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Anti Dominican Sentiment on this Forum

Last activity 17 August 2022 by WillieWeb

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Guest2022
It is clear to me that certain posters have anti Dominican agendas on this forum.

To them this is a banana republic and will be for ever. I am married to a Dominican and she just graduated last week and to me that it is demonstration this country is gradually going forward as the younger Dominicans begin to have a voice and forge a new future rather than the people being treated as political fodder.

Good news on many fronts is dismissed as more 'smoke and mirrors' and is liked by the moderator which tells us something of how she thinks.

Realism is now the wishy washy excuse given for this anti Dominican rhetoric and what the Dominican authorities and media reports hourly and daily is discarded because it's a Dominican source.

It is time to take time out whilst other members can decide if there is the anti-Dominican bias I am seeing.
planner
Just stop this please. I asked you nicely. EVERYONE is entitled do their opinions and you do NOT have to like them.

Reality is different for every single person. What it is for you is not what it is for everyone.

As a person who posts on here I too am entitled to my damn opinions!  I moderate based on the rules and I post based on my opinions!   

All of us see and understand that things are changing. Absolutely.  It is NOT all good however. Not everything here is  100%.  You however,  choose to believe that and that is YOUR OPINION! 
Karin1
Hi Lennoxnev

Congratulations to your wife.  I am a big believer in education and this is what is needed to improve the country, take it to the next level.  But this dream is far from reach for most Dominicans.   Like said here in the past,  a family might make alot of sacrifices to get one child a good education, and then the family relies on them and expects them to pay back.  Its tough to be in this kind of situation. 

Like all "social media" forms, you need to look at the credibility of the source and if there are motives.   I suspect what is said here on this forum,  is a reflection of someone's own experience, even if that reality is not the same as yours. 

If Dominicans do not like what is being said about them, they should take action to change those people, who are causing the problems in the first place.
Karin1
@planner

Like I said above:

I suspect what is said here on this forum,  is a reflection of someone's own experience, even if that reality is not the same as yours. 

I agree with you.

Everyone has a different experience, and a different life. The way to stop making so many anti-Dominican comments,  happens only if the bad experiences are few and far in between.  Seems to me they are very frequent.   You dig one up, and the more you find.
planner
Agreed. There is a lot of good here as well!  This has been stated by me and many others over and over!
DominicanadaMike
Like I always say...it depends.  I consider myself having some experience.  I am married to a Dominican, 17 years, I brought her to Canada where we lived for a little over 8 years.  Then we came back to the DR to live and be closer to her family.  She is one of 18 siblings, we have almost 100 nieces and nephews, including great nieces and nephews.  Consequently, we have many contacts in all different professions.  She has a wonderful family and not one of dollar wealth.  I have seen many things in this country and as I said consider myself with some experience.  Nothing here surprises me anymore, good or bad.  Everyone is entitled to their opinion and whenever I hear too much one-sided conversation, I try to jump in and balance it out so people can think about their own decisions and rationale and not just follow someone over the cliff... as I said, it depends.  Thinking for yourself in this country is mandatory.  If I didn't like it here, I wouldn't stay.  The fact that I do not follow the "politics" is my choice.  I walk my own path...

Enjoy your day people.  Time for a Margarita!
tommykair20

@planner  He is right tho, seens like if any other foreigner post anything they get a quick answer but i post a clear everyday need question and not even 1 answer 🤷‍♂️ "2 posted by me with a easy question"

alvareztraveling
There are people that are going to come on here and try to help, like you do lennox, and there are others that will vent. As this forum becomes larger you will get those types. I actually don't feel it's as bad as the other DR forum, much more helpful and professional on this site, so far. Hopefully you will keep posting and helping out the expats, your contribution is invaluable.

I myself have had a hard time looking for honest workers to get my project going, but that's in part because I don't have the budget to hire professionals, who are mostly booked by international multi-million dollar foreign funded projects. So I have to do like dominicans do and build traditional, in phases, and try and get as many references as possible, so that out of every 5 so called professional you talk to there are like 1 or 2 that actually know what they're doing.

