Safety in Philippines

@ukdan Philippines' law criminalizes adultery and concubinage. Both are deemed “crimes against chastity” under the Revised Penal Code of the Philippines and are treated as sexual infidelity in the Family Code.

The law discriminates against wives. The crime of adultery can be committed only by a wife and her paramour. The husband need only prove that his wife had sexual intercourse with a man other than him.

The crime of concubinage can be committed only by a husband and his concubine, but it requires that the wife must prove that her husband has kept a mistress in the conjugal dwelling, or has had sexual intercourse under “scandalous circumstances” or lived together with his mistress in any other place.

The penalties are also quite different. For adultery the guilty wife and her paramour may be imprisoned for up to 6 years

For concubinage, the husband may be imprisoned for up to 4 years and 1 day, while his concubine may be merely “banished” but may not be imprisoned.

The laws work to the great disadvantage of women. There is no divorce in the Philippines and abandoned wives are often accused of adultery in order to force them to agree to their husband's petitions to nullify the marriage. The Philippine Commission on Women reports that, “In many cases, women who are faced by these threats are forced to forego legitimate custodial claims of their children while some are forced to give up their claims over conjugal properties, assets and the like

Hi everybody- new here. Dan from London. I have a question about safety in Php.
I met this fantastic woman from Lucena online and want to visit her at the end of this month. I was thinking of taking a bus or Taxi to a resort close to Lucena where we will spend a few nights together before I return to Manila. I have a few questions.

What is the safest way to travel from Manila to Lucena, and is Lucena and surrounding areas safe to travel on your own?
The Lady is separated from her husband for 6 years or so but apparently, there is no divorce in Philippines. Somebody told me that if the ex-husband makes a criminal complaint for infidelity, I can be locked up for 6 years if I am found to be with this Lady. Is this correct?

Thanks for your advice in advance.

Dan
-@ukdan

My bad, wrong button, what I meant to say to the OP was start again and don't get involved with problems/baggage. Potentially 2 or 300K to sort out some one else's problem for the next 2 or 3 plus years as well as potentially dealing with a pissed of ex, getting locked up, you don't want to spend time in a Filipino prison, walk softly, research and research again.

BTW welcome to the forum.

Cheers, Steve.

@ukdan That is in principiple correct. The husband can file adultry charges. There is a bureau in the Philippines in every town but i forgot the name were you can get the marriage status on every woman. That proceeding has also a name but i also forgot. If that Husband however lives himself with an other woman and possible has children with her, he wont get true with the charges. But you will have to prove that. and for you going true the barangays asking questions, you or get lied to or they take you apart. If you live with a Filipina and her children who was not married before, and you take care and feed her children you can file charges against the father who does not support his children and get your monney back. You will never get it cause he will have you shot wich is much cheaper as paying your bills. The best thing is to not go at all with married woman to stay on the secure side, and if you start any relationship check her background first. Every Filipino and Filipina can tell you the name of wich bureau you should go to. I have done it myself, its not expensive. Best is to take the woman and go there together. I did. So she can present an ID, it can be done without her presence and ID but its more difficult, you need to know her exact name and that of her parents, and were they all live. my advice, love them and leave them. Stay away from married woman. In fact Filipinas are beautyfull but highly dangerous. They offen belong, are the property of fraternaties being send out to prey on you, you can see that on the scars on their legs were they were beating while trained. Or they are police assets comming to you with the local drug shabu, if you do that, you will end up in prisson. If you have sex with those assets afterwards the police will rush them to a hospital to get prove of that sex. My advise? Forget about Lucena go fisching instead.

Where are you coming from Ivo? You sound like another member here (I forgot can't remember where

I heard that) and we haven't seen for some time.

BTW welcome to the forum.

Cheers, Steve.

A good website for finding how to get places here is called Rome2Rio

Is there a direct bus between Manila and Lucena?

Yes, there is a direct bus departing from Jam Liner Buendia Bus Terminal and arriving at Dalahican Terminal. Services depart hourly, and operate every day. The journey takes approximately 4h.

This comes up when you google it.

I’ve used it before for traveling to places here.

As far as the woman goes, i agree with the above answers. I’ve read of foreigners charged with adultery here , it doesn’t go well for the foreigner.

A young Filipina was carrying on with a Old Expat she met on a dating app. One of her friends said how can you have aerobics with that old man?

She replied I close my eyes and think about the money.

