Moving to Hungary

orj1979 wrote:

Hi all newbie here. I’m interested in moving to Hungary one day to live an off grid style of living. Mainly because the properties and land are so cheap. I am from the UK and would be interested in buying a cheap house even if it’s a bit of a wreck and do it up here and there as I would want to continue working in the UK..... Could anyone give me any information on this at all please ?
Many thanks

You'll get a flood of opinions here on the pitfalls.  Just because it's cheap in HU doesn't mean it's any good.

Lots of houses in Hungary are total dumps in the middle of nowhere, far away from services like hospitals and shops. Like many countries, real estate agents cannot be trusted at all.  Plenty of lawyers are dodgy too. Just like the government.

Do not buy anywhere that does not have all the services already on site otherwise it'll cost you a fortune to establish them.  Gas is particularly problematic.

It's often cheaper  and more efficient to just knock down what is there rather than trying to fix up a dump.  Then you get the latest technology for insulation and so on. 

You might find things more difficult after Brexit as you won't necessarily have permission to purchase granted by default.   EU nationals were pretty much granted rights without too much fuss but 3rd country nationals are not in such a luxurious position.

But to start, best to read the forum and search in it. Plenty of discussion about property and the costs.

Thanks for the reply fluffy. I guess I’ll be lucky as I have dual nationality for anothe eu country. To be honest a cheap dump would be the kind of thing I’d like to do up. I would do all the work myself. I’ve worked in Building and mechanical sectors all my life. Thanks for the heads up about services. Better to have them first then disconnect after if possible. 👍🏻

orj1979 wrote:

Thanks for the reply fluffy. I guess I’ll be lucky as I have dual nationality for anothe eu country. To be honest a cheap dump would be the kind of thing I’d like to do up. I would do all the work myself. I’ve worked in Building and mechanical sectors all my life. Thanks for the heads up about services. Better to have them first then disconnect after if possible. 👍🏻

You might as well just leave it connected.  Getting it reconnected would be a terrible hassle especially if you don't speak Hungarian. 

You wouldn't be paying much anyway if you don't use it.  Bills are paid per quarter in advance.  Water twice a year.  None of it is really expensive compared to other countries.  If you're not there, it's hard to pay the bills as they come in the post using "yellow cheques".

I am sure you can fix it up but sometimes it's not worth it.  It's cheaper and more efficient to just knock it down and start again especially if it's made of mud and has no damp proofing.

We reduced our house to 4 walls and rebuilt it. It would have been just as easy to knock it all down.  We remodelled it so extensively we could have had other features without the restriction of the existing building, i.e. a full basement and/or underground garage.

Mr Fluffy is so very correct about property here in Hungary.
ATM we are semi-looking at renting a vacation spot for the summer months.
Retired and have decided to enjoy ourselves for once instead of always saving for an emergency etc.
Time to reap the fruits of our labor...
Anyways, as he is looking into properties( he speaks and reads Hungarian and is looking on a HU online site) he noticed a few "cheap" fixer uppers.
Total dumps to me, we are too old to spend time fixing something up, not interested in that at all.
But just to mention to you, if you buy something cheap out in nowhere here and start to fix it up, you may come back from working in the UK to find just the frame left standing.
Lots of thieves will take anything not welded down, would saw nailed down but I'm sure they would just take the whole wall, nails and all if possible.
Most of these cheap properties aren't even worth the 2 to 3 million they are asking for.

fluffy2560 wrote:

You might as well just leave it connected.  Getting it reconnected would be a terrible hassle especially if you don't speak Hungarian.

Agree. Don't disconnect. It is really a terrible hassle, and can take a long time (probably longer than your short stay time), to get your power back on.

fluffy2560 wrote:

If you're not there, it's hard to pay the bills as they come in the post using "yellow cheques".

I pay all my bills by Bank transfer (does not need to be from a Hungarian account -- banking fees just costs more if not). In fact, EOn no longer sends us "yellow cheques" at all since we have paid online for so long, they sent us a letter saying they would not send them anymore unless we specifically request them. And E-On also sends an SMS reminder about the due date and amount to pay. One can also ask for automatic withdrawal. Then one only needs to make sure to keep enough money on the bank account (I think that may require a Hungarian Forint account, but I really don't know for sure).

fluffy2560 wrote:

I am sure you can fix it up but sometimes it's not worth it.  It's cheaper and more efficient to just knock it down and start again especially if it's made of mud and has no damp proofing.

