Living with Covid19

Interesting topic,  timely.

Yes much is going to be altered for most of us.  I am a dancer, that is my passion.  That is also a big problem that I dont have a solution for.

Work -  my office is being re configured to accommodate social distancing. Means my cost of office space just doubled in terms of efficient use of space. 

Cost going up for cleaning and maintaining everything.

I don't use public transport.
I won't be going to resorts.
I won't be going to cinema or malls.

I too  will plan my shopping for off peak hours.
Travel will be in country for me.

The most effected will be the poor who rely on public transport and jobs with employers who don't care or only do the minimal to protect their staff.

A floor to ceiling pole, in front of large picture window, and a dancing lady - hmmmm - might be a money maker  - in some places....oops, sorry Planner , my bad, but couldn't resist....hahahaha Keep on keeping on.

I'm a little worried of what it will be like when/if they ever get around to finishing my Temp Residency and cedula - would be so much easier if the lawyer could get it and I could get from her...but hopefully there'll be no need for a hotel for one night and I'll be renting a car - no bus as well as bringing my own eats....

I was thinking outdoor restaurants/nightlife would be more way of life. Airbnb places might be more popular than the all inclusive hotel.

Hmmm.  2vpsoldier. A wild imagination. Been in quarantine to long.

I no longer think condos nor rentals in apartment blocks are a good idea. The density of people per area is as much as in some of the crowded barrios and you share corridors, elevators, stairways parking, rubbish disposal and even laundry facilities. The future needs lower density communities imo and you won't get that in SD and Santiago except on the outskirts.

Well, there are still disbelievers.

This is not going away and indeed will keep coming back and a vaccine if it happens will likely be short term and not fully protective and in any case in DR it won't happen to most.

In the UK, smog led to a move from old terrace housing and into flats but since the 60s the move has been to new towns with better town planning. But the 80s bought a return to city life and refurbishing centre city dwellings. And now it is those city dwellers looking to move back to the country.

I think the trend will be away from big cities to rural areas now with more online working and business. I have little confidence that mass tourism will return as before despite all the hype. Eco tourism and low density vacations will become more the norm with chalet type accommodation.  Domestic tourism will be the initial focus with Europeans and North Americans staying closer to home and seeking health security.

Omg thank you guys for the laugh!!!   

Note to self: research where to buy a pole!

Seriously we will likely make changes and my guess is 80% of Dominicans will be life as usual.  With a serious lack of resources how can they change in real ways?

Certainly - masks & distancing are - will be - in place for a while....
1 year??

We'll see how the airlines do the seating
Recent JetBlue SDQ-JFK had an empty middle seat
The 1st EasyJet flt in the UK this morning sat them 3 abreast
ostensibly to balance the load
After takeoff they all moved to empty rows

I have chosen business for a while now.... will continue

So - things may not be uniform

Sports/ concerts / etc will be a long time returning - I expect

Shopping.... we'll see..... many will limit entry
NYC is curb pickup only now

Life will go on - always does.... just differently

The urban exodus is global....
Home working will help that along

Life changed after 9/11.. a lot .. we're still here !!!

Thoughts......

Right now in many parts of the world there is a selfish and almost carefree approach to covid19 by sectors of the population. This certainly applies to the cities in DR.

But covid19 is not going anywhere and it can't be ignored and transmits so easily without any form of social distancing.

So societies will go through a period of discovery that the virus will not go away and if you don't respect it, it will screw up life in your community with sickness which in itself will effect the economy and worse, deaths and hospital crisis.

As with all crisis, society will adapt and change, but it will probably take time. Those that take steps early will be the winners.

Gradually society will become more caring and community focused with respect for all.

DR could adapt more quickly than other nations because many smaller communites here are strong with many family links. Everybody knows everybody whilst in the western world people live in their own bubbles by and large. Equally most commerce is based at the micro level and can adapt better. It is the commercial western business models that could suffer most in a prolonged pandemic and covid19 may never go away.

Other thoughts......

The tourist models of Sosua and Boca Chica with a bar and a vibrant night life culture may never be the same again.

Such nightlife which is also to be found in the capital in Avenue Venezuela and to a certain extent in Zona Colonial and Cabarete  could be retricted for a very long time without a state of emergency. The government could simply use the Heath Act to keep such places of aglomeration of people without social distancing closed for a very long time without change and beyond the planned 24th August.