@ukdan

Welcome to the forum. It is difficult to know the recent crime rates in Lucena. Try googling crime in the Calabarzon Region. The highest crime cities are Manila and Quezon City which rank 3rd and 5th in Asia according to Numbeo 2023 statistics. Only Kabul, Afghanistan and Damascus, Syria have higher crime rates than Manila so it is safe to say Lucena has lower crime than the big cities. Compared to the rest of the world Manila has about the same crime rate as Atlanta, Georgia which is certainly nothing to brag about. I’m from Georgia and now live in the Philippines but I’m down in the provincial region and only visit Manila when absolutely necessary. Stay in a good hotel and let the hotel help you with transportation. Metered taxis and buses should be a safe means of travel.

After reading your message I’m more concerned about the whole situation you’re getting yourself into. Your sweetheart comes with a whole lot of baggage. My wife’s sister was married with a young child when her Filipino husband abandoned her. She met her present husband online and they had the marriage annulled, but it took 3 years and a lot of money. I don’t think there are any regrets, the baby (now a young adult) considers my brother in law his father and I watched a video today of him graduating high school with top honors. This was a success story but my now brother in law was very careful and his girl's big sister (my wife) and myself were character references.

If you meet the girl it is best not to fall in love with her and keep an open mind. There are a lot of scams these days and the scammers are on top of their game. Maybe you could chat with some locals and see what they know about her. If she asks for money or comes up with some dire circumstances which requires an infusion of cash to remedy I would be out of that situation fast. There are way too many honest single girls to consider.

It does not matter were a man comes from, it matters only were he is, and were he is going. Werever you are should be your home. If it is about the Philippines, in my years living there i learned that what Butch  told me is the absolute truth. Wenn i just hopped of the plane i went straight to cebu citty, there was a big mall with nice outside restarurants but you was not aloud to smoke there. However there was one guy there pissing on the rules drinking and smoking, a filipino. Turned out he was the director of one of the biggest companies in south east asia, he told me that night, we were drinking there still wenn everything was closed, what to do and not do in the Philippines. The next day we met again on the rooftop of a restaurant wich he completly hired for the night just to have dinner with me and educate me. He was bussy at the time with installing Duterte as President, he was one of the engines after his campaign, And Duterte became president as we all know. Leave those things to Butch. I was lucky to have met that guy. Than true the years i lived there i did not always did what he had told me, and yes i came into trouble. It learned my painfull lessons. Got nearly killed on a few occasions. Most men go there to find a woman that they cannot find at home. But there is not such a thing as love as we know it in the west in the Phillipines. Love there has always a major economic element. For example your father has a karabauw and her father a ricefield that it logic you both marry so both families benefit from it. If you love eachother or not has no meaning there. Or your father has a dispute with his fraternity with a fraternitty of the next barangay, to sign the peace you will marry a girl from that barangay, so noboddy gets killed. Every woman that a foreigner goes with, a filipino afterwards cannot start a relation with her, his familly will not have that whore in the family who was with a foreigner. The social structure there is verry strict, if a filipino person falls out of it, he or she never can back in. So most woman you meet and are willing to be with you, they probably already had relations with other foreigners, they are now doomed to only them. It is not paradise, its a wild and dangerous world were it takes sometimes only 1000 pesos to have someone shot. For that money they can get a passport to work abroad. Monney is their holy grale next to family and being religious. You are just a stupid kano they can shake out. In fact if they succeed in shaking you out of your money it will benefit their social status they will get admired for it, thats what we all want in life, they to. In not to long i will live there again, its my favorite place in the world. the place i end my days untill i drop dead. Thanks for the welcome Steve. Appreciated.

@ukdan

The above contributions that you will have read are well meaning but I suspect of little comfort to you. The phrase ‘bolting the stable door’ springs to mind.

Given that you are flying out at the end of the month I would imagine that your flight is paid for already and that you are committed to visiting your ‘fantastic’ (they all are) woman.

Some statistics thrown about in this thread can be very misleading - ‘Lies, damned lies & statistics’ goes the common refrain. The key is interpretation of these statistics. The Philippines is a relatively safe country to visit. Its only if you get into the wrong company or become involved in nefarious activities do the odds reduce in your chances of becoming one of those statistics.

I see you are a fellow Brit. To use Moon Dogs Numbeo 2023 illustration in terms of city crime rates. Bradford in the UK has a higher crime rate than Manila - 31 & 45 respectively. Moon Dog by his own admission has spent only 2 weeks in Manila in his entire time in the Philippines. I have been visiting Manila since 2001 and have never been a victim of crime. Taxis overcharging on the meter? For sure. Manila is a metropolis and I would liken it more to US than British cities. There are no go areas in Manila at night. Makati which is the central business district and the neat,tidy, clean,antisceptic Bonifacio Global City (BGC) are safe in the evening.

