New Traveller Looking for help

According to the new visa regulation, you can not hold a tourist visa for a long time.
My suggestion is you can apply one program in China, maybe job, maybe study and they will help you to get a long period visa.

I would like to get a job there before I actually fly out. Can I apply for a work permit after I get there and find a job or do I have to find a job first then come out there?

Try to find a job first.
As getting a working visa become harder and harder in Shanghai.

For L visa, I think you can only get 30 days visa. from preparing all of the papers to get a working visa will take at least one month.

Find a job and then you can get the Z visa. L visa is tricky because once you find employment it means you will have to return to your home country to get it changed to a Z visa. Apparently people go to Hong Kong to do that, but I know here in Guangdong province it's no longer allowed and you must fly home. If you get a job, they will process your paperwork here which takes a month and then send you an invitation letter which you take to the Chinese Consulate by you to apply for the Z visa. Not sure about USA but it took me 4 days to process the Z visa in South Africa. Once you arrive you have a month to register at the police station and apply for foreign experts certificate and residency visa. Find an employer who sponsors the visa so they can help you with all that. I found it very confusing! Hope that helps 

First things first…

Do your homework.

http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_t … _1089.html

It's taken me more time to reply to you than it did to find the link.

Kris

Thank you all for the help. I will look into each one of those suggestions and make sure I take the steps necessary. I find it pretty easy to get an English teaching job in China and Thailand. I think I might pursue that because it looks like that might be the quickest route to getting the Z-VISA. Any feelings towards that

JShahroozi29 wrote:

Hi everyone,

My name is John and I am brand new to this site. I Just took on the idea of moving to China But I am very very very serious about getting it done lol. Unfortunately I have never been outside of the USA on a passport or a VISA. I do know how to get my Passport. My questions involve the VISA aspect. I want to come to China with the longest VISA possible. Also, my intention if I love it there, which I suspect I will, is to become a permanent resident. But please give me a couple of steps I need to complete to get the right VISA

Hi John,

I am curious that why you want a permanent resident here.If you want a long time visa here,then work visa of course.Get all your qualification certificates education certificates and recommendation letter prepared.Get a job here with whichever visa.Then go back your country for a Z visa.About permanent resident,it's useless to think about it now.You have to stay in Shanghai for couple of years then you have the qulification to apply for it.But you can have a visa here for 2-5 years if you are the leagel person of some company.
So the first step is getting a job or running a company here in China.

Berry

If you mean by Permanent Resident something similar to a US Green Card then that is something that is almost impossible.

I have been in China since 1998, I am married to a Chinese national, am the legally representative of my own legally registered in China company and still do not qualify for a Chinese Green Card.

I also need to renew my Z visa (as the legal rep - that's every 2 years)

Yikes, seems like it is something I should just strike from my mind. I guess my objective is to be in China for atleast a year, working, without a degree. Is this possible at all

Damn straight… Teaching English is the #1 hiring opportunity for any native English speaker. China and Thailand are especially interested in American and Canadian native speakers. However they tend to prefer teaching British English lol! Probably because of the English that controlled Hong Kong for 100 years.

You will make more money in China as a teacher than you will in Thailand… however Thai people generally speak more English and are a much more open people towards foreigners. In China they still look at foreigners with amazement, wonder and some fear of the unknown. But if your looking for more civilized people in general China is the place to be.

I would say of the evils China is a safer bet and your less likely to be ripped off by Chinese people than Thai people, only because there is less poverty in the larger cities. In the very small cities and villages there is a lot of poverty but the Chinese has accepted there standing in society and quite frankly in my own experience are so much happier being poor and having nothing than their counter parts who they see running after every yuan to pay for their BMW.

Kris

Thank you Kris you are very insightful. So tell me, have you ever run into a situation where you are on a short term visa, lets say 3-6 months and you just cant seem to find a way to extend your visa?

Or how hard is it to continue to renew and renew like lets say a business visa with 6 months on it?

For people in Beijing I know a Mr. Fixit visa guy. He is expensive but honest - will tell you if he is or not able to renew your visa.

There are agents that can help you renew your visa. But it can get pricey.
Just request a year long business visa. Not a work visa or a tourist visa.
Working without a work visa can be tricky. But there schools willing to risk it everywhere.
Getting a teaching job without a diploma is fairly easy too. Hope your good with small children and toddlers coz that's where the market is now.

China is becoming far more stringent in enforcing the visa regulations.  If you are caught working without a valid visa you will be deported and have a criminal record.

This criminal record and deportation will affect any attempt one makes  to apply for a visa to any country in the world that checks criminal records of applicants.

