Anyone know about hungarian wine?

There is a vast range of different tasting Hungarian wines so you will find something to your taste, even amongst the cheap ones. I mainly drink white but have tried the red of one called "365" which is one of the cheapest in Tescos but I like it.

Thanks for that. Yeah thought it may be a trial and error situation. Its growing on me this one. May go on a wine testing trip.

fidobsa wrote:

....I mainly drink white but have tried the red of one called "365" which is one of the cheapest in Tescos but I like it.

365 is quite good. In fact anything from Tescos, even their own OEM brands are fine (ones with the big flowers on). One thing to watch is cheap Spanish and Italian red wine which has to many congeners (look it up) in it and if susceptible will give you a nasty headache. I believe almost all California and Australian wine has low congeners. Merlot in HU is usually pretty good.

If you want a decent low risk wine from abroad, Cotes de Rhone or Beaujolais from France.

Hi!

I can highly recommend the wines from Vylyan, the have won rewards for their wines The best wine i have ever tasted is a pinot noir from Vylyan. Sooo amazing!!!

/Frida

FridaH wrote:

Hi!
....The best wine i have ever tasted is a pinot noir from Vylyan. Sooo amazing!!!

/Frida

It's not very PC but I do not like Tokaji. It's dreadful stuff. So sweet it makes me want to....well, you can guess.

I prefer Irsai Olivér (type of grape) wines if I want something like that. It's also a bit sweet.

fluffy2560 wrote:

If you want a decent low risk wine from abroad, Cotes de Rhone or Beaujolais from France

fluffy2560 wrote:

It's not very PC but I do not like Tokaji. It's dreadful stuff. So sweet it makes me want to....well, you can guess.

Ajjaj, Fluffy I think writing that on a hungarian forum was a grave mistake - expect the Inquisitio Vino-Haereticae Pravitatis (INVIHPRA) on your doorstep one of the coming nights...

I wish I could remember names for wines better, but my memory is not that good - or, rather, I don't drink 'em often enough!
Among  the best known high quality Winery Houses(sorry if thats not english) are
Bock (http://bock.hu/pince/  I even met Bock József on a wine tasting holiday) and
Gere http://gere.hu/index_eng.html 
Both have a webshop, from one quick look it seemed, offers start below 2000 Ft, but these brands are definitely not 'cheap'.

As most of you have probably realised,Hungarian wines and classifications tend to be sweeter than those towards west/north europe, say, Germany. I assume also true for English classification.  I mean a hungarian semi sweet (félédes) would easily qualify as sweet(édes) in Germany and so on. Bear that in mind if you see "félszáraz"(semi dry) on a bottle. (fél=half))

Nevertheless, there are tons of cheap 'sweet' wines out there bound to make the any headache-pill producer happy, so  wine-gourmets tend to prefer dry here as well. Of course real quality dessert-wines are good, if you can afford them.
Be aware that 'Tokaji' is simply any wine from Tokaj region, and there are a number of Wineries there producing the famous aszú-wine - I am not sure though which one should recommend/avoid.
Here is a short intro into wines of the region http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asz%C3%BA
You can try browsing http://en.tokajwine.net/
I cannot resist to point to the info on the 'Noble rot' making up Aszú(Botrytised) wines:  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Noble_rot

Here is an older list of some "best wines" and "best Wineries" (pincészet) http://www.bortarsasag.hu/hu/magazin/a- … magyar-bor

And google-translated report of the results of a prestigious '12 Wine competition, giving a list of best wines in the paragraphs for various categories (sorry, limitations of google translate are obvious):
http://translate.google.hu/translate?hl … gyar_borok

Oh, and Fluffy, look at Nr. 28 here :-)
http://assets.winespectator.com/wso/pdf … e2010s.pdf

Thank you all very much for the information. I shall get tasting

fireroller wrote:

.....  I mean a hungarian semi sweet (félédes) would easily qualify as sweet(édes) in Germany and so on. Bear that in mind if you see "félszáraz"(semi dry) on a bottle. (fél=half))....