To ram home the point. I would rather be walking in Makati at night than the nearest big city to me Bristol and definitely London where knife crime and muggings are on the increase. Oh and a little aside here which I cannot resist - if I wanted to get mugged in Jakarta I would have to pay for someone to do it. Sorry I digress.

BlacksheepJuno has answered your query regarding transportation to Lucena, a city I note with a surprisingly large population of 250,000. The crime rate there is minimal compared to Manila.

You mention that your ‘lady’ (let’s hope she is) is separated from her husband. Well she did not have to tell you this so its a plus. It could be though what Jim ‘at the tone leave your name and number’ Rockford referred to as a ‘reverse sell’. She did not have to impart this information which is a plus for her credibility but it could still be a potential trap. If you don’t know already ask her if Lucena is her home town? Do all her siblings, parents, nieces  nephews and most importantly, her ex live there? If so steer clear and meet her on neutral territory. It has been known for foreigners to be set up, with the local Police in on the scam. No sooner have you checked into the motel room and 5 minutes later there is a knock on the door..

Perhaps meet up in Batangas 50 miles away (if necessary wire her the cheap bus fare) and take the ferry over to Puerto Galera for a few days.

Keep your wits about you and always be ready to bail out of the relationship if she starts alluding to monetary needs.  I’m sure that you will have a great time though. Bonnes Vacances!

I lived both in batangas and Puerto Galera, both 4 or 5 months. The latter i liked the best. Batangas specialy around the peer were the boats are is verry dangerous at night. Realy many gangsters. The pick up girls are there walking about. But they are just waiting there to screw up a foreigner. The rest of the city is verry dull. My advice dont go to Batangas. Puerto galera is a nice place to live with even a white beach, a lot of foreigners live there. The place to go out for the night is in the hills, thats were the woman are, only to reach on a motorbike. If it rains you cannot go down, i did and of course had an accident.

@Enzyte Bob

I just got back from the Philippines where I met my fiance.

You seem knowledgeable.

Do I need to do anything before her first immigration appointment for the fiance visa?

Thanks

karpinchuck said. . . .I just got back from the Philippines where I met my fiance.
You seem knowledgeable.
Do I need to do anything before her first immigration appointment for the fiance visa?
Thanks 

****************************************

There are many people on this forum that are knowledgeable about fiance' visas, I am not one of them. So I'm sure some will give you valuable advice.

My only other advice, you implied you met your fiance, if this was the first time, go slow about marriage when she visits the USA.

@ukdan

I agree with Lotus on this one - never a concern for my safety other than once in a remote area (my fault for stopping) - but no crime, no pickpockets, nothing but friendly interactions with Filipinos. I don't drink, hangout in bars, or walk the streets at night though, so I do not present myself as a target. We are in bed by 9 or 10pm most nights.

Meet her but do not go to her province - meet in neutral territory and get to know her - assess the trust level. If she wants to jump in the sack right away it's probably a warning sign. Not necessarily to get you thrown in jail, but because they love to find newbies to the PI and "lock it down".. Keep your wits about you. A large hotel would be the safest - just make sure you pay for her transportation.

I have never really understood the advice to avoid all separated women - heck a good percentage of FIlipinas have been married and/or have kids, and in some ways that's better - more maturity, etc. Mine was in her early 30's, separated.. and I haven't been killed or thrown in jail yet - it's been a great adventure. But you really need to understand the situation. Where is the ex, the children if any, her work, etc. When they separate they often live in different cities and avoid each other.

I've been with her for several years Annulment almost done after 5 years, lol (pandemic slowdown), and she told me up front that she was separated. No threats from the ex, who lives in another city, no contact, no issues. Helping raise her two boys has been absolutely amazing (I never had kids of my own). For the first few years we did live in a gated complex with armed guards. Not necessarily for security - I just loved the city and ocean views, and gardens, but it did add a layer of security.

I agree with the advice to not fall in love, but that's impossible for some of us - the women are so beautiful and naturally sexy - my girl wears no makeup and looks like a supermodel, although shorter, haha. And she works like a dog cleaning, cooking, gardening.. loves travel and adventure - I am quite happy with how it has all turned out and have zero regrets. Just be vigilant and do not rush into things.

karpinchuck said. . . .I just got back from the Philippines where I met my fiance.
You seem knowledgeable.
Do I need to do anything before her first immigration appointment for the fiance visa?
Thanks ****************************************
There are many people on this forum that are knowledgeable about fiance' visas, I am not one of them. So I'm sure some will give you valuable advice.

