Community and a sense of belonging

Since 2015, I've spend more than half my life living in Thailand... from Krabi to Chiang Mai... Bangkok, Jomtien Beach and more...
I've never felt a sense of belonging... expat crowds are often not my cuppa tea... Thai people don't want to know me... I've NEVER been invited to a thai home for a meal or drink...

In Mexico... Again about 5 years there... I absolutely felt part of the community. I got invited often to homes.. Some near strangers.. Parties.. Coffee air a meal. Mexicans chat with me and want to know me.

Have you found a place in Thailand where you feel a connection... a sense of belonging... a community that welcomed you?
-@1happykamper

"Since 2015, I've spent more than half my life living in Thailand."??

2015 is just 8 years ago. What do you actually mean?

Before I settled down for good in Thailand years ago,I was around since 1989. I have visited many Thai homes and been invited for lunch,dinner, parties or just drinking while watching sports on tv numerous times. Maybe you should take a minute or two and try to figure out why Thai people "don't want to know you".

Dear Sir, if you stay in tourist places where the majority of people are farang , you will probably never met Thai people . If you live in the countryside in small villages and if you speak Thai even only nitnoy, it will probably be different .

Have ever invited Thai people to your home . A vas-y majority of Thai people is modest and shy …

@Leeds forever! Sorry.. Poor English... Half my time since 2015 in Thailand

Since 2015, I've spend more than half my life living in Thailand... from Krabi to Chiang Mai... Bangkok, Jomtien Beach and more...
I've never felt a sense of belonging... expat crowds are often not my cuppa tea... Thai people don't want to know me... I've NEVER been invited to a thai home for a meal or drink...

In Mexico... Again about 5 years there... I absolutely felt part of the community. I got invited often to homes.. Some near strangers.. Parties.. Coffee air a meal. Mexicans chat with me and want to know me.

Have you found a place in Thailand where you feel a connection... a sense of belonging... a community that welcomed you?
-@1happykamper

You're comparing two very different cultures.

In general, Asian culture is highly collectivist (group-oriented), and the fear of "losing face" is quite strong. Usually, they need to be familiar with someone first, then there is less risk involved with socialising. Even then, most likely the meeting is going to be outside, not in their home.

Obviously, there needs to be some common ground as well, usually watching football, Thai boxing, etc. and/or drinking, or maybe live music.

Anyway, as mentioned, you probably need to take the first step by creating an opportunity, for example, by asking for a recommendation for a good Thai restaurant. Then, the person may respond by inviting you to their favorite place. Thais are rightly proud of their food, so they wouldn't worry so much about "face" in this case.

You can read up on culture shock in Thailand for more information.

@1happykamper Thais don't trust strangers, whether foreigners or Thais. When they smile, they do so in self-defense, afraid that a stranger might not be honest. This fear is fueled by governments to keep people under control. Compare it to the earlier conditions in East Germany, everyone was afraid of everyone else that someone would report you to the Stasi if they didn't like you. In Thailand, some strange laws have led to this situation. The good thing is, eventually they trust you, but you have to prove it first.

@Ralf Bachmann thanks Ralk.

I agree with these thoughts and it does explain a lot. I remember telling a monk. during my first year here.. "ohh, Thai people are so kind and friendly"

... to which he replied.. "NO Thai are scared and suppressed".

Yikes

@Ralf Bachmann

How can you compare Thailand to post war East Germany ?

Of course they don’t spontaneously trust farang in tourists zone and they are right !

So many crazy westerners come to Thailand only for drug, party, sex and are totally idiots …

@Ralf Bachmann

I have been invited to many party by Thaimpeople I even did not know before only because I was a friend with a Thaï guy or lady .

If you don’t trust me I can Evan send pictures where I am the only farang among 20 or 30 thaïs.

Be cool , talk to them , show them you respect them , you love their country , food , culture , participate to Buddhist events in town or in temples . I am Buddhist and I was a monk in the past . When they see my pictures , ice does not exist anymore

@1happykamper

I find that very interesting I always thought Thai

people were the friendliest people on earth. It

is nick named "The Land of Smiles" I believe

they have an airline Thai Smile Airways.

It has never failed if I smiled at a Thai person

they have always smiled. Now I am learning

it is for completely different reasons.  ??

It's the language barrier foremost.  Very different from my Philippines experience.

@scbrock I have lived here since 2013 and have not developed any Thai friends except though family connections. I find they are shy, not outgoing, keep to themselves. Yes they are friendly on the surface but I have never been asked to someone’s house. I always try to be the one to start the conversation but it always end with just that. I used to own. Food business in California so am used to being around lots of outgoing people and having lots of invites for dinner or outings. But Thai people are all about family and not so much about letting in foreigners into their lives.  Am in my 70’s now and after Covid came I stopped traveling so much. My wife is Thai but we met in the US more than 30 years ago. Had a wonderful life there but we always knew we would retire in Thailand. But that is one big thing that I miss about living in Thailand.  And it has taken a big chuck of happiness out of my life. Of course not speaking Thai well doesn’t help am sure. Patrick

To be honest I have real reservations about Thai

people being scared of gov and the smile is all

a front to hide how they really feel.

