Solar energy

Hello jmorac,

Welcome to Expat.com

Thank you for starting a new thread to ask your question.

Since this forum is very active, it won't be hard for you to get help soon.

In the meantime, tell us a little more about yourself. Are you new to Punta Cana?

Cheers,

Cheryl

Expat.com team

@jmorac there is place in Sosua, Puerto Plata that sells them. I will inquire and let you know.

Search the forum for solar - there are a lot of threads with useful info, and probably some recommendations for providers in Punta Cana.

@jmorac:  It will depend upon where in Punta Cana.  There are several threads that you can review with information for you.  If you are a CEPM customer, forget it.  They are not allowing anymore solar installations.

@Zauna Ann Hewling  I am in Puerto Plata can you provide the contact information please?

If you are a CEPM customer, forget it. They are not allowing anymore solar installations.
-@DominicanadaMike

May I ask, please?

I gather  the  company you mention is getting all harsh with  their customers, but does that only include systems that combine with their wires, or do they try to stop every and solar installation, even systems that only run on separate wiring.

I installed a simple set that allows low voltage (12 volt) LED lighting and the ability to charge phones and computers. It's totally off grid, so would I be correct in thinking they can't stop their customers doing that?

I understand much of the aim of many solar systems in DR is back up in power outages - the thing I installed here will do that nicely.

Hi Fred, They don't want you installing the off grid system either but I if you are buying any amount of electricity from them I think they will find it very difficult to police or stop you from having an add-on off grid system as well.  If you DIY I can't see how they can do anything.

@DominicanadaMike CEPM do not allow the solar installations?  Would you happen to know why?  Is it legal not to allow?  Any information you have would be very useful.  Thank you in advance !

@Fred

hi Fred , I’m also in puerto plata and I get asked at least once a month if I want solar installed , and I see people in the are installing it …. So I don’t think we have the solar police in our area but I’m sure you could ask someone driving around in one of the maintenance trucks and thy would know…

I too live in POP. My understanding is that it is still possible there but you do have to apply for a permit to feed the electric back into the system for credit.

The government here has set limits on the amounts of solar installations allowed.  The  Energy distributors dont really have an issue with this! 

So if its closed then  make application and get on the waiting list!

Thanks Planner. 

Just a side note about solar installations for Newbies.  It's probably been mentioned before but there is some benefit and security of having on grid systems vs off grid systems that you might not have thought about.

Off grid systems are more expensive and require more maintenance (batteries) and even though you have electricity available when the grid is down, you still need a second energy supply when the sun is down.  Yes, when it's dark, cloudy, or other objects blocking light to your solar panels, you may not get enough solar power to keep your system running.  This would result in needing another energy supply.

I have been quite happy with my on grid system overall.  Of course the few times the electricity is off, I re-think the benefits vs cost of having some type of backup.  So far the cost has outweighed the benefit for me...

Still waiting for something that isn't so costly for those few days a year I might need it.

Cheers everyone and Happy Thanksgiving.

Great information.  Can't you be on grid and have battery back up for your solar system?  Some areas go down often!

Absolutely, but that extra part is costly and requires maintenance.  You have to decide if it's worth it for your situation...

Exactly,. That makes sense.  Is it more costly than a regular inverter battery type system?  Just as a comparison in terms of adding battery back up

Last quote I had a few years ago was $2500USD for the "add-on".  Batteries are expensive and have to be replaced every 2-4 years.

Wow.  So not just regular inverter type batteries, or it's the volume needed?

It's probably the volume.   I have 23 panels.

Thanks honey!

What about a small generator w/a transfer switch , small one for the ac and fridge, some of the small ones can last for 6-7 hours on a tank of gas and the propane portable ones can run for days… it’s a one time cost and well maintain will last  , my friend has a big one for the last 8 years and starts it up every 4/5 months let’s it run for an hour and that’s it

@Tippj: The propane sounds like an option.  Do you know where I can purchase such an animal?  It's mainly refrigerators and freezers that I want to protect.  A fan or 2 and a light or 2 would be great.

Thanks...

I would try the home improvements stores in Santigo or SD ,

funny thing I just brought 2 battery operated fans from the states they run off 20v batteries that last for 5 hours on a charge ( bought 4 batteries) the other night the power went off at 11pm turned the one on in the bedroom slept like a baby about 4am the power came back on (  that’s when I woke and realized it was back on ) something to consider ( . After the last hurricane who knows right ) I have plenty of battery operated lights w/ the solar ones surrounding the exterior the solar ones last 8-10 hours ( Dusk - Dawn ……… just throwing out some ideas 4 yer

Hello everyone.