So I understand how it can be frustrating for an expat from a developed country to deal with reality here. Coming here on vacation for a week or 2 does not reveal 10% of what life is actually like here. When you have to depend on getting that peso for food, housing, electricity, then and only then will you know what it is like to actually live here. It's dog eat dog, and there are people looking to grab an easy buck, but can you blame them?
Guest2022

You are right @alvareztravelling.


As a seasoned and travelled expat with experience of living in many countries for long periods and especially in the Caribbean, I have encountered a few types.

Let’s start by saying new expats want advice in all forms and imo that is the value and main purpose of forums such as the ones provided in several languages here for DR by expat.com.

DR has plenty of expats who have lived here for many years but there are different types as you will find in other countries.

There are expats who live in some resort towns in DR who still can’t speak Spanish and they have no wish to speak the local language nor mix with Dominicans. They have not travelled around the country, pay little interest to the local news and are content in their small world, mixing with other like expats. This is the most common type of expat you will find worldwide. The don’t much care for their new home and take pleasure in criticism and joking when the opportunity arises. Yet they want to present an image of know all.

There are the expats who are inquisitive by nature and want to engage and integrate in their chosen country. They yearn to travel around and research their new home. they want to share their gained knowledge of their new home and encourage wider understanding and reading. They have a broad base of local friends but avoid expat contact except for a few close friends.

There are those in between who have anxieties of travelling too far beyond what they know. The new expats. They are keen to understand more before step-by-step exploration. They are beginning to mix in with local activities and people and share experiences.

Then we have the locals who join such forums as DR1 with the motive of offering advice as and when they can. They see the criticism and joking about their country and people and as a friend just told me ‘I know I only smile and ignore’.

As an expat I feel duty bound to end my silence on the anti-Dominican agenda on this forum by a few. We all know that things aren’t perfect here and have not been so for decades, but we should try and understand the reasons why some things are so different here to what we have encountered living in developed western societies. DR too wants to go to that place.

I have deleted my account and the deletion is pending.

My reasons are explained in this thread.

WillieWeb
I am sorry to read the second last line you wrote.

Your view/opinion as stated in your post strikes me as very insightful...... and I agree with it.
Perhaps some here will try to see where they fit in that description.

We cannot and should not try to replicate other countries.

I hope you will reconsider your decision.....
planner
I also agree with your breakdown of the "types" of expats.  Pretty much matches my experience as well.

As I have stated we all have the right to our opinions.  Attacking others for stating their opinion is not acceptable from anyone here.

I hope you don't delete your account.  You offer valuable information. 
colmcb
@lennoxvev - I agree with the others that I hope you reconsider deleting your account. I enjoy reading your posts. I'm one of those "soon to be" expats who has travelled all over the DR for many years but understand that I still have so much to learn about the country, daily life, etc. I really like hearing different points of view. I dislike the disdain for the DR that I've seen from many people, although I really haven't noticed much of it on this forum. The other one is ripe with it and I always find myself scratching my head as to why people who seem to hate everything about the country, are living there! There are pros and cons to living anywhere in this world and if someone truly dislikes everything and has nothing nice to say about the DR, why on earth don't they move?? It boggles my mind, truly.
Taedyn Facts
@Lennoxvev take this post or majority of your  post for example they spark conversation. I enjoy to reading these post as a person that one day plans to buy a vacation home in the DR. I currently live in the CA, USA. I hope you don't delete your account bc they bring a lot of insight. I also appreciate when others make post giving their personal experiences of the country. Continue to provide us with the hopeful possibilities that the country is moving toward.
Karin1
@lennoxnev

Dear Lennoxnev

Please do not leave our forum.  If you want to take a break from here, that is fine, but come back, we need your guidance and your comments.  You represent a unique and valuable voice here.  Please reconsider.  If your feel the need to request changes to the rules, then please comment on that so your ideas can be considered and hopefully implemented.

Sincerely,

Karin
Guest2022

Folks,


I do appreciate your comments here in this thread and in PMs and by e-mail.

It is clear to me that I have struck a chord and there are many other members who do not enjoy the negative views on Dominicans and Dominican life from certain posters.

