Owning property as a foreigner?

You can own condo 100% legal in Thailand.

You can setup real or "fake"  company to own land and property.
It is the "Fake" Company the crackdown want to erase now.



If one buy the land and house with GF or Thai wife, one can set up paper work to protect your self in case of a divorce or she dead.

It can be setup like that, the property have to be sold and split XX% / XX%, or she can make you a offer to keep it.
She can not run away from this, or try sell it for 1.000 baht to family.
The Thai court will do the right thing, IF one have to correct legal paper work from a Thai court.

Or you can set up paper, That you have the right for the property for 2 X 30 years . But after that, it will be on Thai hands.

I know many Fa-Rang in Thailand say NO NO can´t make GF/Wife sign paper like that, it is like saying you don´t 100% trust her.
Well, better to be safe the sorry in my world, And if she with you for love, she have no problem sign that paper.

When I hit the ground in November, I want to start looking at condos with Chanote deeds. I have a Thai legal service set up to work with already to make sure all the paperwork is legit and legal. No Thai gf or wife to put into their name at the moment and not in a rush to get one, at least the wife part lmao.

I'm just trying to see how I would go about this, as I do intend to purchase more property for rentals, but the first condo I will be looking to buy is going to be close to CM University, as to cut down on traffic for myself. Since I would be starting a company and not for the work permit, that is the part that I am trying to make sure is still possible without the gf or wife.

I am not sure how that would translate out though if I was able to purchase the property without an issue, but that 2 X 30, I'm wondering if can be put in company name and released through a quitclaim deed to be xferred later on down the road into the wife's name, say 5-6 years.

I know these are all questions I should be asking the law firm I will be working with, but wanted to get some rough insight from other expats that might have chosen to go the same route without a tgf or wife on the deed, and if the land lease is transferable on properties.

I do have a reputable Thai law firm that I plan on working with, but are there any other recommendations on any others, possibly some based out of Chiang Mai for me to investigate?

what i used to do years back was to go to the bank, ask them for a list of repossessed apartments, they were well below the actual market price cos the previous owner had already paid a certain amount for it, and it is further negotiable with the bank, surprisingly, i manage to buy several units besides or within short walking distance of the MRTs, they were all in bangkok metro area .. so they were all good buy, just that it takes a long time checking out their locations on map before narrowing down choices, if you plan to rent them, it would has to be really close to transport such as MRTs. fetch a much higher rent too.

A foreigner can own a condo in their name provided not more than 49% of building is foreign owned.

A Thai company must be majority owned by Thai's in most cases.  This means the company can be no more than 49% foreign owned. Sometimes it is a maximum of 39% but in most cases it's 49% foreign owned.

Straydog wrote:

A foreigner can own a condo in their name provided not more than 49% of building is foreign owned.

A Thai company must be majority owned by Thai's in most cases.  This means the company can be no more than 49% foreign owned. Sometimes it is a maximum of 39% but in most cases it's 49% foreign owned.

Yeppers, fully aware of the company specs. 49% max foreign ownership. I am wondering if anyone has done this before with property or land? Since it will likely be a couple years before I have tgf or wife, I want to make sure that I can purchase the property on my own or in the name of my company. I am sure I can do this as this is the case with many bars, businesses, etc., but I am not sure if I can get the 2X30 lease through a company that I own, or if it has to be in a single individual Thai's name.

You cannot own land. Any way you try you risk losing everything.

You can own a condo in a building with the majority of ownership Thai.

BUT...

Are you aware of the market forces regarding rental units in CM?

The vacancy rate is high and most expect it will go higher.

So planning to buy and rent? Well... I WAS planning to buy 3 rental condos before the high season (Nov) but now I'm not even certain I'll stay in Thailand...

As for starting a company: You'll need a Thai partner who will own 51% - good luck with that. Or you can bend (or break) the law and hope for the best.

FYI: The military is currently 'cracking-down' on all the illegal and grey-area things in this post so you will run the risk having it all confiscated and being deported...

recklessron wrote:

You cannot own land. Any way you try you risk losing everything.