Such places need to adapt to have closed streets with tables spaced out on the streets and waiter service only with masks of course. It already happens in Boca Chica but could be extended with the inside bar areas off limits.

Good ideas..... I forget where - but the street closure to give more bar/restaurant space is already in place & working

As I have said before -
you don't beat a pandemic -- you survive it

A combination of the Darwinian theory

the fittest and the smartest....
still adaptation as  the original concept.....  to better survive

Yep.

Time to adapt.

Not a time to be in the bar, club or disco business imo. And as far as DR goes those businesses are few and far between outside tourist areas and big cities. But quite a few expats are involved, so time for them to rethink?

The hospitality industry is going to face a serious shake up as the new trends in human behavior develop imo. Condo hotels and time share could suffer badly as well as high density AI's. It is time to brush off real estate plans that offer villa communities for the retired and second home owners. Apartment complexes, especially in cities are a bad deal now imo. DR though has plenty of good real estate land for different more spacious developments. Samana and the South West come to mind.

The whole travel industry including airlines and airports will suffer at some point. We haven't seen the end of bankrupcies of airlines imo. I read TUI France is in difficulties. BA looks shaky. And the American airines will face the reality in September when the government funding drops out of the equation. Too many airlines have huge debts and too many aircraft and staff right now for the new reality of travel with covid19 with social distancing.

Google Earth will show you the open space along the No Coast
Samana incl
Oceanfront ..... inland w/ view... u name it

I have trouble thinking of another Caribbean island with this much unused , prime land

Las Terenas and Las Galeras are excellent places to be able to stay in single accomodation or very low density small hotels and wide open empty largely beaches and the restaurants there are often outside and spacious.

Punta Rucia, Cabrera and Luperon likewise. The areas south of Barahona and near Azua and Bani too. Plus the mountains.

DR has great potential for low density living and retirement.

I think this article about a shopping centre in the middel of rural England exemplifies that people are being selfish and carefree right now:

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus- … s-12007965

To talk about people in DR not respecting social distancing is one thing ( and those political rallies here have caused rebuke today) but in recent days we have seen far worse in the UK, Europe and the USA.

It will take another few bout of covid19 to make these selfish/careless people start to think twice. Adaption will take time after much more health and economic pain.

My betting is that DR folks will get it quicker than these folks in the UK or much of those in the USA.

Masks are a problem everywhere - I expect
Some fall in line- some don't and will not

Here in RD I see the conflict

I see them w/no masks....


then I see a guy out in a field - solo - picking mango..... mask on


they just don't understand it

how do you teach them how this spreads --- and does NOT spread !!???

If that can be solved.... we make BIG steps forward

as for the UK and elsewhere

The impetus is supposed to be Black Lives Matter

But the anger & frustration of the quarantine/lockdown contributes too

The Brits are knocking the police off their horse
Americans are attacking police

In normal times , I doubt the reactions would be so strong or violent
Not always peaceful - but not so fierce

Covid19 is not going away, but rather it is expanding worldwide very rapidly now as the initial wave of lock downs has expired and people try to return to a life they knew before the pandemic with open economies.

It won't work.

Major changes are needed.

The unfortunate consequence of all this is that some businesses will go bust, the health system will get overloaded, people will be without work with debt problems and hunger and strife will set in and plenty of people will get sick and some die.

A coming consequence of this pandemic, I fear will be social upheaval of the type we saw at the end of the 19th century. Society will go two ways. Authoritarian or socialist. People will have to be controlled and kept active and fed. Democracies are often ineffective in periods of crisis and peoples and economies will need to be controlled more rigidly.

[link moderated]

Do you long for a return to normal after COVID-19?

Before the pandemic, 734 million people lived in extreme poverty, 690 million people went hungry, and 79·5 million people were forcibly displaced. Bill Gates and the late great Hans Rosling would tell you that the world is in a better state than you might expect, and that huge progress has been made. They would be right. Yet for billions of people, normal—ie, life before COVID-19—was not working. We might not be able to return to normal, but perhaps we should not want to. With the climate crisis pressing in, we cannot afford to. COVID-19 is a human catastrophe, but it gives the health community an opportunity to rethink the purpose of society in a fractured world and to redefine what we want normal to mean.

The pandemic has two salutary lessons for societies. First, it has reminded us who truly keeps society functioning: key workers. Health workers and care workers, shop workers and social workers, bus drivers, teachers, bank tellers, police officers, farmers, and cleaners. Society often takes these workers for granted, but without them, we would sink into chaos.

