opening cafe

As gloriously innocent as that post was, and I mean this in the nicest possible way, that you need to do some real research before you get too far down the line.

Once you decide you want to jump through the hoops I can honestly guarantee you a one step approach to generating a small fortune in a cafe or coffee shop in Vietam.

Ready?

1. Start with a large fortune.

That's it in a nutshell.  24% of small businesses here close each year.  After three years  only 30% of the businesses are still open.  And, almost all of those were owned by Vietnamese.  Your chances dwindle quickly as a foriegner.  If your business is going poorly you will go under.  If somehow it's doing well I assure you your Vietnamese neighbors that also have cafes - and there will be others as you can't swing a dead cat around here without hitting yet another cafe or coffee shop - will find a way to get the green shirts to visit you often enough that you are ready to give up.

Dave25e wrote:

Hi,
I want to open small cafe in Saigon.
Where can I find rental offers for that kind of business?
Cheers

Why?

Hi Dave -

Opening and operating a cafe in Sai Gon may be difficult, but certainly, it is possible as there are already a significant number of foreign-owned F&B businesses around.

However, it is definitely not the most original business idea.

In terms of rentals, it seems you would need to follow the same procedure that is used in most countries:
find and contact a number of *reputable* real estate/rental agencies and caveat emptor.

Unfortunately, I can't offer a recommendation.
There is a "housing" section on this website where you might start:

https://www.expat.com/en/housing/asia/vietnam/saigon/

Alternatively, you can look around for signs that say "cho thuê" (for rent) and call the phone numbers provided.

Last time I was in Sai Gon, I saw many.

If you set up a coffee shop now , I think that's a great idea, because the rental cost is lower than before the pandemic covid and it's easy to find a good place as well.
However you should combine to sell drinking and talking english ( a little bit english) that attract more customers.

monny.nguyen wrote:

If you set up a coffee shop now , I think that's a great idea, because the rental cost is lower than before the pandemic covid and it's easy to find a good place as well.
However you should combine to sell drinking and talking english ( a little bit english) that attract more customers.

Combining any food or beverage place with a grocery store (tạp hóa) of any size has been very successful for some people during the pandemic.

During the summer 2020 lockdown in Đà Nẵng, all coffee shops, cafes and restaurants were closed by the government.

At one point, even carry out food and delivery were forbidden.

However, tạp hóa and convenience stores were allowed to remain open as "essential".

Those tạp hóa which were combined with food and/or beverage services were the only places people could get prepared food or coffee.

That should have been illegal, but the police were aware and didn't stop the activity.

monny.nguyen wrote:

If you set up a coffee shop now , I think that's a great idea, because the rental cost is lower than before the pandemic covid and it's easy to find a good place as well.
However you should combine to sell drinking and talking english ( a little bit english) that attract more customers.

The last thing HCMC needs is another coffee shop!!

goodolboy wrote:

monny.nguyen wrote:

If you set up a coffee shop now , I think that's a great idea, because the rental cost is lower than before the pandemic covid and it's easy to find a good place as well.
However you should combine to sell drinking and talking english ( a little bit english) that attract more customers.

The last thing HCMC needs is another coffee shop!!

Really? It's possible to have too many coffee shops? Who knew?

Quite an amazing thread. Or maybe I should say humorous. “where can I find rental offers”....my word, be careful when your out and about as the for rent signs nearly block your path of travel, be it walking or motorbike. “ That is a good idea, because the rental cost is lower then before the pandemic”. Hmmmm, I wonder how much profit the people who vacated the property made off the rental costs. Back where I come from profits come from customers buying your product, not admiring your cheap rent. The fact of the matter, few are spending money. Not many things are booming now except police work. So, get that cheap rent and set there and watch the sun come up and go down and not a customer in sight.
“ Grocery stores of any size have been very successful.....” Hmmmm  , no mention of what the view of successful is. I kinda wonder how people can pass by any business and determine how successful it is. Maybe this person has access to their books. Reminds me of the time we offered “free” to the first 100 customers. I bet folks thought we were real successful.  But often people equate success to the strangest things. He drives a Mercedes S500. I had a successful customer like the once. The VP of Deloitte and Touch Accounting. Ran his credit for a loan and he could not have borrowed to buy one potato. Owed every casino in the world. His credit report printed for 45 minutes.
I did not find it terribly difficult to start a business with the government red tape. The troubles start after that. Completely different set of values here. You have the privilege  of having them work for you. They have the right to come to work when they wish, take off on emergency time for a wedding twice a month, grandmother dies once a month. Celebrate all family deaths about once a month. Spend days and days at the tax department doing nothing. Oh buy the way, let me train you....oh by the way I will do it my way no matter what you say. Clean, hygiene....sir I don’t understand. But fortunately I am a hard ass and we have a successful business and I have tons of gray hair. Good luck with the coffee shop. I have been looking for months for one. So far no luck. But great business when there are no customers. Try to find a print shop that can print you a sign “ coffee shop for sale cheap...and OBTW cheap rent to.” Good laugh though.