All nationalities have their positive and negative points and because this is a developing country, we should not think we are superior. We are guests and should respect our hosts and if we choose the criticize give a balanced opinion and tray and understand what is behind the topic of our criticism.
That brings me to a point which I feel strongly about as was indicated in my opening post and has irritated me for some time from a particular poster.

We have been told in no uncertain terms in a recent thread that the reporting of the actions of government bodies is ‘smoke and mirrors’ and then later post by that same person ‘probably all staged to make the police look like they are doing something’.

Now as readers of another anglophile forum will now know, there is a defamation law in this country Ley 6132 (https://www.ilo.org/dyn/natlex/docs/ELE … M83343.pdf) and the government is denying re-entry to certain expats who have been defaming the DR and its institutions on social media.

The Owner and his Mauritian moderators, who were active earlier today, on that particular thread should take note and take appropriate actions against this false narrative that the Dominican authorities and media are telling the Dominican people lies which is not backed up with facts.

That would be a good first step. Changes against false narrative with firm moderation rather than question the poster of real news would be welcome too.

I have deleted my account but it appears that expat.com has not actioned the deletion which remains pending.



DRCulture
@lennoxnev  I too hope you will remain. I joined in maybe January or so. I read some posts here and they scare me and cause a little apprehension and others that are so positive and warming. Yet others encourage balance in seeing both sides and all the in between. I’m thankful for all the posts because they challenge me to do research and to recognize all experiences are different as are beliefs and values. Buying a house in DR is WAAYY out of my comfort zone but I have done it and can hardly wait until it is ready. It is this forum helped me be patient with island time building.
Here’s hoping you stay. That’s my 2 cents worth.
WillieWeb
I think there are enough successful Police raids/captures of drug to show that this ain't smoke & mirrors nor staged events.

You pointed that out and were sharply criticized for it.
That was unfair.... you wrote not one malicious word ... just posted facts which the other poster cannot or did not do.
The pendulum swung too far ----- IMO ---- with bad results

Just my opinion which I am assured I can post
Karin1
Can someone please tell me who is in charge here on this site?   I know there are volunteers, and we thank them very much, but do the volunteers have permissions to remove posts or "enforce" rules?    WHERE ARE THE RULES POSTED?  If you want to object in private, where can you do it?    If someone is bothering you, can you do something about it other than not keep quiet.  Just wondering.
WillieWeb
Some people think to tourist visit number is inflated to aggrandize the current government

If that was the case, I think we would be hearing some screaming from the hoteliers

I agree the press.... USA included... can sensationalize the events.....but that's not 'staging or 'smoke & mirrors'


DR is easy to enter --  and even easier to leave...... from my standpoint
planner
@Karin1.  The rules are posted and you and all of us agreed to them when we joined. 

I am the unpaid, volunteer moderator and I follow the rules as well.

There are paid admin and moderators who also enforce the rules. 

Anyone can report a post and ask for a moderator to step in.
WillieWeb
It's not unusual on forums like this for the disgruntled to be more vociferous than those happier.
More visible

The happy ones might be found out enjoying themselves while those disgruntled are looking for places & ways to vent their frustrations ... perusing sites to air the complaints.

I try to avoid the negativity.... does little good... it hits you in the face

Just look at some of the questions here about safety.... what to worry about when moving here...
quite a few concerned people who have read the misleading ideas.

We that are comfortable... at peace with life here .... need to be more vocal.

Do you suppose that is why Lennox started this thread ?
To identify what he  (and others) consider a problem....
Only to be told to 'stand down'... 'back off'...

Is that good moderating ?
We can start a thread on that !!!
Moderating
What a sideshow that might be !!
planner
Anyone here can step up and moderate if and when the owners want or need it.

It is a completely thankless job and you are welcome to it! 

People by their nature complain, whine and vent 7 times more often then they acknowledge the good and praise.  Frankly this thread is all about that.

Have at it!
Bhavna
Hello everyone,

I am Bhavna, a member of the Expat.Com moderation team.

I have just stumbled across this thread and wishes to assure you that the DR forum apart from being one of the most active forums is also one of the least moderated forums.

This is so because we are fortunate enough to have volunteers and passionate members who are here, taking out of their free time to help members and making the forum lively and one of the best platforms on internet for sharing real life experiences.