You can own a condo in a building with the majority of ownership Thai.

BUT...

Are you aware of the market forces regarding rental units in CM?

The vacancy rate is high and most expect it will go higher.

So planning to buy and rent? Well... I WAS planning to buy 3 rental condos before the high season (Nov) but now I'm not even certain I'll stay in Thailand...

As for starting a company: You'll need a Thai partner who will own 51% - good luck with that. Or you can bend (or break) the law and hope for the best.

FYI: The military is currently 'cracking-down' on all the illegal and grey-area things in this post so you will run the risk having it all confiscated and being deported...

Yea it sounds like you've had some bad luck there man. There are plenty of ways to do things straight up legal such as I plan to do. This definitely isn't my first rodeo with Thailand, just this particular area. Hope you have better luck in the future.

My point is that this is NOT the good ol' Thailand you used to know.

This is not just another military coup that will fade with only minor changes.

Anyone owning a business, of any kind, is suffering from a lack of business (ie: tourists). That is unlikely to change in the foreseeable future (and I am not refer to it being the off season).

This has NOTHING to do with legality. You can legally buy condos and, probably, legally rent them. However you need someone to rent them to in order for that plan to work. There is a glut of housing and condos, many more built recently and being built than are needed, and less tourists than ever before to rent them to.

Ok I follow what your saying. Sorry for going off on ya like that man lol, i think most of us are Type A personalities.

I've been here when the redshirts stormed the airport, so it's nothing new to me. What is it, every 4 years or so they a coup it seems?

A lot of the rentals that are getting rented though already have an established customer base, great marketing, or a few connections to help push properties. I would definitely say that anyone opening any kind of business in Thailand or planning on working here, needs to know what they are getting into. Many don't know the ins and outs and tea money and all the rest that comes along with it.

I appreciate the info though, lets me know it is going to be a more competitive market, but that's half the fun right lol?

FYI: I'm expecting a complete collapse of the Thai economy.

Don't forget the 51% ownership issue. Since Thais (in general) don't like 'used' condos, and there are LOTS of brand new ones available, falang with money will be buying used condos at fire-sale prices. As more people get squeezed out by the new visa crackdowns and more and more businesses go bankrupt their condos are up for sale at 'great' prices. That includes Thai businesses. How will that affect the ownership percentages? What do you do if the building you bought a condo in shifts to more than 49% falang? What if it becomes semi-common. How will the military rule on this? Could they decide to confiscate those condos that are 'technically' illegal?

IMHO: Thailand currently has big risks with very little reward. Why not buy condos in another country (like your homeland) and get your income from them? Somewhere they will never be confiscated?

Sounds like there are a lot of problems but everywhere have problems.
Is the economy in that poor of shape?

The tourism side of the economy has taken a hit since the coup.

recklessron wrote:

FYI: I'm expecting a complete collapse of the Thai economy.

Don't forget the 51% ownership issue. Since Thais (in general) don't like 'used' condos, and there are LOTS of brand new ones available, falang with money will be buying used condos at fire-sale prices. As more people get squeezed out by the new visa crackdowns and more and more businesses go bankrupt their condos are up for sale at 'great' prices. That includes Thai businesses. How will that affect the ownership percentages? What do you do if the building you bought a condo in shifts to more than 49% falang? What if it becomes semi-common. How will the military rule on this? Could they decide to confiscate those condos that are 'technically' illegal?

IMHO: Thailand currently has big risks with very little reward. Why not buy condos in another country (like your homeland) and get your income from them? Somewhere they will never be confiscated?

I will likely be traveling around quite a bit, so at very least I would be looking at one place for myself. Might be just a matter of renting when I'm out of town. Regardless, it is one less bill I have to deal with on my end to own one, I got plenty of time to wait before looking at any more. Who's to say I'll end up just looking at condos, I don't plan on making decisions across the sea, will do everything on the ground in Thailand.

