Learning more about renting and/or buying property in Portugal

There has to be a reason to move. Without a good reason there's no point. And if there is a good reason, why the scepticism?...

@ctomac I absolutely agree with you.

We thought a lot about moving and had very good reasons for deciding in favor of Portugal instead of the other candidates. These reasons apply until today, which shows us that we made a good decision. And by the way, we only learnt about the NHT possibilities when we were here, so this didn't figure in our choice.

I would never move anywhere without properly analyzing the reasons for and the consequences of the move.

This tread seems a bit obsolete as the topic is covered much wider elsewhere in the forum.

It's an enormous change, for most people anyway.  Skepticism is a good thing.  Get a few weeks on the ground, in a residential situation like what you'd envision, while holding that skepticism up against it.  A lot of people think they're going to learn Portuguese enough to chat with their neighbors - bring your skepticism.  Or that they're going to find themselves surrounded by people who want to speak in their expat language.

Personally I think many of the motivations for moving to Portugal are weak.  It's sunny, people are nice, wine is cheap, but people don't transplant easily.

For anyone considering moving/living in Portugal then (in my opinion) there is no substitute to spending time in Portugal  and experiencing different places at different times of year BEFORE making any decision to move. Doing internet "research" in no substitute for first hand experience. Those wonderful online photos and videos of sandy beaches bathed in sun miss the stifling heat of midsummer and cold damp back mold of winter etc etc.

Personally I think many of the motivations for moving to Portugal are weak. It's sunny, people are nice, wine is cheap, but people don't transplant easily.
-@donn25

I fully agree and I cannot understand why people buy real estate in Portugal without ever having lived in the country. Visiting Portugal a few times on holidays also doesn't really help. So after the holidays one should come here, rent an apartment in a nice area and find out how life really is. Then one can still make a final decision, which doesn't have to be THAT final.

@nz7521137 To be honest, I didn't do that - we made a couple brief visits, and that was it.  Now we're living at the edge of a small city in central Portugal.

I don't know if it would be possible to even very approximately get the taste of this by renting for a year somewhere.  The hay field we're in the middle of, that for the last couple weeks has been hitting me hard with hay fever pollen allergy.  The dog across the street who barks a lot during the night,  but who is a particular dog, different from the dog that would bark all night at your rental, and luckily we kind of like him.  The neighbors.  It sounds like a good idea, but is it really telling you what you need to know, or is it just testing your determination?  I don't know, I didn't really think about it that hard.  At 67, I felt like kicking the can down the road for a year was not in my interest, especially after a couple of years watching Portugal real estate choices dwindle and prices rise.

But I'm not the typical American refugee, I showed up with a modest but usable command of the language and the other things that come with that.  That's a lot to expect, but ... it is a culture, language etc., not just a pleasant place to camp out.

It sounds like a good idea, but is it really telling you what you need to know, or is it just testing your determination? I don't know, I didn't really think about it that hard. At 67, I felt like kicking the can down the road for a year was not in my interest, especially after a couple of years watching Portugal real estate choices dwindle and prices rise.
-@donn25

Everybody's situation and needs are different and we arrived many years earlier than you did, with real estate prices more affordable (maybe except Lisbon, Porto and the coast to Cascais). I still think that writing down what one needs/wants and having a good look around before making a major commitment is generally a good idea. But, no rule without exceptions.

I recognize that markets are very localized, so this is a general question for those who happen to have a crystal ball that's been gathering dust in their closet: do you anticipate home prices to appreciate more in a popular area of the U.S. or in Portugal over the next 2-3 years? I'm trying to decide whether to sell here first or rent for a while and make that call later.

I recognize that markets are very localized, so this is a general question for those who happen to have a crystal ball that's been gathering dust in their closet: do you anticipate home prices to appreciate more in a popular area of the U.S. or in Portugal over the next 2-3 years? I'm trying to decide whether to sell here first or rent for a while and make that call later.
-@buchyvon

I think that first you have to know where you would want to live in Portugal. To find that out might take a little time. So I guess renting is a good idea until you know where you would want to be. In the end it all depends on your financial situation. We could rent for 18 months before making our move to buy (plus kept our other properties). Overall there is a wide range of opinions on this topic.

Our house just went on the market in a popular area of the US, and it looks like it's going to sell in a few days for more than we asked.  I would not have guessed, so no crystal ball here.  Is it really a popular area?  It sure was 5 years ago, but big layoffs, urban disorder to put it mildly, have a lot of people feeling like the bubble may be in the process of bursting.  Yet from this little spot, the sun is shining, the birds are singing, and people are going to the bank for big home loans.

So, who knows.  I can't see us asking the question, though.  I bought here right off, because I didn't want to mess around with renting and I didn't want to live in an apartment, and when we had the residence visas, we contacted a realtor to start getting the US house on the market.  Having responsibility for it, while living in Portugal, was such an unattractive idea that it got no serious consideration.  But that's partly about the house, and about us, and probably some other factors that don't apply to others.  An uncertain promise of better asset yield didn't figure into it.

Thank you, donn25. That was a great answer ... I agree with your logic. I will probably end up selling first and renting in Portugal while I decide on a location. You were very clear about where you wanted to live; I'm not yet. So, like nz7521137 wrote, it will probably make sense for me to rent a while. See you on the flip side!

Expats getting priced out of Portugal in 2023.

If you've been hesistating about moving to Portugal

as a haven where housing prices are on the low side,

you may be in luck if coming from New York City

or San Francisco.

If those do not include your present location,

realize that the horse has evidently left the barn.

House prices in Portugal rose 157 percent between

2020 and 2021.  Rents rose 112 percent, 2015-21.

"...and much of that rise has been fueled by

outsiders like foreign investors and tourists

seeking short-term rentals," Associated Press reports.

Statistics above are from Eurostat, the EU's

statistical agency.  Source... an article

reprinted at www.cuencahighlife.com ..

titled "Expats attracted to Portugal

for low living costs  and a laidback lifestyle

are often disappointed."

Sure, the disparity has become less, but ... you know how much you can afford, and I think it's worth a look at some prices around different parts of Portugal.  US house prices have been climbing, too (thanks in large part to financial industry investment parasitism), and I don't see prices really skyrocketing here in the central area, now.  Though to be sure they did go up in the last couple of years.  I think there was a lot of optimism among sellers here, who overestimated the demand, and houses that have consequently sat on the market for a long time serving as an object lesson to the real estate agents trying to sell them.

That was really the question, I think - if you are going to sell a house there and buy one here, from a purely financial point of view, they're in a race, and you want to wait while your old house is winning, and jump when it isn't.  Unfortunately ... past results are not a guarantee of future performance.  Will the big demand wave really hit?  Will turmoil in the US finally pierce the real estate bubble?  Stay tuned, for future episodes of The Real Estate Game!

@cccmedia What you write is - like in many countries - only true for a few locations.

The majority of the immigrants only want to move to very few locations. After renting for a while we were looking in "our" area to buy and immediately found out that we were not willing to pay the asking prices. So we moved a little bit and found what we like for very little money and only 30 minutes drive or bus from Lisbon.

I also think that money matters, but quality of the life I want to live matters more. I like the generally very clean air, the clean sea water, the clean drinking water, the low population density and easy driving on the motorway, ...