Well this conversation is about to get a lot more interesting!

After a visit with CEPM today;

Well, if you think there were electricity problems before you haven’t seen anything yet.

The Dominican government is obviously against green energy and working against the rest of the world to destroy the environment. IMHO

So, what makes me think this?  Well, forget about solar energy for a start.  They do not want to support it.  I have a solar system that has continuously produced double the energy that I consume.  (Good deal for CEPM and the Government) I have my records for the past 6 years.  Recently, CEPM sends a letter (to us that have solar) telling us of a new tariff that we will have to pay if we use more than we generate.  (They didn’t explain how the tariff works or how much it would be) Ok, no problem right?  So, for the next 2 months I do not get my invoice from CEPM and I am not able to validate my usage or my generation.  Which by the way coincides with the time they changed my meter without notification.  Then after 2 months, they send me a bill telling me that I used 3kw more energy than what I consumed.  Which, by the way is totally inaccurate as I have my production metered and the amount of production was almost double what they reported I produced.  OK…big deal 3kw right?  I use that in a few hours.  So why argue about it.  Well, here’s why:  The rate that people without solar pay here in Bavaro\Veron (CEPM) area is 17.79 pesos per KW.  If we (solar customers) over produce, CEPM generously (no pun intended) gives us 3.3 pesos per kw in return at the end of each year.  But now, they changed our agreement (on their own) and if we use more than what we generate in any given month, then they are charging us 1,869.74 pesos per kw!!!!  Resulting in 6176.22 pesos for 3kw of energy!!!  Yes, that’s right and I verified it wasn’t an error.

Furthermore, for the past 6 years CEPM has continuously under metered my production by at least 30%.  What’s the charge for theft of power? Seems like CEPM is above the law.

Potentially, we could go bankrupt from one month of usage.  So, what’s the solution?  >>We MUST go off grid!  Here’s the problem.  If we go off grid we need a storage facility (batteries).  They potentially last about 2-3 years and then you have to replace them.  So you have a large maintenance cost and where will the old batteries go?  The local landfill!!!  Thousands of them.

What will the government do?  Ban the sale of batteries, problem solved. Right?  Oh and now you have to get re-connected to the local electric company.  How do you think that’s going to go?

How can a government be so narrow minded, environmentally challenged and break their own constitutional laws of providing basic services to everyone.  The whole world is in chaos!

We must stand up for our rights.  This is a democratic country and they will listen if there are enough of us.  Spread the word.  I have factual evidence to support every word I have written.

Thanks for letting me blow off a little steam and I would Love to hear some feedback…

In the meantime I will be finding a solution...

Wow this is incredible. 

Couple points, this is a private generating company basically extorting you, not a government distributor.

Yes we live in a democracy but only with citizenship do you have a say or a vote.  We need citizens to say that's enough!

A private generating company yes, but they are following Dominican law and are a monopoly.  Don't underestimate the power that non-citizens have.  I can easily have "that" power through my Dominican wife.  When there is a will there is a way Planner.

Yes power through those who are citizens.  Yes there is a lot we can do and will take time and patience. Sadly so much here doesn't make sense on multiple levels.

On that note why don't you have your citizenship?

I don't want it?

OK... sure..... but accept your position, as a non-citizen, non voter.

You are at the  mercy of others

Willie, I have, please stay on topic people.

Very sorry

Ok. Got it.  Was simply curious.

I think many of you don't see the impact.  It's not about individuals as much as it is about companies that use solar to help supplement their cost of electricity.  Now the amount that they have to pay for the balance used just went from 17.79 a kw to 1869.74 a Kw!!!  If these companies don't go bankrupt after 1 invoice, what do think it will do to the price of the products that they sell.  Coca-cola as an example.  Water is another example.

I wonder if pro consumidor is aware of this?

I will ask my son-in-law in Moca what he has heard about this. He is not only a Master Electrician with his own successful business, but he built his own home last year and installed his own Solar panels. He will also be doing my house. As for used batteries, I have seen here in Moca people that collect dead batteries & was told they being taken away for refurbishing. There are at least excellent methods of doing this that I have in my notes in Moca that I considered potential business opportunies - especially in the area of batties needed/used for solar power. Due to my current medical situation here in Alberta, I won't be able to travel back to Moca as soon as I had planned so I can't dig out that info....

My guess is this private company in Punta Cana is following the law in some regards and making things up as they go along.

This is clearly an abuse and needs to be reported.  DominicanadaMike this is clearly an abuse of those connected and a massive issue possibly for some!!!!