I have read each of the comments and had a look at participants' posts, I can't see any moderation or censorship. There's a huge difference between a gentle reminder of what the chart allows to be posted and being moderated/censored.

The forum is the reflexion/ an image of what the members make of it.

If anyone feels left behind or unable to express themselves, We will be most happy to exchange a few words personally with you.

Have a nice Sunday,
Bhavna
2VPsoldier

@lennoxnev  - I have valued all sources of feedback here, especially many/most of yours with the insights and appraisals/perspectives you provide. To loose your knowledge and inputs on here would, for many  definitely be missed. Your insights are more valued than the few negatives you may receive. Perhaps a time out, a Planner did for a while, is warranted - but please, do not delete us forever. I look forward to finish building my house, buying a verhicle and travelling to see not just the island, but meet Expats that I only converse with on here. As I return to Canada on 26 Aug with perhaps 10 more months of working to achieve my goals, I will hope to read more diverse comments from savy Expats such as you.....cheers

Guest2022

Most of us sign up to social media platforms such as expat.com to be contributors and have to abide by the terms and conditions laid down by the portal management. Those of you who choose to commit your time to moderating can of course make that choice and we don’t doubt it can be a thankless task.

But you can be both.

If you are a moderator and want to contribute to threads as you will, you need to take off your moderator’s armour and be like all of us contributors and be subject to the same standards and rules.

You cannot hide behind the moderator’s armour wanting to project your opinion over and above others.

There have been cases whereby you were called to account by other members for doing just this and you don't like it.

As an example, in my case, I found it anti Dominican that, because of your negative personal opinion of cock fighting, the second most popular hobby in the Dominican Republic and part of the culture, a thread that interested others was shut down. You used your moderator’s position to silence discussion rather than let the matter be discussed and stay out of it.

I have now been publicly criticized by you at the beginning of this thread and in post #27 in the War against Drugs thread for calling out post #22 of that same thread which was defamatory and joking with emojis in nature against government personnel in the preceding reporting of an official government agency and local media which is contrary to Dominican laws and the forum terms and conditions. And yet you liked that post and re-affirmed your opinion in the above-mentioned post.

It is a fact that the same poster that posted the above has trolled me for years with negative commentary against matters Dominican that I have posted over time and I have not been protected by moderation. Go look at his two pointless off topic posts in the ‘beer’ thread. I have ignored responding to his commentary for long enough but the defamatory anti Dominican rhetoric in the War on Drugs thread ‘broke the camel’s back’ so to speak, and the fact that two days later expat.com have not deleted these posts gives me zero confidence about making any further contributions until this scourge against Dominicans and DR is dealt with.

To conclude, be a moderator applying the owner’s terms and conditions and be respected, but be a contributor and hide behind your moderator armour to enforce your opinions and not get equal moderation to the rest of us and you lose that respect.

WillieWeb
I can only speak for myself but I see your point and agree.

Personally, I have never seen a moderator make so many 'personal' posts.... anywhere.
If that is 'expats' idea of moderating... so be it.

Moderators need to maintain a certain 'distance' in order to be objective.....again, just my opinion
Julien
Can someone please tell me who is in charge here on this site?   I know there are volunteers, and we thank them very much, but do the volunteers have permissions to remove posts or "enforce" rules?    WHERE ARE THE RULES POSTED?  If you want to object in private, where can you do it?    If someone is bothering you, can you do something about it other than not keep quiet.  Just wondering.
- @Karin1

Karin1, in case you need me, I am never too far. I am the founder of expat.com (17+ years of passionate work, with ups and downs). I've been living abroad for 19 years now, in Spain (Barcelona / Madrid), London, and I am now living in Mauritius where I settled down in 2007.

We would never have been able to run this platform without the help of many, many volunteers and members who are contributing everyday. I will never thank them enough for all their help and support.

our rules are here: terms and conditions and here: DR Forum code of conduct

Lennox I read your PM the day you contacted me (like 10 minutes after you sent it), I wrote you a long reply from my mobile, but you never received it because I wasn't at home, lost the connection .. and the message I typed. Quite frustrating. I will send you a message later today or tomorrow (depends on the kids)

Take care everyone,

Julien


Guest2022
Thank you for moderating and removing subsequent posts against Dominican government authorities reporting in the War on Drugs thread.  A good start.
Bhavna
Hello everyone,

Trust you are well !

