Claiming and keeping NHR while tax resident in two countries

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Member since 04 October 2023

Tim_YMember05 October 2023 21:08:56

I was planning on moving to Lisbon with my family in 15 months. We were delaying the move because my wife is heavily pregnant and I ideally wanted to avoid moving everyone until the new-born was a bit older. However, the NHR is a critical part of the plan, so I am now considering rushing to Portugal on my own, getting a NIF, renting a place with a 12-month contract and getting the NHR this year before it ends. However, I would then return to the UK as soon as it is granted.

I was wondering if there are any implications/problems in claiming tax residency in both countries (from a Portuguese NHR perspective). I know there is a double-taxation treaty, but the UK simply won't accept me temporarily leaving its system, and I am okay with paying taxes in both countries (because the Portuguese tax would be zero anyway).

Could this cause me to lose my NHR? Are there other issues with this plan (from the Portuguese perspective)?

I'm a French and UK citizen, and I currently officially reside in the UK, if this is of relevance.

JohnnyPT Portugal Expert

Member since 23 May 2020

JohnnyPTPortugal Expert06 October 2023 07:18:00

4546

For you to want the NHR, you must have a value-added profession, right? As I've already said, nothing is known yet about the intention to end the NHR. It will probably only be for pensioners. Nothing has been said about the rest of the NHR. Where did you read that tax payments in Portugal would be zero? Inform yourself properly...

With NHR, a special tax rate of 20% applicable to employment and self-employment income derived from a “high value-added activities”.

Rob Evans Member

Member since 06 May 2023

Rob EvansMember06 October 2023 07:27:19

@JohnnyPT If he’s earning via passive income such as dividends, it would be zero right?

Tim_Y Member

Member since 04 October 2023

Tim_YMember06 October 2023 08:08:33

For you to want the NHR, you must have a value-added profession, right? As I've already said, nothing is known yet about the intention to end the NHR. It will probably only be for pensioners. Nothing has been said about the rest of the NHR. Where did you read that tax payments in Portugal would be zero? Inform yourself properly...
With NHR, a special tax rate of 20% applicable to employment and self-employment income derived from a “high value-added activities”.

-@JohnnyPT

As @Rob Evans suggested, I earn money through dividends (I own a business), and my intention was to move to Portugal for its investment opportunities and lifestyle change (for what it's worth, I have little to no interest in real estate).

But more generally, I'm asking outside the context of the NHR ending. I'm just finding myself in a very odd situation where I want to voluntarily (temporarily) waive the rights of a double-tax treaty.

I suspect that someone on this forum may have found themselves moving too early too, and could have ended up in a similar situation.

JohnnyPT Portugal Expert

Member since 23 May 2020

JohnnyPTPortugal Expert06 October 2023 08:22:39

4546

Yes, for NHR there is a tax exemption on foreign-source income (e.g. professional income, rental income, capital gains, interest, dividends, as well as other investment income), provided certain conditions are met.

Regarding the changes to the NHR, wait a few more days for more information.

Sometimes politicians say things, cause a buzz and then nothing happens...

Tim_Y Member

Member since 04 October 2023

Tim_YMember06 October 2023 08:39:53

Yes, for NHR there is a tax exemption on foreign-source income (e.g. professional income, rental income, capital gains, interest, dividends, as well as other investment income), provided certain conditions are met.
Regarding the changes to the NHR, wait a few more days for more information.

Sometimes politicians say things, cause a buzz and then nothing happens...

-@JohnnyPT

lol - I totally agree with you about political statements , but since this is such a critical part of my life plan, I'm trying to prepare for any situation, however unlikely. The first step is always to gather the most information possible.

JohnnyPT Portugal Expert

Member since 23 May 2020

JohnnyPTPortugal Expert06 October 2023 09:12:52

4546

Why not contact a lawyer who specialises in these tax issues to see what is the best option for you? There are many Portuguese lawyers online. You can also get support here:

Solicitors, Lawyers & Administrative division of Portugal:

https://www.expat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?id=941009

Tim_Y Member

Member since 04 October 2023

Tim_YMember07 October 2023 08:56:13

@JohnnyPT

That's an excellent post you wrote. Thank you.

I actually am about to speak to some lawyers. Just wanted to tackle this problem from multiple angles.

Lucia Stefi Member

Member since 17 July 2023

Lucia StefiMember11 October 2023 18:20:51

@Tim_Y You must pay taxes in your country of origin while being a NHR tax resident in Portugal. The whole idea of not paying taxes in Portugal is that they let you live there as if you were living and paying taxes still in your original country. It's not that you just don't pay taxes. You do, just not in Portugal.

JohnnyPT Portugal Expert

Member since 23 May 2020

JohnnyPTPortugal Expert11 October 2023 18:41:37

#10

4546

@Tim_Y You must pay taxes in your country of origin while being a NHR tax resident in Portugal. The whole idea of not paying taxes in Portugal is that they let you live there as if you were living and paying taxes still in your original country. It's not that you just don't pay taxes. You do, just not in Portugal. -@Lucia Stefi

Hi Lucia,

Don't give wrong information here. The fact that your country of origin, Argentina, doesn't have an agreement with Portugal to avoid double taxation, doesn't mean that this bilateral agreement doesn't exist with more than 78 other countries...

https://info.portaldasfinancas.gov.pt/p … rsion.aspx

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