Just a thought about new visa policy to enter Brasil

Brasil historically works on the visa policy of "reciprocity"........do unto others as they do to you basically.

12/10/24  I think after Trump won the election this policy will not be implemented, what do you think? - @Hugodc2000

Brazil has always based its visa policy on strict reciprocity.  Bolsonaro's decision to depart from that was an aberration, and things are about to return to normal after negotiations with the United States to make visa waivers reciprocal apparently failed.  Assuming that all technical bugs in the computerized system have been worked out by then, I expect visas to be required for Americans on April 10, 2025. 

Unless  Trump decides to start waiving visas for Brazilians.  Stranger things have happened, but not often.

The old adage 'Brazil needs American tourists more than America needs Brazilian tourists' still holds water - plus the fact that Americans are more likely to return to the US than Brazilians are to Brazil after a "visit".

But Lula is set on reciprocity, so I cannot see this changing unless he gets a whole lot out of Trump - very unlikely...

@abthree

Brazilian people they came and stayed maximum 2 years meaning stay illegal and return home, now so many Brazilian people don’t want to leave, have so many illegals now in Usa that’s why Usa cut off free visa entry

12/11/24 @abthree
Brazilian people they came and stayed maximum 2 years meaning stay illegal and return home, now so many Brazilian people don’t want to leave, have so many illegals now in Usa that’s why Usa cut off free visa entry - @Hugodc2000

The US never gave free entry to Brazilians, so there was no "free visa entry" to cut off.  The overstay statistics for Brazilian visaholders were always higher than the maximum permitted to qualify for the Visa Waiver Program, so to that extent you are correct that overstays are the reason that Brazil does not qualify.   

Sorry, if I am not quite following the thread, but for fact I can tell you that Brazilians come to the United States for a short period of time and then return to Brazil. This is not an immigration thing etc. Brazilians are a proud people and everything being equal they would prefer to be home.

My wife and I had a very popular Brazilian Cafe (Aqui Brazilian Coffee) for four years in America so this is way beyond statistics. Our #'1 customer base was Brazilians, then Latinos, then Americans. An enormous number of Brazilians both customers, friends and people from the Brazilian Church would only stay for a short period of time then go back to Brazil. i remember one day asking what happened to the Pastor, my wife told me he went back to Brazil. This wreaked havoc with our business. When the economy suffered a recession, they were going or already gone. Latinos then had a choice of staying and frequenting a Latino (Mexican etc.) restaurant or a Brazilian restaurant. Americans obviously had a lot of choices.  You will notice that there are a tremendous number of Mexican etc. restaurants in various areas of the US, but rarely a handful of Brazilian restaurants. This is because Latinos stay in the USA and provide a good base for their business. There just are not enough stationary Brazilians in the USA to make it profitable, they come and then go.

Roddie in Retirement🕵

12/11/24 Sorry, if I am not quite following the thread, but for fact I can tell you that Brazilians come to the United States for a short period of time and then return to Brazil.

Roddie in Retirement🕵 - @roddiesho

Enough overstay to keep Brazil out of the Visa Waiver Program.  Countries aren't admitted to the Visa Waver Program unless their Visa Refusal Rates at US Consulates are under 3% and Visa Overstay Rates by their citizens in the US are under 2%.  Brazil's Visa Refusal Rate hovers around 14%, the Visa Overstay Rate for Brazilians is around 4%.

https://www.everycrsreport.com/reports/R46300.html

Brazil's Visa Refusal Rate hovers around 14%, the Visa Overstay Rate for Brazilians is around 4%.
- @abthree

Yeah, personally I don't believe using the Visa Refusal Rate as a metric is fair - and many in congress apparently agree it isn't fair, but evidently not enough to convince Obama, Trump or Biden to change it.

12/12/24 Yeah, personally I don't believe using the Visa Refusal Rate as a metric is fair - and many in congress apparently agree it isn't fair, but evidently not enough to convince Obama, Trump or Biden to change it. - @mikehunter

I agree, especially given how subjective the selection process is, with a legally mandated bias for rejection.  We saw that in action recently on this very site, when the Brazilian spouse of one of our members was rejected three times by the nearest US Consulate, and approved first time out when they had the presence of  mind -- and the resources -- to cross the country and try a fourth time at a different US Consulate.

