Advice to anyone thinking about moving to Portugal

I didn't find the article, but I agree that an international move shouldn't be a spontaneous decision, but based on verified facts. Our reasons for coming to Portugal are still valid after almost 10 years. However, I have seen quite a few foreigners leave Portugal frustrated after some time.

https://edition.cnn.com/travel/us-coupl … index.html

@JohnnyPT

Many thanks

Thanks for posting that, Johnny!

It sounded a little ill considered to me.  It's probably harder to get away with that in France, than here - I don't know if you'd find the family doctor or the frozen yogurt in the English-speaking enclaves in the Algarve, but you'd have people to talk to.

Foreign countries are foreign, particularly when the language is different.  I'll probably never really be at home the way I was in America - with time maybe something a little like it, but not the same.  I suppose a lot of people wouldn't like that.

Though an "newspaper" article so not written by themselves in their own words Shirley it is a bit naive (arrogant?)  to expect to live in France deal with administration, integrate etc.  without speaking and understanding some French.   Seems a bit like they are blaming France for being French.

There's one thing: the French may be friendly, but they hate speaking any language other than French in their own country... Most often they don't even bother trying to understand you.

@JohnnyPT

I think this is true for all big countries, just thinking of e.g. Germany, France, Italy and Spain. The Netherlands and Scandinavia are easier because more people speak English. And Portugal is great as well (as long as one stays in Lisbon, Porto or the Algarve).

Overall, I doubt that it is a good idea to become an expat very late in life. Me and my wife are used to it for over 30 years, but I guess I wouldn't change countries for the first time in life at 70.

@Strontium

I agree. I have said it before on this forum about trying to learn Portuguese. It will increase ones quality of life here hugely. When I did my citizenship language test I was amazed at how many people had studied and were taking the exam. Kudos to everyone, only one person didn't pass.

Two good examples with expats in 2024: Good integration with local communities, far away from main cities and expat clusters:

Northern Portugal, harvests on a family farm

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=7yUNuScyPn4

Central Portugal, annual festival in a small village and socialising with neighbours

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jVjqDXUfZGQ

https://www.now-health.com/en/blog/cult … ck-stages/

https://www.now-health.com/en/blog/cult … ck-stages/ - @Santi2

If you didn't  know that's an "ad" from a company selling insurance rather them an objective opinion so MAY be biased to get readers to purchace their product(s). Obviously I'd not even hint you may be one of their sales persons. 

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cu … vironment.

https://www.investopedia.com/terms/c/cu … vironment.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Culture_shock

And before you surmise, no, I do not sell anything on investopedia or Wikipedia.

What do you sell?

Visa experts, Portuguese language trainers, realtors ready to assist you in your moving to dreamland, coaches, helpers, advisors...all salivating to take advantage of naive would be expats.

Visa experts, Portuguese language trainers, realtors ready to assist you in your moving to dreamland, coaches, helpers, advisors...all salivating to take advantage of naive would be expats. - @Santi2

It is definitely ONE purpose of those immigrating to Portugal to make money for those residing in the country already. The immigrants are supposed to bring money, not take money. Is anybody surprised?

@Perpetual_traveler

Thanks for drawing attention to this. Expectations and reality won't match specially when people fail to prepare & research properly before the big move.

In Portugal, 60% of expats give up and leave before 2 years in the country, some of the remaining 40% will also leave later.

Reasons? There are many but the most glaring are that they failled to check the tax implications of being a resident in Portugal.

In the CNN articles about US citizens moving to France and Italy, the disappointments stemmed from the lack of correct preparation, learning the language at basic level before moving, checking the tax implication, and that they could meet all the requirements to get residency visas.

A US expat living in Portugal for several years said in his Youtube channel that most US citizens he knows moved to Portugal without realizing there are tax implications and when they are aready there and hear about portuguese tax, they go: Tax? What tax? I'm american.

@Mariza.says

Very good points and interesting stats!

To be honest, now that the NHR is gone, if you don't have it I question the sense of coming to Portugal. Not because it isn't an amazing country - which it is - but aside from that tax implications now, the accommodation situation is so difficult. And then, factor in the bureaucratic problems just getting smoothly settled via AIMA etc. It's hard enough for those already here, so for prospective immigrants with stars in their eyes, I don't know if its worth it.

Many countries are starting to make it harder via setting the bar higher. Look at Spain, now you will have to prove 4x Required Annual Amount (4x Euro37k = Euro150k upfront) if what I am hearing is correct, at least in some areas - and you can be sure that those areas are the ones that people mainly want to go to.

@@Mariza.says

I don't understand where you got these statistics.... probably from the agency that gave the victory to Kamala Harris.... There are many expats who stay in the country and don't leave after 2 years. Many stay after 10 years of NHR, even subject to taxes. With regard to American expats, saying ‘Tax? What tax? I'm American’ is ridiculous to say the least and labels them as stupid. Anyway... There's always a little bit of fun in this terrible world of wars....

I have to admit that we were a little unprepared for our tax this first year, clueless Americans that we are.  It's possible that it didn't really have to be that gigantic and the tax prep guy just missed a bet, but in any case, this is how life is in the country we have come to.  Tax is heavy.  Would we like to go back to America where the tax is less?  Ha ha, no.  It seems unlikely to me that this is really so often a motivating factor.  If you have such a big tax bill, it's because you're pulling in a lot of money, so ... is there a real problem here?

The reasons featured in the CNN articles seem more compelling to me.   Or to look at it another way:  if living in a foreign country is just to save money, then sure, most people won't last long on that program.