Anything félédes should be taken out and shot at dawn.  The number of times I've mistakenly bought that kind of wine without reading the label properly. I mean, félédes Merlot, now come on, that's got to be the work of the devil. Down the sink or given away to someone less discerning.

fireroller wrote:

Oh, and Fluffy, look at Nr. 28 here :-)
http://assets.winespectator.com/wso/pdf … e2010s.pdf

Even if it is No. 28 in the wine hit parade, it's still horrible stuff, only suitable for those with a serious hankering for a tooth decay and a bad headache. I'll be controversial and say I would include all sweet wines in that category. Avoid!

I'm very partial to new world wines. British Airways used to provide a very nice New Zealand white called Nobilo. Never seen it elsewhere. Top stuff even though I'm more a red person.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Anything félédes should be taken out and shot at dawn.

I have the same opinion about most any cheap wine from Tesco. But different opinions are, of course, what makes for a horse race.

FridaH wrote:

I can highly recommend the wines from Vylyan

I gave you a thumbs up. I can not agree more.

Also try the Cabernet Franc as Vylyan is widely considered the "the new home" of this grape variety.

fluffy2560 wrote:

.... a bad headache.

Unfortunately, far too many Hungarian White wines seem to have too much sulfite added. If one has sulfite sensitivities, some Hungarian white wines are not drinkable.

engie_bengie wrote:

Hi all, I'm not much of a wine drinker but I hear its really good and quite cheap as well. I'm a red wine drinker when I drink it and quite like merlot. normally when i do drink it its with dinner. Bouhht a bottle today and its a strange taste to what i'm used to.

You may simply have gotten a "corked" bottle that went bad due to TCA (Trichloroanisole) contamination. It does happen for a variety of reasons and it can happen to any bottle, be it a 5 Euro or a 50 Euro bottle of wine.

Cheap wines from most any wine region can be highly variable in quality, especially at the lower price ranges. Such wine is cheap for reasons, and not necessarily good ones at that. But of course that also can vary. We call some cheap wines "2 buck chuck" in California where I am from (because it sold for $2 a bottle). But they actually have improved in quality over time and while I would not call them a great wine they have proven at least consistent which to many is important (Not everyone is interested in experiencing the difference between vintages).

Hungary is mostly a very good white wine region. In my opinion, except for Vylyan, and a few other notable smaller regions, most of the "internationally known" red varietals (such as Merlot, Cabernet Sauvignon, etc) I consider only producing average red wines. But if you are interested in trying some local varieties, they may surprise you:

- "Blue Franc" called here "Kékfrankos". Its bouquet is somewhere between a Merlot and a Cabernet. Can be a bit tannin, or sweet so select a dry one for best results.

- Cabernet Franc from Vylyan. Expensive, but worth it if you enjoy wines.

- Zwiegelt. Austrian variety also grown in Hungary. Rather simple in its bouquet but goes surprisingly well with pasta or pizza with Gorgonzola cheese.

- Blauburger. Also Austrian origin.

- Syrah. A strong red wine. If you want to try this wine, I suggest to get one from a winery near Sopron.

klsallee wrote:

.....

- Cabernet Franc from Vylyan. Expensive, but worth it if you enjoy wines.

- Zwiegelt. Austrian variety also grown in Hungary. Rather simple in its bouquet but goes surprisingly well with pasta or pizza with Gorgonzola cheese.

etc...

I quite like Zinfandel wines. There's some nice reds and roses on that one.

If you look that up in Wikipedia, it's genetically identical to a Croatian variety which surprised me. That comment adds nothing to the wine discussion, other than showing I know how to use Wikipedia in a wine context.

I'm presently in Asia and the hotel has given me a bottle of "Black Queen", Red Glutinous, Black Sticky Rice" and they called it wine.  It looks like a bottle of wine but should I risk it for $4.50? 

I am not sure anywhere in Asia would have a good reputation for wine (I don't include Australia, New Zealand in Asia).

fluffy2560 wrote:

Zinfandel... it's genetically identical to a Croatian variety which surprised me. That comment adds nothing to the wine discussion, other than showing I know how to use Wikipedia in a wine context.

A good red Zinfandel is certainly an enjoyable beverage.

And don't sell yourself short. Croatia use to be part of Big Hungary and the Zin growing in California was long classified as a Hungarian wine. So historically at least you are right on target about Hungarian wines.