My only other advice, you implied you met your fiance, if this was the first time, go slow about marriage when she visits the USA.
-@Enzyte Bob

You just met her and you are planning to bring her to the US already? Yikes. You never really know someone until you've spent a year with them. In person. Anyone can be on their best behavior, or hide a current or ex bf/husband, or kids, for a few weeks. In the Philippines, this is especially common.

I chatted to the better half online for 6 months while working here for 6 months, we kept chatting when I went back to Australia and a few months later I flew back to Manila to meet, we lived in a condo for a year and during that time we applied for a partnership visa, successful, he lived and worked in Oz with me for 6+ years and then we retired back here, 12 or 13 years together.

Safety comes with awareness of your surroundings and who you interact with. only once did I have a problem with 2 guys following me in Naga 13 years ago and I wasn't aware, a lovely lady walking near me warned me, I went to a security guard at the first bank I came across and told him,,,, the guys disappeared, Always alert since then.

All countries have their dangers if you are not aware or venture where you shouldn't.

The Phills are no different to other countries but to the OP and OMO but your dangers lay getting involved with a married woman here, not so bad in other countries.

Cheers, Steve.

@G0BAU Thank you for the comprehensive answer. Sobering stuff. It is a bit of a wake-up call. I was told that there is a change coming soon hopefully. Not sure if that is correct.

@karpinchuck I went through the K1 fiancé process in 2007. At that time it was important to prove you visited the Philippines and met in person (unless you are disabled) so save all your travel evidence. It is a good idea to send valentine's day and birthday cards and have her save them. She was asked for photos showing the love and the folks on the forum I belonged to at that time suggested having some photos without sunglasses etc. Take lots of photos. We hired a guy named Ray Bacon to do all our paperwork and make sure things were in order.

When the time came for her physical at St. Lukes and her interview I timed it so I arrived after the physical but before the interview so I could personally attend the interview. I figured it would be the best use of the vacation time I had available since my goal was to bring her home with me, and it worked. At that time in my life my credit rating was very low due to my first wife's not paying bills, unbeknownst to me. The lady who conducted the interview mentioned my low credit rating. I was surprised they checked credit ratings, but it didn't affect anything. Good luck.

@Ivo sonnenberg Thank you for the feedback Ivo

@pnwcyclist Thank you for the feedback appreciate the time you took

@bigpearl Thanking you for the time to give me feedback

@ukdan ask her to meet you in Manila.

@sekmet Good advice..

Thank you, everybody, for all the advice. I was totally unaware of these things. Somebody said if the ex lives in another part of the country far away and it seems Ilocos is some way away from where she lives it should be fine, but the majority of the advice is not to go to her hometown first and best to meet in Manila. Safety in numbers I suppose.

@bigpearl Steve, I did do some research as you suggested and stumbled on this from the daily mail. [link moderated] truly bizarre that this can be happening

[link moderated]

ukdan said . . . .Hi everybody- new here. Dan from London. I have a question about safety in Php.
I met this fantastic woman from Lucena online and want to visit her at the end of this month. I was thinking of taking a bus or Taxi to a resort close to Lucena where we will spend a few nights together before I return to Manila.

*****************************************************

Many people will meet fantastic women online. Why are they fantastic? Because they tell you everything you want to hear.

Spend a few nights together? . . . .That's something expats like to hear.

Let me remind you, you are not sipping wine in a hot tube but rather swimming for your life in this encounter.

ukdan said . . . .Hi everybody- new here. Dan from London. I have a question about safety in Php.
I met this fantastic woman from Lucena online and want to visit her at the end of this month. I was thinking of taking a bus or Taxi to a resort close to Lucena where we will spend a few nights together before I return to Manila.*****************************************************
Many people will meet fantastic women online. Why are they fantastic? Because they tell you everything you want to hear.

Spend a few nights together? . . . .That's something expats like to hear.

Let me remind you, you are not sipping wine in a hot tube but rather swimming for your life in this encounter.
-@Enzyte Bob

Yeah swimming in a shark infested ocean

The Philippines seemed like the best place to meet the one-and-only woman of my dreams; I had never been married. I corresponded with a lot of Filipinas from FilipinoCupid (200-line spreadsheet), and arranged to meet about 20 young beauties in Manila, Cebu and Dumaguete. Only 7 were available, although most had confirmed with texts a day or so before.

