American Family of 5, possible move

I'm on my phone so this may be sloppy but here goes from one mommy to the other.

I have never been to Bangkok but I have heard it's better than Vietnam. Better hospitals, less scams, friendlier people, etc.Vietnam isn't bad either, though.

There is an American international school here, not sure if it's good.if it's not there's always Canadian or Australian.

House budget depends on your area. The expat areas are Phu my hung, d.7 and an Phu/Thao Dien d.2
Phu my hung is much more urban and convenient, it has mostly East Asian expats with some western (but plenty enough in my opinion)
An Phu/Thao Dien is where white people flock.it's like little Europe here. It's more suburban, less going on but all the international schools minus Canadian is here. So you may want to go here.

medical care is improving, there are western doctors at FV in d.7. If that's too far there are other international hospitals in d.1 (a 15 minute drive from d.2) I've only been to Hanh phuc and FV clinic in d.1, highly recommend dr. Laure Farnault at fv clinic for your children. (Canadian Dr)

Driving and traffic is horrid. With a family your size you'll need to ask your company if they could provide a car or driver, the locals ride motorbike and it's nothing like America.

You're in luck with expat community. There are many mommy meet ups and if you put yourself out there, you'll run into people, just don't be shy. Expats don't really approach each other here but are very warm when approached. If you have a Facebook, I'll add you to the mommy Saigon page.

What you may bring along depends on you. Beauty products would be one. All products here contain skin bleach. I'm going back to USA to visit and I'll be coming back with clothes for my son, make up, toys, electronics, and whatever else i think of.

Vietnam is great once you get a community going.don't worry, English is a second language here and you'll enjoy your stay.

t understand what you are worried, which is evident when a person choose their life in a different country ... the truth is Ho Chi Minh City is not much good as Bangkok, but I think life here more comfortable Bangkok: cheaper prices, fresh air, friendly people and Thailand and the equally important that we are constantly developing: education, health, economic, human life ... and an equally important thing is that our country has only one party leader should be no instability of the political ... But living in Phu Hung, t think it is a good choice. .full utilities in urban areas: Canadian Schools, Hospitals International France - Vietnam, commercial centers, restaurants, parks, entertainment centers - many entertainment .... West chose this place to live, and their life is very good now ... and traffic problems in Vietnam, it's slightly terrifying .. hehe .. but many people deal with it by using taxi use, and secure astray .. do not worry ^ ^ English is an important language for us, not so good but still be able to communicate to you understand ) .. I do not know how Bangkok What you will find but definitely loved Vietnam ...ak, little forgotten, Viet Nam has a lot of delicious food ...! family is the best thing we have, so do the best thing for them is very important ... on here is my advice .. also where you make the best decision for your life your family ... wish you and your family happy and happy )))) ... oh .. my facebook is Ngay Nao Cung Cuoi ... if there is any questions please contact me Mr. . Calvin - 0966 271 000 .. ))))

Butterfly79 wrote:

All your feed back, suggestions and advise are greatly appreciated as i am a bit nervous about all of this, but very excited at the same time.

You're going to get a wide range of opinions on which is "better", Bangkok or Ho Chi Minh City.  For me, the unavoidable problem with Thailand is the political instability.  They recently underwent a military coup (again) and are under martial law.  That (and the general disdain Thais have for foreigners) rules Thailand out FOR ME as a place to live.

If you've never been to Vietnam, and are considering the move, I found this to be the single best article written about the subject:

http://stuckinsoutheast.asia/guide-to-l … n-vietnam/

And, my advice is you should take two weeks and go there to see it for yourself.  It's very different from the US;  better in many ways and worse in others.  Some people love it (as I do), but their opinion really doesn't really matter, only yours does.

Good luck!

DanFromSF wrote:

Butterfly79 wrote:

All your feed back, suggestions and advise are greatly appreciated as i am a bit nervous about all of this, but very excited at the same time.

You're going to get a wide range of opinions on which is "better", Bangkok or Ho Chi Minh City.  For me, the unavoidable problem with Thailand is the political instability.  They recently underwent a military coup (again) and are under martial law.  That (and the general disdain Thais have for foreigners) rules Thailand out FOR ME as a place to live.

If you've never been to Vietnam, and are considering the move, I found this to be the single best article written about the subject:

http://stuckinsoutheast.asia/guide-to-l … n-vietnam/

And, my advice is you should take two weeks and go there to see it for yourself.  It's very different from the US;  better in many ways and worse in others.  Some people love it (as I do), but their opinion really doesn't really matter, only yours does.

Good luck!

That coup has been going on for 10 years though and nobody seemed freaked out until it escalated and the Western media started covering it. Not invalidating you or anything but from what I hear, it's pretty much business as usual minus the curfew in some cities.