I tried to list some non-typical reds that are grown in Hungary today (it is not an exhaustive list -- did not mention Kármin, Turán, etc. or Pinot Noir as that is a typical wine). And while a good wine, Zinfandel is not really grown in the current modern boarder of Hungary (that I am aware of at least -- but such things are fluid), mainly because of the climate; Zin does not get its best characteristics or ripen properly in today's Hungary. But maybe with climate change.....

Thanks, I will look up this thread before buying wine again...

klsallee wrote:

Croatia use to be part of Big Hungary and the Zin growing in California was long classified as a Hungarian wine.

Interesting- I'm slightly surprised the country is/was known there.(never been to California, unfortunately). Not sure if Croatians like to hear that, though...

klsallee wrote:

Zin does not get its best characteristics or ripen properly in today's Hungary. But maybe with climate change.....

Lets hope on Croatia, and even Serbia will get into the EU before that - and I think some Romanian wines are also formidable - does anybody know? But in the present state of the Union - perhaps climate change is indeed your better bet...

As far as I understand, in the present eu-wide competition scenario (no customs), Hungarian wine culture has a size problem (among others): most large French wineries are an order of magnitude larger than any of the Hungarians (plus I assume the production is likely to be better streamlined) - hence cheaper.
I read somewhere, no hungarian wineyard would be able to supply, say, a mediocre sized US supermarket chain - for the simple lack of output. You would think "why not join forces" - but hey, that would be against our traditions..! (cf. Turáni átok/Curse of Turan)

klsallee wrote:

.... And while a good wine, Zinfandel is not really grown in the current modern boarder of Hungary (that I am aware of at least -- but such things are fluid), mainly because of the climate; Zin does not get its best characteristics or ripen properly in today's Hungary. But maybe with climate change.....

I seem to recall (or hallucinating) that Zinfandel is grown in Austria. If it's growing over there, it should grow in Hungary or Croatia, no problem. 

Re: Climate change, judging by the very low level of Balaton this year, if that continues, it'll just be dust bowl in 20 years time.

fluffy2560 wrote:

I seem to recall (or hallucinating) that Zinfandel is grown in Austria. If it's growing over there, it should grow in Hungary or Croatia, no problem.

Oh, it will grow, but Zin is a funny grape with odd ripening characteristics. Not quite enough degree days in most parts of Hungary to grow Zin that will produce a wine worth making. Zin does not start to get really interesting until the grapes get above 24 Brix.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Re: Climate change, judging by the very low level of Balaton this year, if that continues, it'll just be dust bowl in 20 years time.

I doubt it will be that severe. Smaller, maybe. But I doubt the Zala goes permanently dry in 20 years. And they can control the sluice egress at Siófok (which is rather variable and political -- Keeping enough water in the Danube for shipping versus moderating the level of the Balaton (in fact I have seen the Balaton quite low before even in years with good rain)).

klsallee wrote:

...
I doubt it will be that severe. Smaller, maybe. But I doubt the Zala goes permanently dry in 20 years. And they can control the sluice egress at Siófok (which is rather variable and political -- Keeping enough water in the Danube for shipping versus moderating the level of the Balaton (in fact I have seen the Balaton quite low before even in years with good rain)).

I've never seen Balaton so low and I've been in HU and off for 20 years.  I was thinking Aral Sea. I think I remember a plan to divert water into Balaton to top it up but from what I know the sluice thing is not confirmed as the cause.

It was so low, people could walk half way to Tihany-Rev from the other side. I was on the ferry and could see them standing way out in the channel.I think a reasonably fit person could swim the few hundred metres. I also tried swimming. You need to go out several hundred metres. Last year, it was not that bad.

fireroller wrote:

Interesting- I'm slightly surprised the country is/was known there.(never been to California, unfortunately).

If one is in the California Wine Industry, one knows about Agoston Haraszthy (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agoston_Haraszthy). The attribution that he was the "first" to bring Zinfandel to California is an historical controversy of course, but still part of California wine folklore.

fireroller wrote:

Not sure if Croatians like to hear that, though...

And some Californians don't like to hear that the state use to be part of Mexico.

fireroller wrote:

I read somewhere, no hungarian wineyard would be able to supply, say, a mediocre sized US supermarket chain - for the simple lack of output.