The second is that society and its systems are much more fragile than many of us appreciated. Some of the very best health systems have so far averted total collapse only through extreme emergency measures and heroic personal efforts, with ventilator shortages, crises over personal protective equipment, oxygen stockouts, and the pressure on the health workforce. Food systems have proven flimsy when faced with stockpiling and disruptions to just-in-time supply chains. Job markets have evaporated in a matter of weeks. The decline of the high street and a hollowing-out of city centres are accelerating. Fragility is not some special property of war-torn countries; it is here, among us all.

While many countries face a worsening epidemic, there is talk of recovery and what form it should take. If we are to learn from these lessons, we must make equity, resilience, and sustainability the priorities for our future.

The pandemic is amplifying inequalities. The direct health effects of COVID-19 differ by race, gender, wealth, and comorbidity. Disruptions to wider health services, such as routine vaccination and the prevention and treatment of non-communicable diseases, are likely to worsen existing health inequities. The effects on social determinants of health are devastating too. School and university education has stalled. Businesses have closed and 1·6 billion workers in the informal economy, many with no other means of support, are affected by COVID-19 restrictions. At least 70 million more people will be pushed into poverty because of the pandemic. John Alston, the outgoing UN Special Rapporteur on Extreme Poverty and Human Rights, argues that extreme poverty has been neglected and that we need to reconceive the relationship between growth and poverty elimination. Decreasing the Gini coefficient, a measure of equality, in each country by 1% per year could have a bigger impact on global poverty than increasing annual growth by 1 percentage point. Wealth redistribution, not growth alone, is essential.

To address the fragility in our systems, we need resilience: an ability to cope with stresses, shocks, and change. A resilient health system has effective responses to health emergencies. It has surge capacity. It has a commitment to quality improvement. It is flexible and can adapt. A resilient health system would not plan for an influenza pandemic and then follow that plan when a coronavirus outbreak occurs. Economic systems need to be resilient too. The focus of orthodox economics on efficiency needs to be reconsidered. Pandemics, climate disasters, and financial meltdowns might feel exceptional, but they are not unexpected. We ought to recalibrate our priorities towards resilience to have a chance of coping with them.

We need to focus on sustainability for health, society, and the planet. The idea of a Green New Deal, which links the climate agenda to economic justice and redistribution, and a green and healthy recovery from the pandemic, have been gaining political support, at least in rhetoric, but they will only scratch the surface of what is needed. The opportunity to sharply accelerate climate policy must be embraced.

The need to challenge society's normal obsessions—efficiency, consumption, and growth—is not a new idea, even to economists. But the health community has a renewed moral authority to call for this challenge. This will require a change of culture as well as a change of metrics. The individuals, institutions, organisations, and societies that have these obsessions at heart need to think again.

Normal will no longer do.

Great article.

It was an article from The Lancet and don't know why the link got moderated.

Likely not on our "list" of regular posting.

Vaccine or not

Here is a very good article - easy to understand with graphics - explaining the current status of vaccine development:

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus- … e-12030675

Of note is the rise in the cost of living.   As the peso devalues against the american dollar we see our costs rising.   

Rentals in US dollars are now relatively more expensive.

Imported good are now more expensive.

I am told the cost of construction is increasing.

All of this while many still are not working full time or not working at all. 

It's a sad situation and if course not just us in the DR, all over the world.

The world is struggling with covid19. In the Americas we are still in the first wave and most countries dont have a plan to control the virus.

In Europe a new wave is unfolding in Spain, Germany and France. In Asia new spikes are occurring in Vietnam, China , Hong Kong and Australia.

The message of how virulant and disruptive this virus can be with effect on living has not yet sunk in. Many people still refuse to adapt or accept it seriously.

If people dont adapt, economies and living will deteriorate. As expected it will take time for people to change their ways of living.

The beginnings of disorder are now being seen. Economic hardship brings that and states will find it hard to keep printing money.

It all comes back to human nature. Humanity will survive but at what price?

We are only six months in. The hope of an effective vaccine remains the focus rather than life change.

My life change is getting closer. My move to a new home in very rural DR is a few weeks away. That way I avoid the near hopelessness of town and city life as it struggles to find a way forward living with covid19. I can also still enjoy the DR that I prefer and love.

And crime is on the rise here. Stay safe!