I'm not sure of the legal logistics of it until i land in November, but even if the % of a building ownership changed to higher to foreigners, there would be some period of notification by the government that you are going to be in that situation.  Just like everyone says and I would agree, anyone living in Thailand even those like yourself should have a backup plan and enough for a ticket back home if something major happened or didn't work out. I'll follow that advice myself as well.

There are enough stories to go around of those having lost it all due to falling in love with the first girl they met, or getting scammed by professional foreigners with no repercussion. There is still the fact though that more than not are able to live in Thailand unaffected by whats going on politically, whether just fully loaded and sleeping all day, or working, or running some kind of business. IF the day ever came where they started booting all the business owners, then those on retirement would likely be next to go. I just don't see things ever getting to that point honestly.

"I'm not sure of the legal logistics of it until i land in November, but even if the % of a building ownership changed to higher to foreigners, there would be some period of notification by the government that you are going to be in that situation. "

555

That is Thai for ha ha ha.

Sorry, mate, but that is NOT how Thailand works.

Plus I've thought more on the subject and you need to consider all the 'fake' companies that falang (foreigners) are running. Lot of people set up fake Thai companies and buy land or houses or condos. By fake I mean the company is, on paper only, less than 50% foreign owned but is, in reality, 100% foreign owned and the Thai portion is faked by buying of Thai people. That is also on the agenda of the military to stop as reported in the National Post (Thailand's national newspaper) and ALL Thai TV stations.

Anyway I was considering the situation of owning a condo that is currently 100% legal because 100 units are owned by Thais (including Thai companies) and 90- something - are falang. But.. let's say 10 of those units are owned by 'fake' Thai companies that really belong to falang. IF, and I mean IF, the military goes after that area (like they say they will) then the building will wind up with more falang ownership than Thai. As that is illegal the military may decide those buildings rightly belong to Thailand and confiscate all the units. Why not just a few? Because then all the falang owners who are innocent would need to be picked through and it would open them up to serious problems. Much, much easier to declare the building in violation and confiscate it! And why would they even consider going after the 10 units when they have the opportunity to take the whole thing?

But based on your quoted statement I guess you're thinking this is Kansas... Dorothy!

BTW: This IS martial law. Do you have any concept of it? Try asking a Thai lawyer a general question and they will tell you they can't answer until there is a government and return to rule-of-law.
See: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/749 … stitution/

Anyway this whole post is way more aggressive than I intended. Sorry, it's not personal, I'm just pissed because I came here in Nov last year to do just that. Buy condos, rent them and live off the income. I obtained my retirement visa and could live here until my funds run out but I need some income or I'll outlive my assets. Only fools buy bars or restaurants but I thought well chosen rental units would be the smartest as they retain, or gain, their value over time as well as return a reasonable income. I was expecting 70% of the monthly rent after vacancy, repairs, management fees, condo fees, etc. It was VERY doable - until everyone left and countries (is it 40 or 75?) put Thailand on the "don't travel" list and the military stopped all repeat tourist visa runs and put in a curfew - still in place - btw they are saying they will ban all alcohol advertising on any signs and make it illegal to drink a beer in a bar after midnight {really}. How do you see that affecting the tourist industry? and the vacancy rate?

IMHO: Tightening up of visas increases the vacancy rate:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/755 … paign=news

I'm honestly fine just living off what I have and pension. I would really see myself just getting bored sitting around and not doing anything. Some folks are fine with that and that is great for them. I could probably stand about 6 months of not doing anything before I was bored out of my wits.

And I definitely don't know anything about Kansas, never been there before. I guess I'm just one of those that has to learn for myself good or bad.

Bear in mind that to set up a shell (fake) company for the specific purpose of circumnavigating the alien land ownership laws is illegal.

If it is a legitimate company that actively trades then its ok to buy a house in its name.

Pompui that's how so many fall into the trap of sitting on a bar stool all day long.

Lancashire Lad wrote:

Bear in mind that to set up a shell (fake) company for the specific purpose of circumnavigating the alien land ownership laws is illegal.

If it is a legitimate company that actively trades then its ok to buy a house in its name.