@PLanner: Pro-consumidor is on my list (and it's a long list so something better change fast).  Today was Protocom.

Good to hear!  Please keep us posted. If I can do anything to assist let me know. Maybe that reporter Nuria???

Thanks, I will let you know.  For now I am trying to do my do diligence before blowing up...

She's on my list too...lol

I'm arriving late to this discussion...and find it simultaneously disturbing and fascinating...kind of like watching a train wreck occur: one just can't look away.

For us, the thought has always been that if we ever bought or built a villa here in the DR, we'd obviously want solar. Why move toward the equator and "not" take advantage of it, right?

I'd have to guess that the government players involved in this anti-solar soap opera, along with some of the power companies, are hostile to solar because it effectively removes well-to-do customers from the power company's rolls...and even causes scarce funding to be pulled out of the company to pay off the solar-tied customers contributing to the grid.

Why the hostility when this solar-generation reimbursement is now standard practice around the Western World?

• At a guess, the companies have always used the wealthy customers to subsidize poor customers...and it seems like the government has implicitly accepted this de facto welfare program. Certainly, they've not stopped it, and it would take the government and legal system united to do so.
• Hence, the power companies are upset -- they're losing the cash flow they've come to expect from the wealthy customer base, as they move off to solar.
• The power companies are being left holding the bag...and are now playing their hands to pass those costs back to the wealthy customers.

I also have to wonder if there's some bleed-over from the undeniable "pirate" unofficial customers on the side, that are plugged into unlimited, unmetered and thus unbilled power usage...and creating huge drains on their cash flows. That has been a major problem here for decades, if you believe the older threads on expat.com.

• Those pirate users have been well documented in other threads on expat.com...though some are several years old now. 
• But, if you've been anywhere in the DR's urban areas...you've seen the proof. Just walking along the sidewalks can be a dangerous proposition because all of the bootleg wires running in and out of the transformers and feed lines.
• And there are occasional short articles about another person dieing from trying to connect to the grid illegally, and being shocked to death.

With the massive pirate drain a fact on every one of DR's electrical grids...and the disappearance of former well-paying customers that go solar and end up costing the company from reverse billing...well, at least some of the companies are panicking and trying to force the cows to stay in the pasture, so they can be milked on a regular basis.

Now, ALL of the above is just thinking out loud. I'm pulling in several disparate threads of reporting and experiences, and postulating therefrom. Yet, it's not an outrageous analysis.

I don't think the power companies see that they are ultimately bring about their own demise. The more they crank down on the wealthier/paying customers (by raising rates and imposing draconian rules about how solar can be tied into their grids...or not...and at impossibly high costs), the more paying customers they are going to drive completely off-grid and off power company accounts.

• The cost of solar cells has been dropping drastically...so that part is easier/cheaper to buy than ever before. It's also cheaper to buy more/larger solar cells (production sources) for larger homes.
• But larger solar systems mean they also need more/bigger/better batteries (if going off-grid/independent) ... and their costs haven't really been dropping. In some cases, they've been going up sharply...in large part, I believe, because the battery companies today are competing with Electric Vehicles (EVs) for the necessary Lithium, Potassium, Iron, etc. 
• Thus, PRICES FOR BATTERIES ARE NOT GOING TO BE DROPPING ANY TIME SOON, as the costs of mining those minerals at the scales needed to produce global-scale EVs are high and going higher, due to the significant demand imbalance.

What does this mean to prospective expats wanting to settle in the DR?

• I have to think that many expats will reconsider settling anywhere SOLAR tie-ins aren't welcome, or prohibitively expensive.
• And if this trend goes nationwide in power companies throughout the DR...I think a lot of recent home buyers are going to find it impossible to afford the properties they've bought over the last few years.

This is fascinating but distressing to watch; I hope it can be resolved fairly to the paying customers and particularly to solar owners.  But I fear there are going to be a lot of tears shed -- and wallets picked -- over the next few years due to electricity, power companies, and solar projects.

For DominicanadaMike: Brother, I'm pulling for you to get this on the right path...if anyone can do it, you can. 

• But, it will eventually require a WHOLE lot property owners to unite as a team to bring the needed political pressure to bear. 
• That's going to be the hardest part, given the polyglot of owners and visitors, natives and foreigners, citizens and tourists and permanent residents, that make up this most-impacted group.

This is truly fascinating to watch.  Lots of competing governmental, cultural, class, social and political segments competing to gain or protect their particular parts of the pie ...and to get someone else to pay for it, if possible.

Jim

ExpatRusher