New government is 16 days away and hopefully with new ideas to deal with covid19 which appears to be spiralling upwards nationally with little control.

https://listindiario.com/la-republica/2 … oronavirus

If it is just more protocols, which Dominicans seem to relax from after a few days, then the best advice is to have your own personal protocol to socially distance from risks to keep you free of the virus and all it's many and lasting health impacts.

Looks like a lot of blah blah blah!

I really do hope Abinader will get a proper handle on this.  Quite incredible that the country seems paralysed waiting for the new Gov to take over.  With positivity now so high, beds in hospitals just about at 100% surely this man will do something to surprise us all.

He literally can't for 15 more days

Abinader has certainly said the rights things as far as eliminating corruption and increasing transparency, time will tell if he will be much different from past regimes. As far as Covid is concerned what would he try that will be markedly different that other countries have done? He won’t have a miracle solution. Protocols that have been proven to be effective are in place and have been discussed endlessly.  Closing the borders certainly will contain the problem in DR but really can the infection rate get much worse? What is needed is discipline by the population at large to follow the rules and strict enforcement by the authorities.

I'm afraid your last sentence-that will not happen.

If we recall, Medina & Abinader announced they were 'harmonizing' their approach to dealing w/ the epidemic.

I do not feel Abinader is sitting patiently in the wings waiting for the 16th.
I think he's actively making decisions - and his puppet is Medina

What more can be done ?
Close the borders? No Abinader has stated he will support tourism.

The problem is the behavior of the general public - other countries suffer the same problem.
Resistance to masks.... lack of social distancing... grumbling about curfews

Very little anyone can do to resolve that

We all know about the USA & its resistance to some measures....
Read the UK papers -
they hate the lockdown/curfew, the masks, everything... and complain loudly.
They crowd the beaches every hot weekend...
Stores refuse to enforce masks - Not our job  - they say
Police & gov't are the enforcers

UK is every bit as bad as the USA in this regard

To live with this virus which seems to be the aim, something has to change.

You cannot keep seeing more and more of the population get sick to the point where businesses have to close because too many of the employees are sick. Add to that  the medical system stress and the effects could be devastating for DR if transmission continues as it is at present.

We are still in the adustment stage. The virus has not spread so widely in DR that it affects everyone. My estimate was upto 1% affected so I stick with that but when it starts creeping up people will take notice more. It is not going down nor will it flatten with the current approach.

A virulant virus will impact the tourism industry if not contained, so some new thinking on managing the tourist and the tourism product is inevitable and that may affect border control. Mobility is another big area for consideration. Much greater control would be a benefit and follows the thinking in other countries.

Emergency control was agreed at 45 days by both parties and things aren't going well two weeks in so don't be surprised if this gets extended along with curfew which is an effective tool.

The big challenge is how to get people to socially distance? Education should be on the agenda and so too enforcement.

It is a massive challenge but doing nothing is not an option. And being in government will bring urgency and responsibility.

For expats the advice is adapt to the new world. It is here for the long haul.

You're right about you're opening statement but wrong about the UK

70% according to You Gov support the Gov regarding face masks etc.

I've not heard anyone complaining even in areas like Leicester & Blackburn where local lock downs are prevalent.

You're right it's discipline.  I'm currently in France and every where I go people respect social distancing and everyone is wearing a mask in confined areas.  That is the point-until the locals in DR really accept these 2 points life will continue to be very difficult.  No matter what the Gov do, it must have the visible support of the the locals.  So I think it's a PR message hammered home.  Every country is different but one thing is common to all-DISCIPLINE

France has it's issues as well and not sure the discipline is as good as you say. Does not matter where you live, issues exist in all places.

Health authorities in France have confirmed a “marked increase” of 54% in the number of new coronavirus cases across the French mainland since last week.

The rise covered all age groups but the public health authority said the rise was particularly worrying in those aged between 20 and 30. There was also an increase in the number of patients admitted to hospital with Covid-19, and the figures for those requiring intensive care went up by one – the first time the figure has increased in 16 weeks.

As France prepared for a heatwave, people were being urged to keep their face coverings on despite the soaring temperatures, expected to reach 41C (106F) in some areas.

The number of new cases in the previous 24 hours was 1,377, only slightly fewer than the previous day, which was a record since May, and the number of clusters under investigation rose by 10 to 151. There were 16 deaths in hospital in the previous 24 hours, taking the total number of deaths in France attributed to coronavirus to 30,254.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ … -in-a-week

Something needs to be done and soon!  Continuing as we are is not an option!