Well, some people just like a DIY project. I watch some channels on youtube like that. "Sail Life" for example -- people ask him why he just did not just build a new boat, and he keeps saying his entire point was to find a fixer upper and fix it up. Quite a job -- he has been working on that boat for years now. And the "Tally Ho" project --- he is busy replacing every piece of wood in the boat one at a time (rather than just lay a new keel and build up -- oh, and he also replaced the keel). A ship of Theseus, but that is his project. Each to their own.

I understand what you are all saying. Obviously I wouldn’t buy a complete wreck,when I said dump I just meant a dump compared to housing here in the UK lol. I would want to visit any properties first to get an idea of the condition of the building . I’m just saying I don’t mind if there’s work involved to make it a good home. So can anyone tell me about the costs of owning a house in Hungary at all? Taxes on properties? Do you pay tax based on the inside living space by square meter ? Do you have to also pay taxes based on how big your land with the house is on top of that aswell?
Many thanks

orj1979 wrote:

Taxes on properties?

Depends on where you live. Up to local government, they have the power to tax anything and as much or as little as they want. You have to ask where your house is (or will be).

orj1979 wrote:

Do you pay tax based on the inside living space by square meter ? Do you have to also pay taxes based on how big your land with the house is on top of that aswell?

Our taxes are based on both. But the tax is currently very minor: 10,000 HUF a year.

I have read that you have to pay tax which are dependant on the size of living space and also land space that comes with the property???

orj1979 wrote:

I understand what you are all saying. Obviously I wouldn’t buy a complete wreck,when I said dump I just meant a dump compared to housing here in the UK lol. I would want to visit any properties first to get an idea of the condition of the building . I’m just saying I don’t mind if there’s work involved to make it a good home. So can anyone tell me about the costs of owning a house in Hungary at all? Taxes on properties? Do you pay tax based on the inside living space by square meter ? Do you have to also pay taxes based on how big your land with the house is on top of that aswell?
Many thanks

BTW, you have to pay tax on the purchase as well.    If I remember correctly, you can say approximately all the costs are about 10% of the purchase price -  4% stamp duty, 2-3% real estate agent, 2-3% lawyer.   

Why percentages and not fixed fees, I've no idea.  Just market forces probably.

The stamp duty is paid in two lumps and you could find 6 months between bills arriving.

orj1979 wrote:

I have read that you have to pay tax which are dependant on the size of living space and also land space that comes with the property???

For us that is correct. But the total amount is determined by the local government.

You also must pay a tax on sold property if you have owned it for less then 7 years.
In Erd and with villa homes people have to pay a yearly property tax.
So far in Budapest I don't think they pay that.. yet.
The property tax is based on the value of the property.

It is mentioned to continue to work in the UK, travelling is expensive, and many more expenses are also mentioned in the thread (taxes, possible theft, insurance, …). To me the decision to move permanently to Hungary can be very good (and living here permanently myself) so far I can only agree, there are loads of drawbacks though, but also loads of positives (perhaps even more).

Considering however costs (especially of travelling, and others mentioned), to me buying is probably best to be postponed, you mention working in the UK (working during your holiday weeks is saving/creating a lot of leeway).

If doing up is a hobby best to convert to cash to buy (very effective I would think).
In my subjective view, just save a bit more by not travelling or incur expenses and move when you are ready (by the way, in Hungary in my view there is a big, very big need for builders etc. (me and my wife are admittedly quite well off (comparatively), we can afford to pay EUR 10 per hour for (effective) gardeners, also EUR 30 per hour for a good guy to service your boiler.
Bottom line even if we have contacts, you have to pay as a foreigner, but if you can do most yourselves, you will find Hungary is a very, very cost effective country.

Living in two places is expensive, my advice
-Move to Hungary YES
-Doing up especially if you can do it YES
-Having two domiciles a definite NO (saving of travel expenses alone will get you a property)
-Enjoy life and have a good health (no stress will help) YES (therefore move to Hungary permanently one off (ie no travelling and avoidable stress and headache).