‘

This week my wife spent 2 full days at the tax department to satisfy our quarterly reporting. Quick trip this time. But that was due to the fact we have been closed and listed as inactive due to covid for a year. Just one of those things that drive one crazy about business here. But worse then taxes is they do not allow for deduction of expenses. So everything that goes through the register is treated as income.
And then there is the red tax stamp. Not something I want to discuss here. But what a cluster that is.
So have fun all you business seeking souls.!😝

And now the government is cracking down, again, on Western named business’ or Western names on the signs. Now the want you to use the following convention....American Burgers would read A-M-E-R-I-C-A-N    B-U-R-G-E-R-S. Pretty hefty fine as well. But a lawyer can get you around it. That or get an international trademark, which is allowed by the Madrid Treaty, which Vietnam is a signature to. Always exciting business twists and turns. Just as much of life is here. Nothing stays static for long.
This may have been initiated by the same committee that came up with the street naming convention in VN. Not a real forward thinking group of folks. They pondered this one and decided street would be named after famous military and government official. They never quite did the math on how limiting this would be. Not a whole lot of famous folks, as compared to the number of street. But hey it is better then the building numbering system I suppose.

Diazo wrote:

This may have been initiated by the same committee that came up with the street naming convention in VN. Not a real forward thinking group of folks. They pondered this one and decided street would be named after famous military and government official. They never quite did the math on how limiting this would be. Not a whole lot of famous folks, as compared to the number of street. But hey it is better then the building numbering system I suppose.

There are tons of famous folks and their names were used on the streets for decades already, but as history is not just written but also rewritten by the victors, a great majority of those names and historical figures were erased from history and from life. 

Before '75, street naming was consulted and advised by historians.  All the street names in Saigon followed a system which denoted the corresponding areas.  By saying any street name, everyone knew the names of all the streets surrounding it.  The literature laureates, the scientists, the folk heroes, the country founding fathers, the martyrs, the philosophers,  the royals, etc, all of them have their own areas in which the streets were connected to one another and there's a definitive logic on the connection. 

House numbers were also very clear as they followed the formula of "even on the right, odd on the left" starting from the center of Saigon and extending to all side streets in the same method.

All of that went out the window when brain, capability, and education are no longer essential to the running of government departments.

Ciambella wrote:

Diazo wrote:

This may have been initiated by the same committee that came up with the street naming convention in VN. Not a real forward thinking group of folks. They pondered this one and decided street would be named after famous military and government official. They never quite did the math on how limiting this would be. Not a whole lot of famous folks, as compared to the number of street. But hey it is better then the building numbering system I suppose.

There are tons of famous folks and their names were used on the streets for decades already, but as history is not just written but also rewritten by the victors, a great majority of those names and historical figures were erased from history and from life. 

Before '75, street naming was consulted and advised by historians.  All the street names in Saigon followed a system which denoted the corresponding areas.  By saying any street name, everyone knew the names of all the streets surrounding it.  The literature laureates, the scientists, the folk heroes, the country founding fathers, the martyrs, the philosophers,  the royals, etc, all of them have their own areas in which the streets were connected to one another and there's a definitive logic on the connection. 

House numbers were also very clear as they followed the formula of "even on the right, odd on the left" starting from the center of Saigon and extending to all side streets in the same method.

All of that went out the window when brain, capability, and education are no longer essential to the running of government departments.

Nepotism seems to be the biggest problem with the govt here. Too many unqualified clowns in positions they know very little about.

Did not wish to denigrate anyone. Just my opinion things were not well thought out and resulted in a mess. And even in trying to correct the mess they made it worse e.g. renumbering to try and correct and leaving the old number. So now you have 104 Ba Thang Hai and old 607 Ba Than Hai. I wonder what they thought the intended reason for an address was. Thank goodness for Google. Can you imagine navigating here w/o it.

For those wanting to open a business and would need to hire employees it may be the most difficult part of being in business here. Employees seem to approach the relationship like you work for them and not that they work for you. One would think during these covid times and so many out of work one would have no problem hiring. I think it is harder now than it has ever been. Few are able to hire at all. That said, they have, in general very poor work ethics. That is assuming you can hire someone. But from jump street they come to the interview with a list of qualification you must meet. For example,  your hours are 8-5. Well sorry, I only work from 9-3. If you expect them to come to work on time, you should know that is not always possible. Depends on what they did last night or what they did not do....like put gas in their vehicle. They will have many emergency weddings to attend. They might tell you the night before. Then again they may tell you on e they return wanting a job. There are a litany of funerals to attend , or observations of the deceased relative. Moreover there is no need to tell you in advance. Like they just found out the great great grandfather died 90 years ago on this day. And they must be allowed to talk on their phones and play video games on your dime. And do not set standards of compliance, e.g. restaurant hygiene etc. They will do it their way thank you. I always wondered why businesses hire an Army of people to talk on their phones all day when there are few or no customers. You have to because maybe only a third will show up on any given day. Unfortunate for the future employment desires, but we now try to automate and reduce the number of employees we need. In fairness, it seems to me that the older generations are good dependable workers in many ways. But even still, do not expect them to tell you of any time off they need.