COVID-19

thecolonel wrote:

Lets say you're the captain of 1000 cops, while there are 10000 partyers,  how would you stop them exactly? Be specific.    In fact do we know how many cops they can muster, pay overtime , in PoP?

You have explained why DR has and will continue to have a curfew.

It may not stop all the clandestine parties but it stops the mass conglomerations late at night every Sunday.

And so it is much easier to identify those abusing the sanitary measures, close those businesses and confiscate their sound systems.

Puerto Plata has a big problem with covid19 cases and spread, so it comes as no surprise to me of the carefree attitude there. They have been locked down before and it can happen again if positivity grows.

My job is not to manage the cops or the  political responses. I am pointing out the obvious.

Colonel your logic  would apply TO EVERYTHING TO DO WITH THIS!    its not helpful in any way shape or form!   

Do you suggest that  we just stop policing? IF everyone decided to rob and murder how would you stop it? Be specific!!!!!    Your comments are asinine as  we have come to expect.

BBC News - Covid: Vaccination will be required to fly, says Qantas chief
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-55048438

Quantas may the first to state vaccination certification will be required to fly when the vaccines are readily available but I bet they will not be alone.

I fully expect a lot of countries to want vaccination certificate for visitors.

It simply costs countries far too much in many ways letting covid19 spread so as soon as there are vaccines easily obtained I would expect such controls. Tough if you are anti vax but there will be many countries who care more about the health of their citizens and will rely on vaccination to deal with this virus. DR and other developing countries cant afford continual testing, medical costs and usage and controls such as curfew to control spread  so required vaccination deals with that.

It is the next big global debate.

45 more days of state of emergency sought by the President...and he will get it.

https://listindiario.com/la-republica/2 … emergencia

Until mid January.

Just curious - most of the people to Puerta Plata are tourists right now?

No not tourists. Locals

Didnt think anybody could give an explicit answer of how to disperse thousands of parties.

Why issue in Puerto Plata and not other areas?

I some other areas too, they dont: bother with masks....dont bother with social distancing...dont bother with traffic laws......dont bother with---------fill in the blank.   And some gringos expect the few cops can make all those millions comply?

Where there is less mask use and where people ignore basic self distancing there are increased cases. Puerto Plata is good case in point. People who want greater restrictions imo.

DR will have curfew until into 2021 at least. Get used to it. The only way out is to respect mask use, social distancing and no clandestine get togethers.

The socially dumb make this whole thing last much longer. A DR vaccine is many months away.

DR is changing under Abinader. Ignore that if you wish. Abinader bothers. Did you read about the senator and police chief in Monte Cristi and how the President acted?

I see the actions by Abinader!   At least he is doing something. At least he is making progress.

I never  believe what people say, I believe what they do.  He is backing up what he said with actions.  Like the actions or not he is doing what he said he would do.  So far!  The caveat, we are only 100 days in.

The vaccine is what will resolve this problem, It wont be the attitude of the people and sadly  many will die!   and many more will suffer longer term effects.

lennoxnev wrote:

BBC News - Covid: Vaccination will be required to fly, says Qantas chief
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-australia-55048438

Quantas may the first to state vaccination certification will be required to fly when the vaccines are readily available but I bet they will not be alone.

I fully expect a lot of countries to want vaccination certificate for visitors.

It simply costs countries far too much in many ways letting covid19 spread so as soon as there are vaccines easily obtained I would expect such controls. Tough if you are anti vax but there will be many countries who care more about the health of their citizens and will rely on vaccination to deal with this virus. DR and other developing countries cant afford continual testing, medical costs and usage and controls such as curfew to control spread  so required vaccination deals with that.

It is the next big global debate.

This sounds like a terrible decision to make so soon. No one knows the long term effects of any of these vaccines. None have gone through years of study and testing. To rush something out then oblige people to get it in order to travel seems pretty ham-fisted and potentially dangerous.

Maybe it's better than the alternative?   Letting the virus run unchecked and people dying and or living with long term effects is not viable either.

It is something that could happen say six months down the line and there will be debate.

But international travel is a choice for most people, and the decisions to expect vaccination will be the decisions of countries and airlines.