Actually true of many US Wineries too. Direct marketing, walk in sales and mail order wine clubs actually make up most sales of smaller wineries (which make up the majority of wineries by number).

fireroller wrote:

Hungarian wine culture has a size problem (among others): most large French wineries are an order of magnitude larger than any of the Hungarians (plus I assume the production is likely to be better streamlined) - hence cheaper.

The EU actually PAYS Hungarians to rip out their vines. France, in particular, actually is very vocally against the proposed liberalization of wine planting being currently discussed in the EU. Currently Hungary is limited in how much wine making vines can be planted in total. France does not like competition from other countries. What is even more bizarre is even the current Hungarian Government is against wine planting liberalization also.

To give you an example, it took me 6 months to navigate the paperwork to get permission to rip out 3000 sq m. of Piros Szlanka vines (a essentially useless grape with little flavor, grown just to extend the number of liters of otherwise bad wine) and petition to replant with better wine making varieties.

fireroller wrote:

You would think "why not join forces" - but hey, that would be against our traditions..! (cf. Turáni átok/Curse of Turan)

This is unfortunately true. Switzerland has good examples of wine making co-ops, but no one I speak to seems interested here.

klsallee wrote:

This is unfortunately true. Switzerland has good examples of wine making co-ops, but no one I speak to seems interested here.

Swiss wine? Now there's a thought.

I was interested to know the EC agricultural policies are messing up Hungary as they mess up many other EC member countries.

Where I live, all of the grape plants are being left to fall into disrepair, unloved and untended. The land seems to be mainly being cleared for housing or development.

I'd have thought small vineyards would aim at marketing on the basis of exclusivity. But I wonder really if many people can tell the difference between a $100 and a $10 bottle of wine? I've had very drinkable wines for just $2. Is it just training of the taste buds, interest or something else?

I reckon many people cruising the aisles of Tesco buy on the look of the label, not what's inside.

fluffy2560 wrote:

I've never seen Balaton so low and I've been in HU and off for 20 years.

I have not seen yet this years data on lake level. And observations can be deceptive of course. For example, I live near the north shore of the lake, and wind pushing the water northwards can make it higher there.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Swiss wine?

Since the Roman period. Mainly western or southern Cantons such as Valais.

fluffy2560 wrote:

Where I live, all of the grape plants are being left to fall into disrepair, unloved and untended.

A vineyard is a lot of work. Many today are either too old or not interested in the labor.

fluffy2560 wrote:

The land seems to be mainly being cleared for housing or development.

It is more than a conspiracy theory of mine that is exactly what The Powers That Be want to happen (owners of construction companies seem to be especially well politically connected in most countries). Many vineyard land around the Balaton has a nice "lake view" that the nouveau riche want without the bother to have a vineyard.

fluffy2560 wrote:

I'd have thought small vineyards would aim at marketing on the basis of exclusivity.

To do that the Winery must create a stellar product. That requires significant capital, investment and time (a decade to get the vines to a level of maturity for such quality). The old joke is to make a million dollars in a wine business you have to start with one-hundred million.

fluffy2560 wrote:

But I wonder really if many people can tell the difference between a $100 and a $10 bottle of wine? I've had very drinkable wines for just $2. Is it just training of the taste buds, interest or something else?

There are many issues there, I will touch on two :

- Lack of experience. I think most anyone when presented with a simultaneous comparison can indeed tell the difference between a $10 and $100 bottle of wine. But most people never have that chance. And even if they do, many do not think $100 a bottle is a good purchase. (After all, wine is not a staple, and $100 bottle is really a luxury purchase). And, yes, it does take some time and real tasting effort between different wineries and wine varietals to know and appreciate what very good wines can offer and understand their pricing structure. All that silly sounding talk about raspberry and truffle accents will eventually be experienced personally with time and "practice". But in the end we all have our preferences on how we wish to spend our money for what we each consider the "finer" things in life. I would, for example, never buy a Patek Philippe watch as my cell phone is fine to tell time. And others may be forever happy with wine under $10 a bottle.