I don't think it's accurate to say the coup has been going on for 10 years.  There was a coup in 2006 (and others going back decades), and then subsequent elections in the following years.  This recent coup happened in May, 2014, along with imposition of martial law and curfews.  So, sure, it's business as usual, but "usual" means political instability, soldiers on street corners, and pissed-off Red Shirts staging violent protests.

From what my expat and Thai friends are saying it is definitely business as usual in Thailand.
Thailand has better hospital and medical facilities than Vietnam.

If it were me heading to SEA I would go to both countries and spend time there and get a feel for the place and check out schools, housing, food costs and general living expenses. For cost of living I have found this site to be of some use www.numbeo.com

Below are a couple of magazine websites from HCMC. There is info about schools, shopping, housing, etc.

http://www.wordhcmc.com/http://oivietnam.com/

The schools, expat organizations and such have websites so you can go there for more info.

The info from others on this forum is good stuff. If you need specifics let us know.

Best

Butterfly79, in your posting you mentioned that you received a call from the company your husbands works for, and they said that it would be better for the company (and maybe you) is the company moved to Viet Nam instead. Did the company give a reason or reasons as to why they decided to go to Viet Nam over Thailand?

South East Asia is attracting a lot of attention and is forecasted to "grow" economically as it has been labeled as another 'developing region' of the World. There's a tremendous amount of politics involved when it comes to transnational corporations, international business, and government bodies. The World Bank is involved in the mix as well , as is the International Chamber of Commerce, and so many others. Unfortunately, politics does control and/or effect so much of our lives whether we know it, notice it or not.

A lot of plans are on the table for Viet Nam's future. I do not know about Thailand's. Much of it is underway already.

There is a situation here in Viet Nam that involves China placing an oil rig inside of Viet Nam's economic zone off the coast of Viet Nam. China isn't budging on the matter and neither is Viet Nam. Now, how the powers that be that run this planet will turn this into opportunities, we in the peasant kingdom don't know. Hopefully it wont turn into another Mid East situation.

I'm just saying take it all into consideration; some matters more than others of course. But I am curious as to why your husband's company has decided to go with Viet Nam over Thailand. Did he ask what their decision was based on? I think that is important.

I would say the company wants to go to Vietnam instead because Thailand's new government is pro-Chinese and they're not happy with the West lashing against them--and Vietnam has been whining for US to get involved with the China Sea dispute, so they may see better relations with Vietnam in the future. (not starting a political debate, just seems that way at the moment!)

Thank you all for the replies, very useful information.

The reason the company decided on HCMC is because they are splitting the SEA area into SEA-North and SEA-South (business practice wise), my husband is going to be over-looking SEA-North which includes Vietnam, South Korea & Japan with the biggest growth opportunity  being in Vietnam, so logically they thought HCMC would be the place for him to be based out of.

We are still in talks with them, i am sure i'll have more specific questions once we are 100% sure that we are in fact moving to HCMC and after he has visited the region.

Thanks again and please if you think of anything else, do share.

Bangkok hands down. It's got at least 10 years on HCMC in terms of development and infrastructure. Don't get me wrong, Saigon is a great place to be young and single (or at least the latter), but those with a family will definitely find it more comfortable to live in Bangkok, if only for the quality of healthcare, availability of public transportation, and shopping.

Price-wise I'd say Bangkok is actually a bit cheaper... In fact, many long-term expats I know make a point of going there a few times a year just for the shopping. Also, it's not uncommon for expats with medical conditions that don't require immediate hospitalization to travel to Thailand for treatment.

@butterfly

Yes, I would agree with your husband's company that there is more business-growth opportunity in Viet Nam. There is a lot of potential here since 'development' is fairly new here. It is attracting businesses from all over the World. As a result, Vietnamese will should learn English since English is now the official language of global commerce. It IS the language to be spoken for commerce. If these students don't grasp that, they will miss the ship.

I've seen reports on where this can be a difficulty for foreign corporations coming to or investing in Viet Nam; effective communication with the workers in the host country. (One's difficulty can be another's opportunity). 

For me, Thai food is much more tastier. Then again, I like spicy foods. Wash wash wash your foods and try to know the suppliers as best you can. I also take a medicine every 3 months for any intestinal parasites. It's just part of my routine. I was concerned about the meat but was told by other foreigners that the fruit is where many of the parasites (and chemicals) come from.

You mentioned that perhaps you will get a bicycle. That is maybe a good idea but as one poster already said, it can be hot in the summer if going a long distance. I first bought a bicycle. My wife said that I drive her motorbike way too fast and that I should get a feel for experiencing the traffic in HCM. Sure, it was a little hot on some days but I looked at it as exercise too. About 3 weeks later I graduated to a motorbike.