I can believe they may be somewhat intimidated

of foreigners because of a very different standard

of living and such but to say they all live in fear that

may be someone's opinion I just don't happen to share

it.

I have seen Thai people genuinely scared on a few

occaisons but it's when a foreigner gets mad about

something and the Thai believes there is going to be

trouble.

I'll give a quick example a Thai lady ran into

my car and she said she would pay for it. And she paid

a good portion of it. But at the body shop I discovered

additional damage that wasn't on the original estimate

and my thai friend was siding with the other thai lady

claiming that it was unrelated and I started to get angry.

The look on the bodyshop managers face said it all. He

was turning red and scared. Genuine fear. I believe it's

because in this very sedate Buddhist culture anger is

rarely shown and people are very unaccustomed to it

and don't know how to repond to it.

IMHO

Thai are the best, And so easy going.

Back when i was here on my one trip to Thailand, Before moving here.

I 5 or 6 times was stop by Thai on motor bike when i was out walking.

They think i was mad for walking in the sun :-)

Even so they did not speak English and me not Thai, That was clear.

Then they take me around show me thing in the area for hours, explain a lot.

That i didn´t understand, But i still have a great time.

When i let them know i was hungry, I was invite to there home, Where the people back there have made a feast of food for us to eat, And they have invited people from the street to come and meet me.

Some times there was people there that speak some to good English, Other times no one spoke English.

But it was NEVER a problem.

My first Christmas after moving to Thailand, Was first time in 42 years away from my family.

I was a bit sad onto i open the door to go for my morning walk, Where most of the people from the little Soi i rent a townhouse on, Was singing (Trying) Christmas song for me, And give me small gift like fruit, dessert, homemade dessert and home made food.

Everywhere I/we go Thai want to talk to me, Every time we go stay somewhere, Thai people invite us to join them for talk, Eat food or what every.

I love Thai have a open mind about foreigner and dont fear us.

I come from a country where most Danish people FEAR foreigner big time.

I made like 15-17 good Thai Friends before leaving Thailand from my trip here.

And i still have good contact with 7-8 of them, And think i might have made 30 new Thai friends since i move here.

Add my wife big big family onto that, Og her big big friends ground, Og her friends family.

I have more Thai family and Thai friends then i every have back home :-)

I have so many good stories about Thai people i meet everywhere.

And nearly 13 years here, And not a single one have turn bad, Or being the Thai trying to do a number on me.

I do think that no speaking the same Language is a poor excuse.

Kindly.

I have lived here since 2013 and have not developed any Thai friends except though family connections.   

Well said.

I'm in Thailand 20 years.

Now comfortably fluent in the language.

Even with that, all my experience agrees with @thailand4me's  comments.

@1happykamper ...
I've never felt a sense of belonging... expat crowds are often not my cuppa tea... Thai people don't want to know me... I've NEVER been invited to a thai home for a meal or drink...

Have you found a place in Thailand where you feel a connection... a sense of belonging... a community that welcomed you?

Thank you, @1happy kamper, for opening this topic.

I am 20 years full time in Thailand.

Also NEVER invited into a Thai home.

Have not found any place where I have any social connection.

Either Thai or among my fellow expats.

Acquaintances, sure, but nothing more than that.

Still quite happy living here ... don't know any place else better.

@scbrock

I think Thai people are very kind.. But not friendly or social. Nor are they curious.

@1happykamper

I can't disagree with you to be honest I have made very

few male thai friends. Females on the other hand are

often thinking about improving their situation by

marrying or having a farang boyfriend so they may have

some motivation to be more friendly.

I have noticed that when Thai women reach their 40's

it is much harder to find employment. It seems most

stores and places of commerce want to hire the young

beautiful 25 years olds so they may even want more to

find a life partner.

When you say they are not curious do you mean an intellectual

curiousity about the world or simply learning about

another culture? Maybe that is really one in the same

I believe at times Thai people don't respond or ask questions

because they may be embarassed about not speaking English

very well.

I think Thai people are very kind.. But not friendly or social. Nor are they curious.
    -@1happykamper

That is a neat summary and fits all my observations, too.

Thais are very , very shy with anyone outside of their family.

Even other Thais, it is very rare to invite to their home.

Entertaining is almost always at restaurants.

"Nor are they curious".

So true, and there's a reason for that.

Curiosity (and questions in general) have a very different social meaning for Thais than for Westerners.

Example, if I'm making some food and a friend is visiting, I will offer a taste.

If that friend is Western person, probably very interested to taste the food.

But if Thai person, most do NOT want even a small taste.

They prefer what is familiar to them.

So, to go back to your original post, @1happykamper, one reason we foreigners do not fit into their communities, is some (a lot) of our social behaviour is very different than theirs, very strange to them.

We Westerners like new adventures with new people.

They don't.

I believe at times Thai people don't respond or ask questions
because they may be embarassed about not speaking English
very well.
    -@scbrock

... Embarrased about not speaking English is the convenient excuse they use.