- Local perception problems. The actually accepted "price point" for a "good" bottle of wine in the US, for example, is now about $20. Try to sell a $20 (4,500 HUF) bottle in Hungary and many people will think it is "too expensive" even if the wine is superior (even people who come from abroad and who can afford it think like this). People think of Hungary as a "cheap" place where they can get many things, and especially food, for low prices. Hungary, in general, needs to work on turning this perception around more in the wine industry.

Hi,
If you like Merlot and darker wines have a go on "Vesztergombi TURUL Cuvée", that is a Merlot and Cabernet Sauvignon blend, matured in oak barrels and it has really deep colour and nicely balanced tannins. I am not a big wine drinker, and I don't know much about wine, but I also prefer red, and I just love it.
I tasted from 2004 and 2006 vintage, both of them very good.
It will cost you approx. 3600 HUF.
But there are a lot more...
Enjoy !
Terez

klsallee wrote:

.... - Local perception problems. The actually accepted "price point" for a "good" bottle of wine in the US, for example, is now about $20. Try to sell a $20 (4,500 HUF) bottle in Hungary and many people will think it is "too expensive" even if the wine is superior (even people who come from abroad and who can afford it think like this). People think of Hungary as a "cheap" place where they can get many things, and especially food, for low prices. Hungary, in general, needs to work on turning this perception around more in the wine industry.

I never thought about it, but you are right. I don't think I would ever pay 4500 HUF for a bottle of wine regardless of where it is from. I'm not enough of an expert to tell the difference between a 1000 Ft bottle and a 4500 Ft bottle.

The majority of wines (in bottles) at the supermarkets seem to fall into several bands: 700 HUF and below, 700 - 1200 HUF, 2500 HUF, above 2500 HUF.

Judging by the number of bottles on the shelf (reflecting the amount/volume sold), the best sellers would be the 700-1200 HUF range.

I would not say Hungary was cheap for food, if you are talking about supermarket prices. Certain things like milk, bread and cold meats are cheap but overall I would say my grocery bill has doubled since I moved from Scotland to Hungary. This is partly because I never find the big reductions on stuff thats reached the sell by date. In Scotland I often got things in Tesco and the Co-op at 75% off but I've never seen that in Hungary.
Obviously wine and beer is much cheaper here.

fidobsa wrote:

if you are talking about supermarket prices

I was thinking about dining out at a restaurant. I should have been more explicit.

fluffy2560 wrote:

I don't think I would ever pay 4500 HUF for a bottle of wine regardless of where it is from

No problem of course. But for some wine, in my humble opinion, anything less is usually an inferior product. In Hungary I am specifically thinking here of Kéknyelű. I have see others comment they do not like this wine, then discuss the 1500-2000 HUF bottle they had. I agree, at this price the Kéknyelű I have had is often not much of a wine. Get to the 4500+ HUF price point for a bottle of Kéknyelű and you easily find a world of difference, especially the smokey nature this wine is famous for.

So don't pay 4500 HUF for a bottle of Kéknyelű, but if someone offers you a glass from such a bottle, definitely try it at least once.

Of course, I have my biases. Aside from wine I also like The Glenlivet Scotch and Romeo y Julieta cigars. But those really are my only three expensive vices.

klsallee wrote:

....Of course, I have my biases. Aside from wine I also like The Glenlivet Scotch and Romeo y Julieta cigars. But those really are my only three expensive vices.

My vices might be:

0) Giving into the kids
1) Giving into Mrs Fluffy
2) Drinking too much red wine + white wine
3) Buying too many gadgets

...not all always at the same time....

I also have other items like Marmite, Aeroplanes, Mountain Bikes and Travel but I guess they aren't really vices.

Excellent points all around.  I am particularly fond of the Szeksard reds and have experimented in Spar with some of the others available.  In Spar they have a line of wines with the Pincemeister label and I have found all of these to be good to excellent at reasonable prices.  If I want really good then I buy Bock or Szeremely Huba wines (he is a friend). Of course, there are many others and I drink some of my neighbors home made wines which are excellent as well if you like Reislings.

As for the lake I hope it goes back up this year.  It really sucked to sail this year with the levels at about 1.5 meters low.  It is shallow already so having the average depth at 4 meters is a problem for catamarans if we go turtle