-Look at your skills (they sound good, rather then converting your skills to your own home, you might be able doing up expat homes (they have real difficulties finding good workers).



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Marilyn Tassy wrote:

You also must pay a tax on sold property if you have owned it for less then 7 years.
In Erd and with villa homes people have to pay a yearly property tax.
So far in Budapest I don't think they pay that.. yet.
The property tax is based on the value of the property.

Just to follow up on that...of course you don't pay if you sell it at a loss (no capital gain) but in another way, you'll have costs of selling and it can take years.  3-4 years to sell wouldn't be unusual.

Land taxes vary by location. In my area (outside of Budapest), we pay based on land area.  They are VERY slow at asking for it and we have been actually asking them to send us a bill and even now we haven't got the bill.  We like to make sure there are never any outstanding bills so we find this all very odd.

In another property Mrs Fluffy has a partial share in, they are the opposite, they send bills every 5 minutes.

cdw057 wrote:

If doing up is a hobby best to convert to cash to buy (very effective I would think).
In my subjective view, just save a bit more by not travelling or incur expenses and move when you are ready (by the way, in Hungary in my view there is a big, very big need for builders etc. (me and my wife are admittedly quite well off (comparatively), we can afford to pay EUR 10 per hour for (effective) gardeners, also EUR 30 per hour for a good guy to service your boiler.
Bottom line even if we have contacts, you have to pay as a foreigner, but if you can do most yourselves, you will find Hungary is a very, very cost effective country.

They all seem to travel over the border and work in Austria.

SimCityAT wrote:

cdw057 wrote:

If doing up is a hobby best to convert to cash to buy (very effective I would think).
In my subjective view, just save a bit more by not travelling or incur expenses and move when you are ready (by the way, in Hungary in my view there is a big, very big need for builders etc. (me and my wife are admittedly quite well off (comparatively), we can afford to pay EUR 10 per hour for (effective) gardeners, also EUR 30 per hour for a good guy to service your boiler.
Bottom line even if we have contacts, you have to pay as a foreigner, but if you can do most yourselves, you will find Hungary is a very, very cost effective country.

They all seem to travel over the border and work in Austria.

There are builders in Hungary but as you say, all the workers have gone to Austria or even more specifically Germany and other places like the Netherlands.

We have only found one person who can do our garden landscaping/building and we've been looking for months. Our needs are complicated - retaining walls, fences, drains, water tanks, paving etc.   Not for an odd job person.

It's a sellers market at the moment.

I am also guessing that there could be a need for an English speaking builder to serve the Expat community. I am friends with a couple in Austria, (1 Kiwi, and 2 English guys) They are always busy. In Austria the going rate is €35/h.

SimCityAT wrote:

I am also guessing that there could be a need for an English speaking builder to serve the Expat community. I am friends with a couple in Austria, (1 Kiwi, and 2 English guys) They are always busy. In Austria the going rate is €35/h.

Seems like it would be like that but Austria is a rich country.  HU people won't pay that money here, they'd rather do it themselves even if it's a bodge.  Mrs Fluffy always does the talking to avoid expat pricing/inflation.

Builders would have to speak Hungarian.   They wouldn't be able to talk to the other trades.   But I have come across a few building workers who speak German and a bit of English to some very small degree.  It's not like Poland where huge numbers of construction workers speak English after decades working internationally.

BTW, Mrs Fluffy said Hungarian workers are being usurped by Ukranians now as they are cheaper.

But you can see why Hungarians travel to work in Austria daily.

cdw057 wrote:

we can afford to pay EUR 10 per hour for (effective) gardeners, also EUR 30 per hour for a good guy to service your boiler.

I would be happy to pay even more. But it is like being willing to pay 100 EUR for a glass of cool, clean water in the desert --- pointless if there is no cool, clean water available.

Good and competent tradesmen willing to do house calls for individual clients are difficult to find **. Especially in the countryside. It is DIY land out here.

** Yes, you will always find the "my friend's brother in law is an electrician" thing... but that does not mean they are good or competent.

SimCityAT wrote:

But you can see why Hungarians travel to work in Austria daily.

Yes, of course.  Cash in hand in Austria at 3 x rate is a no brainer.