One seemed particularly nice, and I went back to see her in Manila with the extra time I had. We drove with her two daughters to Tagaytay, and had a charmed day. I fell in love with her by chatting almost every day after I got back to LA (she initiated the chatting).

Three months later, we met in NAIA and caught a flight to Boracay, where I was unable to resist her charms (I actually tried for 45 minutes). We were informally engaged by the act, more formally later.

She lived upstairs in a house she shared with her husband; they were not on speaking terms. That seemed like a bad idea, so I had her move back to Davao near her family. I had no idea about the adultery laws until years later, but was fortunate that nothing happened. It didn’t work out after two years, and we parted friends. She was definitely not after the money; her standard of living decreased substantially when we parted, and her daughters were unhappy that they couldn’t go to the expensive school they loved.

I moved to the Philippines a year later. In Angeles City, I took the opportunity to "interview” many young girls, although I knew most were not suitable marriage material—but hey, they were ⅓ my age (mid 70’s) and lots of fun. But I occasionally looked on FilipinoCupid, and finally found one.

My next fiancée was a widow from the provinces who checked every box—except one. She had mental issues that caused us to break up (mostly me deciding I could not live with that instability), and proved it by faking her suicide after we parted. I believed she was dead for two weeks. My friends here told me not to believe it, because apparently it is not uncommon for spurned lovers to do this.

Others warned me to move, because the spurned lovers have been known to have their ex's bumped off, As was mentioned, life is cheap here. So if I suddenly stop posting, you’ll know what happened 🤗 😜

So be careful!!

Seems like you need to be careful bidwizard big time.

OMO.

Cheers, Steve.

Bizwizard said. . . So if I suddenly stop posting, you’ll know what happened 🤗 😜
***************************************

Yes your new loved cleaned you out and you have no money to activate your internet account again.

@bizwizard

If you haven't already bizwizard and with your judgment I would consider taking out a life insurance policy if you have any dependants back home. Oh and don't tell the next 'beauty' you meet about it that you become besotted with and include her as a beneficiary. Know what I mean ?

Enzyte Bob said... Yes your new loved cleaned you out and you have no money to activate your internet account again.

**************************************

Hardly. Of course I invested some money in her over the seven months we were together, but not even close to "cleaning me out." Or even touching my "nest egg." Believe it or not, I have been around the block a few times here, including some minor scams nipped in the bud, so I know many of the early warning signals. And i have friends who are not as judgemental as the denizens of this website to give me advice.

-------------------

Yeah, all my life I've leaped before I looked. So far, all my limbs are intact. Some major financial losses in the past, of course, due the the high quality of my judgement, but recoveries followed. And I have a very good life today.

Still looking for that special Filipina....

Enzyte Bob said... Yes your new loved cleaned you out and you have no money to activate your internet account again.
**************************************
Hardly. Of course I invested some money in her over the seven months we were together, but not even close to "cleaning me out." Or even touching my "nest egg." Believe it or not, I have been around the block a few times here, including some minor scams nipped in the bud, so I know many of the early warning signals. And i have friends who are not as judgemental as the denizens of this website to give me advice.
-------------------
Yeah, all my life I've leaped before I looked. So far, all my limbs are intact. Some major financial losses in the past, of course, due the the high quality of my judgement, but recoveries followed. And I have a very good life today.

Still looking for that special Filipina....
-@bizwizard

So why are you here on an expat site whining  instead of crying on your friends big shoulders? Perhaps they won't be so judgmental and you can get on with the next conquest? Then the next?

Maybe Thailand will be easier?

OMO.

Cheers, Steve.

@bizwizard

That is an interesting story. If you want advice I would suggest looking for a retired nurse or school teacher. Someone with plenty of patience.

@bizwizard
That is an interesting story. If you want advice I would suggest looking for a retired nurse or school teacher. Someone with plenty of patience.
-@Moon Dog

Agreed. Plenty on the online dating site Cherry Blossoms.

As I understand it the founder of this site was so impressed with his due diligence and the innocence & trustworthiness of its Filipina members that he gave it the name Cherry for a very good reason.

Bizwizard said . . . .I have been around the block a few times here, including some minor scams nipped in the bud, so I know many of the early warning signals. And i have friends who are not as judgemental as the denizens of this website to give me advice.
*

*

*

*

Still looking for that special Filipina....

****************************************************

(1) What block was that?

(2) So you know many of the warning signals, yet you run all the stop signs.

