again.  The conclusion is that if your mom is a dual citizen then it looks like Italy can tax the Social Security income, but the US cannot.  Conversely, you need to ask, if your mom is a citizen of Italy, isn't there a social safety net she is entitled to?  I'm not done doing research on this as I am planning on retiring in Italy in the near future.