Many smaller and less developed countries but also countries like Australia and New Zealand and I suspect other Asian countries and many in the Caribbean will want to protect their populations and will lean towards wanting vaccination when fully rolled out.

It has happened before with widespread infections including developed nations demanding visitors have vaccine certification when arriving from infected locations. It works both ways.

Personally I don't see a problem. The Astra Zeneca vaccine is a tried and tested viral vector type of vaccine and that is the one I will have and be available here in DR. I admit I would have reservations taking the other two being unproven new vaccine technology using manufactured RNA. But they could be good and this new technology offer long term solutions to many infections and time will tell.

You just posed a false dichotomy...........vaccine to fly, or death.   You ignoring many other variables.

There is as I expained a simple choice option.......don't travel if airlines and countries demand vaccination in the future.

You choose.

Yes, thanks for providing one more variable....debunking the fase dichotomy.

Again Colonel you just persist in the BS.  Just stop.   We will not be engaging in this type of discussion.  Scientific proof  EVERYWHERE.  Start reading and stop spouting this crap. 

Always open to educated fact based discussions. Throwing around ridiculous comments is not.

A bit premature': global airline body distances itself from Qantas vaccine stance

The IATA seems to be backing away from Qantas' hardline approach. More thorough testing at the borders seems to be the priority for the IATA. A much more levelheaded approach at this stage, in my opinion.

I quite like this idea for the high profile perople who encouraged the Puerto Plata caravan this past Sunday - on top of the fines, bonds and detention proposed:

Yeni Berenice suggests imposing services in hospitals to violators of measures against COVID-19

The Director of Persecution of the Public Ministry refers to the case of the pitcher Carlos Martínez and La Perversa

https://www.diariolibre.com/actualidad/ … GI22915434

Deputy Attorney General Yeni Berenice Reynoso assured today that cases such as that of the San Luis Cardinals pitcher Carlos Martínez (The Tsunami), which violate the provisions of the Ministry of Public Health to stop the COVID-19 pandemic, force the entire country to seek rapid sanction mechanisms.

Reynoso stated that “perhaps a practical solution would be to force the violators of the curfew and physical distancing, apart from paying fines and bonds, to provide social service, with due protection, in hospitals, which are precisely the ones who fight to every moment for the lives of COVID-19 patients ”.

The general director of Persecution of the Public Ministry highlighted that, in this way, “the offenders, who threaten the efforts of the health authorities to stop the pandemic and who expose the lives of others, would contribute to the work of the health system and their workers and, at the same time, they would become aware of the seriousness of a pandemic ”.

She explained that the Puerto Plata Prosecutor's Office, headed by Magistrate Osvaldo Bonilla, is investigating whether the Major League Baseball player was part of the organizers of a massive event in which the urban artist Dennisse Michelle Tejeda (known as La Perversa) was arrested. , as well as Jean Mario Dujarric Pérez, Jordania Vanessa Sarita Santos and Enmanuel Marino Valeyron López.

I think that is a great idea!   Let them  go and see what suffering really looks like,  what the  numbers look like and  put themselves at risk!

It is all heading the wrong direction....problems lie ahead?

Bulletin #252:

New cases             1258
Day positivity           17.97%
Rolling 4 week positivity average   11.52%
Active cases     24,918

Hospital beds occupied and ICU up.

Greater Santo Domingo    688 cases
Duarte, La Altagracia, La Romana, La Vega, MTS, Puerto Plata, San Cristobal, SPM, Sanchez Ramirez, Santiago, Monsenor Noeul, Monte Plata and Valverde all showing double digit larger numbers.

wow!!!

Biology gonna do what biology does.

People gonna do what people do.

Eventually the latter learns from the former?

Health Minister reveals Dominican Republic will have 14 million doses of vaccine against COVID-19

https://www.diariolibre.com/actualidad/ … EN22944347

They have secured another 4 million doses from commercial sources in addition to the 10 million direct from AZ.

That will be enough or more for 70% of the population and their negociations are ongoing.

Their aim is to vaccinate the whole population for next October. Surveys indicate 70% of the population is willing to be vaccinated.

AZs vaccine is being assessed by the UK regulator as of today. The fuss about the lower first dose was reported very early in the process to the regulators. Some bad PR by AZ for sure but they appear to have found the best mix for two doses.