But the fundamental reason is that asking question is considered rude in Thai culture.

They do not value curiosity of any kind.

(Asking, "Where is the toilet?" or "Which way to departure gate 14?" is okay.

But asking "why" about almost anything is very much not okay in their culture.)

So one of the big reasons we don't fit into their community here is our cultural value of curiosity is very strange to them.  Actually quite rude.

So what can we do?  (Even a rethorical question like that is rude.)

What I've learned by observing is this:

#1.  Keep your questions to the absolute minimum.

        Don't use questions as a way to encourage conversation.

        Instead, just say something about yourself, and let them respond.

#2.  Questions are usually "accepted" only among family and close friends.

        If you ask questions of local people outside of that circle, it is likely to

        be considered rude.

#3.  If you really, really want to know something and you are bursting to

        ask about it, preface your question with this statement,

        "I have a question."

         Then wait, patiently, for them to respond.

         Even with that, you are likely to not get an honest or factual answer.

         They will tell you what they think you want to hear.

Welcome to Thailand !

I believe it's because in this very sedate Buddhist culture anger is rarely shown and people are very unaccustomed to itand don't know how to repond to it.     -@scbrock

Very neat summary and a good explanation why it is difficult to get any sense of belonging here.

All my experience agrees with @scbrock's comments.

@smartoil1419

I don't disagree with you but I will say our experiences are very

different. I have a good Thai lady friend and she is happy to

answer questions about her culture. Also, she likes the fact

that I try to learn her language. She was disappointed in a

boyfriend that she had that didn't want to learn her language.

I had a girlfriend that I went to the temples with and she didn't

mind answering questions about Buddhism. We also went to a

few of the festivals such as Loy Krathong and she would explain

to me the whole concept of the holiday

We have had very different experiences. Perhaps it has to do with

what area of Thailand we are in? Most of my experience has been

in Phuket and a little in Bangkok, Hat Yai and Phangnga.

Thai's are a naturally reserved people and this is partially because of their religious beliefs I believe.

They don't particularly like anyone prying into their lives apart from the very basic information which is no different to most.

I have friends in Thai that have been around for 15 and still keep in contact and I imagine we would fall into the same routine of time together when in each others company.

I have a great deal of respect for the culture and their history and well worth the research to see how the culture has arrived at the present day.

Don't forget there's always tomorrow to do something in Thai. 😂

@smartoil1419 same here.  There is a most definite double standard towards farangs.  God forbid you stop one of her family members tryingti svam my wife, the entire family takes the guilty party’s side. nithing wrong they say. Thai culture is not great IMO.  lacks accountability and responsibility and honesty. 

I have lived in 6 Asian countries for at least a year, and only in two of them I failed to create a sense of social belonging to the society: Japan and Thailand.

Well, I was invited to Thai homes a couple of times (by work colleagues, fellow members of an international organisation and even by total strangers), but it did never develop into deeper friendships - as it did in other Asian countries.

For one, many Thais live in cramped places they are not proud of - so are loth to invite you. They also don't invite other Thais - people meet over restaurant meals instead.

I also felt that Thais are less genuinely interested in the rest of the world (which I represent) than the nationalities.

I ended up renting a house together with a Chinese and a Malaysian colleague (both cultures I relate well to) and we had a great time!

I have been living and working in Asian countries for 12 years.

I think I depends the people you meet. Some are interested some are not. Rom my experiences, those interested are the one who have been exposed to foreign by travelling or just meeting people. It makes them more curious.

It is not only a matter of “special” countries or culture.

I felt that in USA to where I have been a couple of years.

Now, I am French, and I need to be honest stating it is the same in my country. Some people are interested with what I have been exposed, some do not express a simple interest. Some like differences, some are simply racists and do not want to hear about foreign matter.

I think, more simply, some people are curious and open minded, some are not. Some believe they are the best in the world and people from a different country have nothing to bring or share.

When you spent (some) time outside your country (not during holidays) it changes you. You become a different person.

I do not want to say I am not French anymore, but I feel different… I am not Asian too (12 years is almost nothing). Maybe more European than French and definitely something between Europe and Asia…

Also, feeling different means it also changes the perception regarding people.

Finally, we must never forget, whatever we are and the experiences we have been exposed, we cannot totally understand different cultures. Everything we see, we think, we feel is interpreted through the filter of our own culture. We cannot remove that, as it is so deeply part of us.

@1happykamper.  I feel the same. they stay .to there selfs,  don’t care about me.  Not at all interested in where I come from.  they live in a bubble.    Don’t know that there is a world outside of Thailand. But the Thai people who have left for work or education are way different. They like to talk & ask questions, but they speak English which helps a lot.

Yeah, Thais do not pick up new neighbors or even colleagues like  for example in the US or some countries in the EU.  In Thailand I have the feeling it is mostly because they do not think there English skills are sufficient they do not seem to worry about your Thai skills though.

My family in law are regular people, workers, they do not speak more than 3 words of English but they still try to communicate with me, the little bit more educated do not try anything.... which I find kind of surprising

With the exception of bar girls