Kris, that's so true about the American accent vs British English education! I'm South African so we use British English, but I've noticed since being here that when I open my mouth generally the interest in me wanes due to lack of an American drawl! It's taken awhile to feel "acknowledged" here, even though I'm the one with the most teaching experience! That's not to say I mind all that much. It's just funny. About the visa, Guangdong province seems to be very strict. So don't try for jobs in Shenzhen or Guangzhou if you are looking at coming here and then trying to change your visa status. I've also seen a few jobs that are "language exchanges". You don't need a degree but the salary is on overage 3000RMB less. But you get accommodation and food usually and training so it could be a foot into the middle kingdom 

melis82 wrote:

Kris, that's so true about the American accent vs British English education! I'm South African so we use British English, but I've noticed since being here that when I open my mouth generally the interest in me wanes due to lack of an American drawl! It's taken awhile to feel "acknowledged" here, even though I'm the one with the most teaching experience! That's not to say I mind all that much. It's just funny. About the visa, Guangdong province seems to be very strict. So don't try for jobs in Shenzhen or Guangzhou if you are looking at coming here and then trying to change your visa status. I've also seen a few jobs that are "language exchanges". You don't need a degree but the salary is on overage 3000RMB less. But you get accommodation and food usually and training so it could be a foot into the middle kingdom 

Hi melis82… Nice to have you back! Seems to me you've been away???

Anyways. I think the influx of American movies, advertisements, etc, has Asia leaning towards the American accent more so than the British accent which still sounds a bit foreign to Asian listeners. Its even worse for those that come from North Africa and Mainland Europeans who are taught English all their lives and even educated in English however have other "mother tongues" that affect their English accent.

The weird thing is that Asia and in particular China thinks that an English teacher from India (for example) is going to affect their child's English. They're afraid their child is going to speak English with an Indian accent. Which is FAR from the truth! In fact it's the person's mother tongue that creates the accent in any language learned!

If I and a person from France are speaking English it's clear that one of us has a French accent. If I'm speaking to a Chinese person, they will have a Chinese accent. Just as my Greek father has a Greek accent, my Italian aunts have an Italian accent and my German friend has a German accent. All the while all these people I'm speaking with in English hear my pseudo North American accent.

I think once the Chinese and other Asian countries understand this, it'll make it easier for schools to hire native English speakers regardless of what country they're from.

BTW… I get a kick out of hearing English spoken by South Africans… it sounds very laid back and friendlier than when listening to North American's speak English.

Kris

Hey Kris, I've been around! Maybe mentally hibernating haha. It is an interesting topic! And thank you for your comment on South African accents. Being here I've learned to appreciate where I come from more and it also made the culture shock pretty bad at times. South Africans's for all their faults are usually pretty friendly and open people to talk to. So it's been hard in such a reserved culture. And I also feel like most foreigners come across as so hostile to other foreigners and I don't get why. I'm always hoping to meet somebody from SA, but foreigners in general don't seem very keen on meeting other foreigners? Especially N. Americans. They've told me themselves they aren't interested in speaking to other Americans. Maybe I'm just a home sick baby!

The Chinese culture definitely seems really keen an American influence. And it's so true what you say about the accents being culture specific regardless of the accent of the teacher. There are English words that are culture specific but all the kids in my class are taught almost strictly by both myself an an American but still speak English with a Chinese accent. And they are grade one and we are mostly their first experience of English learning so it goes to show. One of the girls was educated for a bit in America so I did hear the accent come through every now and then, but since being with us in China she sounds more like a Chinese English speaker. Maybe it's the concept of what is the "correct English" as if there were one! If you are able to communicate with another English speaker and have them understand you and visa versa then I believe you are speaking English and the accent is irrelevant. Mastering the language itself is the goal, not how you sound when you speak it.

Ps: Do you speak Greek? I had a friend from Cyprus in High School and I loved listening to her argue with her mom! It seems like a very expressive language! I have an Algerian friend here and her Arabic also seems more expressive than English! English feels more neutral. We get things across through the meaning of words more than on how it sounds I think 

melis82 wrote:

Hey Kris, I've been around! Maybe mentally hibernating haha. It is an interesting topic! And thank you for your comment on South African accents. Being here I've learned to appreciate where I come from more and it also made the culture shock pretty bad at times. South Africans's for all their faults are usually pretty friendly and open people to talk to. So it's been hard in such a reserved culture. And I also feel like most foreigners come across as so hostile to other foreigners and I don't get why. I'm always hoping to meet somebody from SA, but foreigners in general don't seem very keen on meeting other foreigners? Especially N. Americans. They've told me themselves they aren't interested in speaking to other Americans. Maybe I'm just a home sick baby!