Pompui that's how so many fall into the trap of sitting on a bar stool all day long.

Yea no doubt. I've watched many others do the same thing with every kind of business under the sun. I have other interests that I am pursuing during my first couple years back, but to me it doesn't make sense not to pursue things legally for other investments.

Have you considered the Philippines?

I'm about to travel to Dumaguete to check out my options (I'm thinking of living in a smaller place close by like Valencia). Looks like I can buy small condos there (30 - 40 sq. m) for around $US20K fairly easily and with an investment of $US40K (bank or real estate - possibly even business) I get virtually permanent citizenship (my Thai Retirement Visa requires 90 day reports not just an annual renewal).

Here's a site you might like to fool around with:
http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/comparison.jsp

I don't know about the accuracy of other places but their costs of CM are fairly reasonable so I extrapolate other places are equal valid.

@recklessron.

You on Extension (Don´t care if you think it is a Visa, as one don´t have to do address report on Visa) to stay for "RETIREMENT" and you live in CM, for that you need to go to Immigration once a year.
And you think that to must, he he really ???

90 days address report you don´t need to do in person, you can get everyone to do it for you.
Your wife, GF, BF, the girl from last night, the cook, the hotel staff, the taxi driver, EVERYONE can do it for you.

So many people here like  to earn 300-500 baht. and do it for you, they get a full 1 day pay, for using a few hours to do it.

All so you live in CM. And CM have 90 days address report by mailed.

Follow you one only good advice on this page, look at thaivisa. I make it easy for you. i link to 1 of the many tread about it, as i know it can be to hard for you to find.

This is the CM-Forum on thaivisa.

CM 90 days report



So you see only 1 time pr year do you need to go in person to CM Immigration, if that to must for you. Then maybe Philippines is better for you.

The problem with mailing it in is you don't have your passport for the time it takes to be processed and returned to you. With the curfew in effect and the military in charge it isn't wise to travel without your passport unless you have a Thai Driver's License, which I don't have. If you happen to get into an accident, or other police trouble, while your passport is 'in the mail', you may sit in a jail cell until you get it back or they are able to verify who you are.

Paying someone to do your 90 Day Reports is a hassle and costs money and if they screw it up you might loose your right to stay in Thailand.

BTW: Go ahead and call it an extension but my passport stamp reads RETIREMENT with no mention of the word 'extension' anywhere. That is semantics and a person with your level of English (much better than my Thai but far from perfect) really shouldn't be picking on anyone's grammar, especially when 'Retirement Visa' is the commonly used name for it whether it is the official name or not!

FYI: I HAVE the Retirement Visa and I HAVE DONE the 90 Day Reports so I don't need to learn anything about how to do it or what is involved - thank you very much, eh!  Also, IMHO, ThaiVisa is a very unfriendly forum despite having good info from time to time.

My point is you DO NOT HAVE to do 90 Day Reports in the Philippines. Plus you have almost ZERO risk of the Philippines refusing to give, or extend, your retirement whereas it is anyone's guess what the military or immigration will decide to do next. The rules on foreigners in Thailand change almost daily. Ask anyone on a Student Visa who wasn't really studying or those living here as Tourists doing regular visa-runs! They are all gone now and many had condos or houses and wives and lives here! Also I have friends who went to their annual Retirement renewal and were REFUSED for no reason. Luckily they both successfully appealed but it put them through a lot of unnecessary trauma and legal expense.

Curfew was ended months ago.

recklessron wrote:

The problem with mailing it in is you don't have your passport for the time it takes to be processed and returned to you. With the curfew in effect and the military in charge it isn't wise to travel without your passport unless you have a Thai Driver's License, which I don't have. If you happen to get into an accident, or other police trouble, while your passport is 'in the mail', you may sit in a jail cell until you get it back or they are able to verify who you are.

Paying someone to do your 90 Day Reports is a hassle and costs money and if they screw it up you might loose your right to stay in Thailand.