I think that this all started because of a huge misunderstanding. We have taken some actions and rest assured everyone is most welcome to express himself/herself on the forum.

We invite members to contact us in private so that we can have a conversation about what can be improved.

@ Lennoxnev, Since this issue has been sorted out, could we please close this tread ?

Regards,
Have a beautiful day,
Bhavna
Guest2022
Bahvna,

I am not a moderator but I do think you should let this thread run its course for a further day at least, because I has brought certain issues that need moderating in accordance with the rules and condition of use (which should be read and not speculated as to what they say) to the fore and the importance of respecting Dominicans and their laws.

Better let the community decide.

The poster that has trolled (harassed) me wrote in post #17 pf the Homicide thread  ‘Who wants to read about the boring average everyday life?’

He is entitled to his opinions about Dominican life but not all contributors think likewise.

I personally think Dominican life is far from boring and rather the contrary.

I think Dominican life is colourful and vibrant and always throwing up interesting stories daily. IMO, it is not boring like in places from where we have come. It should be understood and appreciated and you can’t do that stuck in a small part of DR.

I wouldnt be living here if I thought Dominican life was boring.

Get out, read, investigate and see real DR life and adapt is my suggestion. I don’t think I am alone from comments received and perhaps more comment on his statement here to clear the air more.

The good thing about the Dominican press of recent and especially since the new government has come to power is that they have encouraged transparency and the press is reporting all manner of interesting news, and the media is open and people can upload videos and vent on issues.

The other anglophile media in DR focuses on the news on DR more and more and reports far more than has ever appeared here on expat.com and now is moderated strictly to keep threads on track. Anti-Dominican sentiment has declined being moderated out. expat.com is behind the curve on this and a quick review of the last 50 threads show there are few specifically about news so I don't understand the griping.

Here other posters have complained we are too negative. We should all take note. We can’t ignore the negative but action is being taken we should understand its roots and try and strike a balance.
planner
Unfortunately we will no longer allow threads to be posted about politics, religion, drugs or prostitution.

While we have been given a lot of leniancy in the past we have lost that ability now.

That decision was made by paid moderators and I will enforce it.

This thread needs to be closed.
ddmcghee
Where are the rules posted that govern what can be discussed on the forum? I’ve searched and haven’t found it.

I’m wondering how those 4 items (politics, religion, drugs, and prostitution) are defined. Are we allowed to express opinion on anything government related because that is “politics”? Can we discuss holidays if they are based on “religion”? This country has an official religion, so it’s ingrained in the culture. Does “drugs” cover the frequent questions about availability of medication since some are illegal here?

I’ve found Terms and Conditions and posts on how to use the forum, but nothing that states what can and cannot be discussed. I think a link to those rules would be helpful for all of us.
planner
It was clearly posted in the  Dominican Republic Forum Code of conduct and that also refers back to Terms of Service as well.

Here is the paragraph on  what is allowed:

The entire concept of this forum is to promote the free exchange of information and ideas. Therefore, everyone has a fundamental right to form and express their own opinions, provided that they comply with the terms of use of the website. However, it is not acceptable to criticize or abuse another member in any way for simply expressing their opinion or making a personal observation. If you find the opinion expressed offensive you should not take matters into your own hands nor should you make any abusive comments: please use the Report button so that we manage the issue.
The Expat.com forum is dedicated to expat related matters. Topics related to politics or religion won't be accepted.
The moderation team reserves the right to intervene if necessary.
Guest2022
This is absolute nonsense.

We are being moderated locally like children by the rules set locally and not the rules of the Owner.

Any person can read the terms and conditions laid down below on this site and as links posted yesterday by the Owner.