The Chinese culture definitely seems really keen an American influence. And it's so true what you say about the accents being culture specific regardless of the accent of the teacher. There are English words that are culture specific but all the kids in my class are taught almost strictly by both myself an an American but still speak English with a Chinese accent. And they are grade one and we are mostly their first experience of English learning so it goes to show. One of the girls was educated for a bit in America so I did hear the accent come through every now and then, but since being with us in China she sounds more like a Chinese English speaker. Maybe it's the concept of what is the "correct English" as if there were one! If you are able to communicate with another English speaker and have them understand you and visa versa then I believe you are speaking English and the accent is irrelevant. Mastering the language itself is the goal, not how you sound when you speak it.

Ps: Do you speak Greek? I had a friend from Cyprus in High School and I loved listening to her argue with her mom! It seems like a very expressive language! I have an Algerian friend here and her Arabic also seems more expressive than English! English feels more neutral. We get things across through the meaning of words more than on how it sounds I think 

Hey Melis82,

Yeah we're exactly on the same page when it comes to English accents. As long as we understand each other we're speaking the same language and you know what. Who cares? I mean really, what is the big deal? Isn't Charlize Therron South African, and isn't Sean Connery Scottish and it seems to me Mel Gibson is an Aussie? Well son of a b!tch ain't they all playing Americans in American Hollywood movies???
You take a Bostonian and a Floridian and they're speaking English but sound very different too. Listen to a New Yorker speak English on one side of the table and have a Californian on the other side and you think they came from different countries. Haha! So what does an American sound like?
As a North American I had a tendancy to not want to make friends with non-Chinese. But! When I did make friends with non-Chinese they lasted longer and the friendship seemed truer. I think it's cultural more than anything else. Shall I say more familiar perhaps?
English is an odd language having incorporated many words from other languages ie; Latin, Greek, German, French,etc. and inventing new words and terms now globally used. I think because we've incorporated different words to express ourselves we don't need to stress the language to change the meaning of what we're saying. We simply use different words  and even the choice of word(s) can ultimately change the essence of what we're expressing.
A simple example using the French language (more familiar I guess than Greek) is "I love you". In French it's "Je t'aime" which also means "I like you".  The speaker changes his/her tone and it means one or the other meaning, of course the context and circumstances will play it's role as well.  In English "I like you" and "I love you" are completely different hence no need to stress or change the tone of those three little magical words of "I love you". lol!
I do speak some Greek normally with my dad who is from the island of Kefalonia. The Greek language has words with sounds that must be stressed while the rest of the word will sound neutral. Maybe that's what you're hearing. Now your Cyprus friend may have had some Turkish influence in her Greek too which would change the "sound of Greek" spoken. But yes, when Greeks argue we do stress the same words to have a stronger meaning or effect. I know arguing with my dad or getting excited over a hockey game on the tele, we did get louder but as well we swore an awful lot. The Greek language has some very colorful profanity. Which often made us laugh at ourselves and or the other.
Too bad you're in Donguan... I'm sure we could go on for hours about this topic!


Kris

Hi Melis 82,
Sorry but I lived in Shenzhen for 8 years and taught English at a large College. I am an Aussie and nobody ever wondered about my accent.
Depending on your visa , it's easy to cross to H.K. to get a new one. or get some agencies in Shenzhen to get a better one.

Hey Kris! Yes I know, I could talk about language for ages too! And I do know a bit of Greek profanity, of course swear words are among the first words you learn! One of the girls here is Arabic, you should hear that! You KNOW you're being sworn at when it's in Arabic! (I was not the object of her displeasure, she had some stuff stolen recently on a bus and as a result is very short tempered now on public transport)

Hey Trevor. Maybe Shenzhen is more modern? More with the world? I don't know! But I'm assuming most people don't really recognize South African accents. I know every foreign actor in a movie about SA made us sound like angry Germans haha  So not an easy accent. Then again, it's not like there is one specific SA accent, it depends on where in the country you come from and what your mother tongue is.

I've read a lot about the Hong Kong border run and I've spoken to the agent that handled my paperwork and he confirmed that you can't change your visa that way if you're trying to stay in Guangdong province. Obviously I can't say for certain, I haven't had to do it myself. But I suppose, TIC! You never know 

Getting a job teaching English in China is very easy.  They give them away with every pack of tissues.

Getting a legal job teaching English in China is slightly harder.  If you come from one of the "real" English-speaking countries then it's easier.

Getting a good job teaching English in China is difficult.  Some (legal/professional) schools actually want their teachers to be qualified teachers.  Crazy.

Getting citizenship in China might be aiming a little too high.

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James