@abthree

❓

@abthree Interesting.., My wife applied for a U.S. Visitor visa to travel with me to California to see my new granddaughter. She was denied as the agent stated she didn’t have enough “strong ties” to Brazil. To the appointment she took our Brazilian Marriage License, the title to our house in Goiania (which we own outright), the Brazilian birth certificate to her 6 year old son that lives and attends school with us in Goiania, her parents and sister are Brazilian citizens and reside in Tocantins. All of these facts were disclosed in the visa application. The agent refused to review them and stated that my wife needed to produce a letter of invitation to the U.S., which is not stated as requirement in the State Department verbiage. She was immediately rebuffed by the agent and sent away. We were definitely surprised by this. Perhaps we should seek an appointment at another Consulate other than Brasilia.

12/12/24 @kevinmiller1957.  It's terrible that you had that problem, but unfortunately far from unheard-of.  US Consular officials are instructed by law to make a "rebuttable presumption" that a candidate intends to overstay, but a lot of them seem to underrate the "rebuttable" part of the instruction.  It appears to be pretty random:  our friends who had three rejections finally were approved by going to -- Brasília!

If you have bad luck again in Brasília, you and your wife might want to apply in Rio and plan to spend a few extra days there after her interview.  You still may not be successful, but you'll always have Rio.

12/12/24 Yeah, personally I don't believe using the Visa Refusal Rate as a metric is fair - and many in congress apparently agree it isn't fair, but evidently not enough to convince Obama, Trump or Biden to change it.  - @mikehunter
I agree, especially given how subjective the selection process is, with a legally mandated bias for rejection. We saw that in action recently on this very site, when the Brazilian spouse of one of our members was rejected three times by the nearest US Consulate, and approved first time out when they had the presence of mind -- and the resources -- to cross the country and try a fourth time at a different US Consulate.
- @abthree

Yeah, the whole thing is just ridiculous.  It's obvious they are using a flawed metric, yet here we are.  I'm kind of shocked that Brazil has let this go on for so long - sure ultimately it is a US decision, but Brasil has levers they could use.

The agent refused to review them and stated that my wife needed to produce a letter of invitation to the U.S., which is not stated as requirement in the State Department verbiage. - @kevinmiller1957

The kind of person that I am would have me take a piece of blank paper, some crayons, and scribble a bunch of illegible lines on it and go back to the embassy. It is your new grand daughter after all.......heh.

That is absurd IMHO that she was refused. If you lived in the US and had not moved to Brasil, and she was unemployed, then they might have had a presumption of overstay based on past historical percentages IMHO. But not in this case.

Did you have to provide proof of a two way return ticket as part of the application ?

12/12/24 Yeah, the whole thing is just ridiculous. It's obvious they are using a flawed metric, yet here we are. I'm kind of shocked that Brazil has let this go on for so long - sure ultimately it is a US decision, but Brasil has levers they could use. - @mikehunter

I think that it probably started out because it was an easy metric to get and the  preferred one, the overstay rate, was really hard.  The overstay rate still is really hard and it's relevance has to be questionable because of the volume of illegal entries that it ignores, but Homeland Security claims to have some kind of handle on it.  Still, Refusal Rate rolls on through inertia.

I'm not really surprised that Brazil hasn't objected, because I think that Official Brazil is indifferent to foreign visitors itself in either direction, and doesn't really care how easy or difficult it is to get a visa, as long as the level of difficulty is reciprocal.

as long as the level of difficulty is reciprocal. - @abthree

This was always my interpretation of it too.

Not sure if you have seen this new travel requirement when visiting UK and Euro Countries in 2025 -> https://www.bbc.com/travel/article/2024 … el-in-2025

This is interesting that travel is still visa free but there is a Electronic Travel Authorization payment...  And this applies to transit stops....