You are from Texas and I am also. I am originally from Northern Michigan where my town had 2 stop lights in the entire town. I could drive 1 minute and be in the woods. We both had large open areas to just get outside and do many many things back in Texas. Can't do that in a similar fashion in HCM.  I'd strongly suggest joining a gym eventually or your body may not get the activity it requires. But you have 5 children so.....

Maybe you have already done this but go to youtube and check out each city. Of course do not look at the touristy areas, but look at the 'everyday' sights and sounds. Also look at the pros & cons online for each country/city.

It would seem that the opportunity is much greater in Viet Nam over South Korea and Japan. I'm not saying South Korea and Japan are tapped-out for more business opportunities but since that 'development' has existed longer in those two countries, there may already be in existence a market-domination that has settled in; long standing corporations/businesses that are already well established and dominate the markets. In Viet Nam you will pretty much be in virgin soil so to speak.

Maybe your husband can have the wording in his contract to read that you can relocate if the need arises because it is difficult to foresee situations and circumstances in your future. His company may very well be legally responsible for you and your family's welfare in another country. Maybe even consult with an attorney so that she or he can bring up some concerns (if any) in the wording of this new career project.

I'd stay clear of Japan. Recall the Fukushima earthquake/tsunami of March 2011? Those nuclear reactors have been spewing out irradiated contaminants, and worse is that millions of barrels of poisonous water is going directly into the Pacific Ocean. Its not a pretty sight in Japan or for the entire planet. It's an event that has been buried by main stream news but it is very much happening every minute of the day. It's a massive problem on a global scale and there is really nothing they can do about it.  Plans are underway to try to relocate some of the Japanese population into other countries. It's a global disaster.

oops...you have a family of 5; not 5 children

Thank you, i think you've summed up most of the feed back i've been getting. We've talked to the company expressed that we would rather be in BKK, we'll see.

Yes LOL. And actually, didn't say anything about a bike, you might've gotten my post mixed up with someone else
Japan and South Korea are going to be places my husband travels to for business, not entertaining living there.
Thanks for your feed back and the tips on the fruits & Veggies as well as a medicine for intestinal parasites, yuck!
I like running and doing Yoga, hopefully i'll get into my routine in not time after the move

With regard to your husband's travel, it is better to be in Bangkok for ease of travel and number of flights to and from.

Hi Butterfly79,

My name Cuong, I see that you are confusing between Bangkok & HCMC, About Bangkok, I have no idea about Bangkok but if you want to know some living conditions for foreigners (especially American) in HCMC, I 'm very pleased to help you with the information following:

1. HCMC has The American School of Vietnam - TAS with American standard, it's only located in District 2. You can take a look at they website: theamericanschool.edu.vn

- In addittion, District 2 area has many school for foreigners and almost locate in District 2 such as:
Britain school:             bisvietnam.com
Australia school          aisvietnam.com
International school:   ishcmc.com

2. This area has many house/villa for rent (in compound or not). As your situation, I guess you need at least a house with 4 bedrooms, garden, swimming-pool and close to the school. The price may be in the range of $2500 to $3500 per month. Almost the landlords require amount of 2 month deposit.

Present, I 'm working for  a house for rent  serviced company in District 2 so If you decide to chose HCMC, let me help you find the best house for your family, you need not to pay any serviced fee here.

Finally, if you have any question about this area, just mail me

Hi, I'm a half expat in Vietnam , I stay there for 2 to 3 weeks every month. I'm very familiar with both hcmc and Bangkok .
Bangkok pros- better school, better medical care, cheaper transportation, more people who speaks English ,friendly people, much more shops and malls and pretty much can get whatever you want.
Bangkok cons- very hot and dry weather, bad air in the city, crazy traffic, in parts of Bangkok , traffic jams can last for hours. Political instability.
Hcmc pros- very cheap standard if living, relatively large community of expats, they have quite a number of international schools there but don't know how's their standard. Good weather with clean air.
Hcmc cons- bad bad traffic, during peak hours, motorbikes are likes ants traveling in the tens of thousands, the locals don't know what is polite driving, they will drive along with just 1 or 2 inches apart, really scary , traffic lights and pedestrian crossing don't mean anything to them. There are tons of scammers there, snatch thief, house breaking are common there, so u have to be careful at all times.
Above are the summary for you understanding between the 2 cities, both are quite unique in their own ways, I felt that Bangkok is more modernised while hcmc is much more laid back, Bangkok is like the present day while hcmc is like in the mid 80s. I will agree that you spend a week or so in both places to compare and see for yourself which is the place you prefer.