BTW: Go ahead and call it an extension but my passport stamp reads RETIREMENT with no mention of the word 'extension' anywhere. That is semantics and a person with your level of English (much better than my Thai but far from perfect) really shouldn't be picking on anyone's grammar, especially when 'Retirement Visa' is the commonly used name for it whether it is the official name or not!

FYI: I HAVE the Retirement Visa and I HAVE DONE the 90 Day Reports so I don't need to learn anything about how to do it or what is involved - thank you very much, eh!  Also, IMHO, ThaiVisa is a very unfriendly forum despite having good info from time to time.

My point is you DO NOT HAVE to do 90 Day Reports in the Philippines. Plus you have almost ZERO risk of the Philippines refusing to give, or extend, your retirement whereas it is anyone's guess what the military or immigration will decide to do next. The rules on foreigners in Thailand change almost daily. Ask anyone on a Student Visa who wasn't really studying or those living here as Tourists doing regular visa-runs! They are all gone now and many had condos or houses and wives and lives here! Also I have friends who went to their annual Retirement renewal and were REFUSED for no reason. Luckily they both successfully appealed but it put them through a lot of unnecessary trauma and legal expense.

I'm starting to get the impression that your activities on this forum are troll like. However I cannot stand by and read some of the drivel you come out with without making a comment.

1. There is no curfew(or did you mean martial law) and foreigners have always been required to carry their passport, a Thai drivers licence is not a replacement for that document but is sometimes accepted as ID.

2. You do not mail your passport for a 90 day report by post. Just copies of relevant pages, your arrivals card and a TM 47.
3. It is an extension of stay. You may remember you posted a copy of your passport in another thread which I answered and you didn't come back on. Itshere!
4. Please don't insult forum members whose 1st language is not English. For your information, seeing as my first language IS English, Thai Visa, Retirement Visa and extension of stay are not English grammar. They are descriptive words, nothing more.
5. If you have done 90 day reports you are on an extension of stay.Try following the link I kindly provided in my reply to you in the other post. It lays everything out in plain English.
6. The rules in Thailand do not change daily. I have been here on a RETIREMENT EXTENSION since 2008. Please provide evidence that anything has changed for me in the last 6 years.
7. Anyone who isn't studying in Thailand and is here on an ED Visa is here fraudulently. Same with those living here as "tourists" tourists go home after their holiday normally!
8. The recent changes to the Police Orders governing extensions of stay have actually relaxed some aspects of these regulations e.g. dependents extensions.

In CM the bars all CLOSE AT 1AM!

Those that stay open close up the front (often pulling down a 'garage-door') and turn off the music. Customers are expect to be QUIET. No shouting, no loud discussions - stay quite and you can sit in the back and drink. If you are lucky you can watch a TV with the sound barely audible.

I came here because CM was a 24-7 town. You could always go somewhere, even at 4am. Now it is a ghost town at 1:30am. You can't even get into a place after 1am unless they know you.

And I am told that the curfew in CM is 2am to 5am - I don't have personal experience with that - since all the bars are closed I'm home at that time.

BTW: If you know anyone who owns a business here they will tell you they are hurting, badly, especially the bars and restaurants!

Hello everybody,

Just to remind you that only legal advices are welcome on the forum !
Let's concentrate on Pomqui problem and try to help him to find solutions in accordance to the law.

Thanks all,

Priscilla 

(moderated : you're not respecting the Team = ban)

Pompui.... I'll share my experience and you can take what you want from it. I'd been going to Thailand for 30 years or so but only for holidays.. In the last number of years my circumstances allowed me to get more serious.. I was advised on forums to take it slow and look around .... To some extent I did that..
What I've discovered is that the place you might think you like after being there and looking around for say ... 3 months....may not be the place you like in 12 months.
In fact .... You may find that the place you first choose is maybe one of the worst choices that a man with a great deal more experience...would NOT make.
Perceptions change. You discover new areas that are better....
There's no hurry....if the money's there then there's nothing to worry about. Thailand is all about the money. I would say take your time....it's not going anywhere.
Oh and on the retirement visa issue ...and all my information is that it is an 'extension of stay'..