(3) Your non judgemental friends are from walking street?

(4) Why come to this website for advice?

(5) Keep looking for that special Filipina, she is looking for somebody special like you.

@ukdan That is in principiple correct. The husband can file adultry charges. There is a bureau in the Philippines in every town but i forgot the name were you can get the marriage status on every woman. That proceeding has also a name but i also forgot. If that Husband however lives himself with an other woman and possible has children with her, he wont get true with the charges. But you will have to prove that. and for you going true the barangays asking questions, you or get lied to or they take you apart. If you live with a Filipina and her children who was not married before, and you take care and feed her children you can file charges against the father who does not support his children and get your monney back. You will never get it cause he will have you shot wich is much cheaper as paying your bills. The best thing is to not go at all with married woman to stay on the secure side, and if you start any relationship check her background first. Every Filipino and Filipina can tell you the name of wich bureau you should go to. I have done it myself, its not expensive. Best is to take the woman and go there together. I did. So she can present an ID, it can be done without her presence and ID but its more difficult, you need to know her exact name and that of her parents, and were they all live. my advice, love them and leave them. Stay away from married woman. In fact Filipinas are beautyfull but highly dangerous. They offen belong, are the property of fraternaties being send out to prey on you, you can see that on the scars on their legs were they were beating while trained. Or they are police assets comming to you with the local drug shabu, if you do that, you will end up in prisson. If you have sex with those assets afterwards the police will rush them to a hospital to get prove of that sex. My advise? Forget about Lucena go fisching instead.
-@Ivo sonnenberg

What you need is the :

Certificate of No Marriage Record  (CENOMAR)

prior getting involved in any serious relationship here & costs approx 400p

Bizwizard - Most of what you have described has also happened to me, fake suicide and the married woman.

I have to admit that I did not know that it was not possible to get a divorce for filipinos over there until I read on this forum and investigated further and was duped a couple of times myself.

My ex also got her sister to message me to say she had committed suicide but I had my doubts right from the start and I even emailed my ex the same day I was told. The sister was not a very good liar and when the message popped up from her saying (THERE IS A PROBLEM), then the alarm bells got louder. I could imagine the problem, no money to bury her, people wanting to attend the funeral, costs for a big goodbye do, food, drink, etc.

I have learnt that you need to walk away from the woman if needed no matter how deep your feelings are for her. That is another thing, we go over to the Philippines for a few weeks to meet a woman and the relationship is accelerated by about 50 times. If we meet a woman in our own country we maybe see them 2 or 3 times a week for the first 3 to 6 months, take our time, spend other days with family and friends or play golf or indulge in whatever hobbies we have. Over there it is 24/7 for 2 or 3 weeks and we feel the need to rush things. Of course this is not helped when your filipina clings onto you and does not let you out of her sight.

Bizwizard - Most of what you have described has also happened to me, fake suicide and the married woman.
I have to admit that I did not know that it was not possible to get a divorce for filipinos over there until I read on this forum and investigated further and was duped a couple of times myself.

My ex also got her sister to message me to say she had committed suicide but I had my doubts right from the start and I even emailed my ex the same day I was told. The sister was not a very good liar and when the message popped up from her saying (THERE IS A PROBLEM), then the alarm bells got louder. I could imagine the problem, no money to bury her, people wanting to attend the funeral, costs for a big goodbye do, food, drink, etc.

I have learnt that you need to walk away from the woman if needed no matter how deep your feelings are for her. That is another thing, we go over to the Philippines for a few weeks to meet a woman and the relationship is accelerated by about 50 times. If we meet a woman in our own country we maybe see them 2 or 3 times a week for the first 3 to 6 months, take our time, spend other days with family and friends or play golf or indulge in whatever hobbies we have. Over there it is 24/7 for 2 or 3 weeks and we feel the need to rush things. Of course this is not helped when your filipina clings onto you and does not let you out of her sight.
-@Cherryann01

Salient points Cherryanne.

On my earlier business visits to Manila I stayed at the Mandarin Oriental hotel. On one occasion I was there for 3 weeks. Heck the hotel even printed me ‘In House’ business cards which came in useful but not for business purposes.

Meetings during the day and every night I would hit Café Havana in Greenbelt. Mondays were like Saturday nights here. 💃 My eye was taken by an attractive Salsa dancer there. It turned out she worked for an international advertising agency in Makati as a P.A. We’d only been dating for two days and she moved into my hotel room. Turned up with a hold-all one evening unexpectedly. She said she wanted to look after me while in the city. Never again.