For those that are too busy to look them up the following is not allowed:

•    Defamation, abusive, harassing, threatening, hate, or discriminatory statements, or anti-human rights propaganda, such as homophobic or racist comments.
•    Any unlawful or inappropriate material or information, including but not limited to violent, nude, partially nude, hateful, pornographic, including child pornographic materials or any other photos which are otherwise unlawful via the service.
•    Downloading or transferring files containing software or other material which is protected by intellectual property laws (or the rights to privacy or protection of confidential information unless you are the owner or you have the rights, or have received the required consent).
•    Downloading or transferring files containing viruses, corrupted files, or other software or programs that may damage or prevent the use of another computer.
•    Deleting any author credit, legal notice, property designation or label from any file that is uploaded to the server.
•    Falsifying the origin or source of software or other material contained in a file uploaded to the server.
•    Offers of services, even for free, ads, polls, contests or chain letters.
•    Downloading any file uploaded by another forum user knowing or ought to have known is illegal or is in breach of the rights of another person.
•    Use of any communication or content or other information obtained by the Expat.com website in a competitive manner against Expat.com's activities.

My issue has been defamation and harassment

Enough said but note, today is a religious day of importance, Coronation of the Virgin,  with an interesting twist in DR and good editorial read in el Caribe, and the national flag has the bible on it and the people are religious if you get out and about. But maybe this will be deleted under the new local rules.
Karin1
@Julien

Dear Julien

This is a surprise, and thank you for taking the time to respond to me directly.  I am very fond of this place and of the people here too (even when we dont agree, and this is what makes it better too).  The more we ask, the more we learn!  Thank you for setting this up for us.
And thank you for clarifying where the rules are, its not obvious.

Karin
Karin1
@lennoxnev

Dear Lennoxnev

There are alot of holidays here in DR and I hope to learn all about them.  Coronation of the Virgin, never heard of that.  I have a friend from India and they too have many different kinds of celebrations, alot more than we do in Canada.  Always a reason to celebrate.  Love it.

K
Karin1
@Bhavna

Hi and nice meeting you.

Please do not delete this thread, its interesting and what rules have been broken?

I have another question:  How do we contact you or "the team"  in private if we have a concern?  Can you be specific?
The problem is that days or months may go by and then I have a question and then I forget how to find you.  I cannot add you to my contacts, there is no way to do that seems obvious to me (no request button).

Thank you!
Karin
WillieWeb
How about a 'Feel Good' here to change the mood ??
DR is a nice place to live.....
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

My fridge of 6yrs or so has decided to cool when it wants...... not when I want
Freezer?... no problem
I asked around and thought an Inverter type would be good..... LG & Samsung have 10 yr guarantees
Normally, I endorse importing major appliances but this 10yr deal got me
Plus, I was assured by people here that it was cheaper..... it was !!
Went to Nagua today - L&R....
Samsung was on sale... 100K DOP
Talked them down to 95 then they asked for 93 if I paid cash !!!
Not a chance !!!
The one (of two) on the floor had a small ding on it.... so small they tried to remove it by rubbing their thumb on it
I had to teach them about 'scratch & dent' pricing...... 90 now
OK - 90... with free delivery
Mine is kaput.... so delivery is important..... before noon tomorrow, they promise
I go to the car 'Snap a Cap of Red Cap' in celebration....
A man runs out .... can't deliver tomorrow, it's a holiday..... will this afternoon be OK ??
OK OK OK..... yes .....
What a morning.....
Had I not scraped my car on the way home.... it would have been perfect !!!
Guest2022
@lennoxnev

Dear Lennoxnev

There are alot of holidays here in DR and I hope to learn all about them.  Coronation of the Virgin, never heard of that.  I have a friend from India and they too have many different kinds of celebrations, alot more than we do in Canada.  Always a reason to celebrate.  Love it.

K
- @Karin1

Karen there is  wealth of articles and pictures of thousands of Dominican catholics attending ceremonies in the National Stadium today.  There were events in Higuey yesterday including the delivery of 222 bulls to the basilica.  I dont know the reasoning but it was a most interesting spectical of Dominican religous culture.

It is in all media today.  Try googling listindiario for a snapshot of events that we should try and appreciate and not ban.
Karin1
@WillieWeb

Good one.  Sorry about the ding to your car.  You got a dinged Samsung fridge for $90k pesos, with delivery includled?  I wanna bring you shopping with me next time I need something big.1f601.svg

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