Excellent news for this country.

IATA Travel Pass


https://www.iata.org/en/publications/travel-pass/

To re-open borders without quarantine and restart aviation governments need to be confident that they are effectively mitigating the risk of importing COVID-19. This means having accurate information on passengers’ COVID-19 health status.

Creating a digital platform for passengers with information on what tests, vaccines and other measures they require prior to travel, details on where they can get tested as well as giving the passengers the ability to share their tests and vaccination results in a verifiable, safe and privacy-protecting manner is the key to giving governments the confidence to open borders. To address this challenge IATA is launching the IATA Travel Pass.

The probability of needing a secure proof of vaccination for covid19 for international travel is increasing.

There is planning afoot already to ensure a secure system is in place for international travellers to get proof of vaccination linked to their passport prior to international travel.

And increasingy it is beginning to look like both airlines and countries are tending towards wanting vaccination proof to travel.

Bulletin #255:

820 new cases
Day positivity  17.04%
Rolling 4 week positivity  12.30%
Active cases at 26,225

Nothing good here. Trend is the wrong way.

Clearly the wrong direction.  Sad for all of us.

Lrnnoxnev....any idea how deaths here?  That has to be more important than positive tests, right?  After all remember how Elon Musk had 4 tests......2 positive...2 negative.

Each covid19 case reported is yet another person who cannot work or take part in society until he or she recovers. The more there are the greater the economic and social damage. The larger the pool of active cases and higher the positivity increase the risk of more transmission and more cases and more economic and social damage.

And of course each case can lead to death or serious long term organ damage and long covid.

Not to foget the stress on hospitals and health care workers and the economic damage paying for all this virus spread.

The virus is damaging societies worldwide in a big way. Vaccination is essential along with international travel controls when vaccines are authorized to try and return the world to something near normal.

To only monitor the  deaths that have often occurred unnecessily through political ineptitude worldwide ignores the real damage this virus has and will continue to cause.

Also consider the postponing of various surgeries..... going on everywhere.

People's surgeries are being pushed back
Chemotherapy is rescheduled..... cancer treatment

The hospitals are in disarray...

They are a vital part of the social fabric

And here deaths are seriously under reported. Many dont go to hospital to be diagnosed. 

There is  no ONE  number that reflects completely what is going on.  Its a complex issue and those who try to simplify it do a huge disservice.  And that applies to those who  simplify it to show its no big deal AND to those who want to  encourage a total and complete shutdown. Neither is okay.

Summary...no body knows how many have died....nobody know if they have had tests like Elon Musk had.  Nobody knows how many of those who actually got it, even got sick, or how sick, or if died.  Knowbody knows how many have committed suicide because they were forced out of their jobs.  All we know is that many people feel their opinion as to what should be done, should be forced on others.....even though many scientists disagree with them (the whole subject is controversial amongst them).

Update: here is an article about the controversy about where it came from.   
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ … igin-story

In terms of DR - my home now - all that matters to me is that the government keeps the lid on this virus and it's devastating effects until enough of the population here can get vaccinated and the conseqentiatial damage it causes can be put in the past. This means controlling mobility and sanitary measures here for many more months.

And it wont go away without a uniform world approach on vaccination when that is available in bulk along with agreed inter country travel controls which could be difficult. And so I do expect national border protection measures by vaccination certification to become very common.

IATA obviously is anticipating this too for flyers.

Consensus amongst scientists  is really all I care about. You can find dissenters for  literally everything.

The overwhelming  majority of doctors, nurses, scientists etc agree this is very real, it is widespread and it is life changing!  period.   You can throw all your conspiracy bs at it that you want.   Not listening.  Period.   Lots of two bit hustlers trying to get their  10 minutes of fame and  rip people off. Its quite disgusting. 

In terms of  "forcing actions"  well  that is how civilized society actually works. For the greater good is how this  happens. Dont like it? Feel free to take your sorry butt elsewhere.

Thanks for confirming what I said.

Again you twist things to what you want to hear. 

I am not in agreement with what you said.

I was addressing Lennox, but indeed you also agreed that you want governments to use force to do want YOU want.  You must be very disappointed with the Swiss who I just heard are going to have open ski resorts.